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15726 Views 40 Replies Latest reply: Nov 4, 2010 7:24 AM by Ultron RSS
Trancegodz Just Startin' 2 posts since
Jul 10, 2009
Currently Being Moderated

Jul 14, 2009 12:05 AM

Ideas for the next M13 update

I just bought an M13 and had it updated to 1.07 at the music store before I purchased it.

At first I wasn't real impressed with some of the factory patches but found I was easily able to change them to some really great sounding patches in most cases.

 

I bought the M13 as a portable light weight live unit, to replace my large studio pedalboard and rack gear which weighs a lot.

 

Here are some of the things I discovered that I think could be improved upon in future updates:

 

It says in the manual "loops play back in mono even if you are running stereo effects".

1. It would be great to have true stereo loops. It would be a good idea for you guys to take a look at all the features that were available on the old Gibson Echoplex Digital Pro Plus. Loop IV, and consider adding them to your looper but in stereo.

 

Unless I am missing something, there doesn't seem to be a way to hit one button and immediately erase a loop. You can stop it but it is still there. You can hit play once and it will play through and  erase after 30 seconds.

2. You should be able to easily immediately erase a loop somehow.

 

To my ears the reverb sounds are not that good. I have been using a TC Nova Reverb with much better sounds to me.

3. Better sounding stereo reverbs.

 

I was surprised to discover that the M13 did not have a whammy pedal in it. It seems that almost every multi-effects pedal on the market has a whammy of some sort included.

4. Add a whammy pedal.

 

I was also surprised that the M13 did not have a clean octave pedal in it.

5. Add a clean octave pedal that can go up an octave, down an octave, up two octaves, or down 2 octaves, or down one octave and up one octave, and the ability to use an expression pedal with this patch, which would in effect give you a whammy pedal.

 

You can only use 4 effects at one time. One per row. So if you want to do something like run the tube comp, into a tube screamer, into a tube driver, into an octave fuzz, you have no effects left you can use, You can't add anything else like chorus, or delay, etc.

6. So the ability to use up to 12 effects at once, would be great, since there are 12 buttons.

 

7. I tried using a Korg EXP-2 extenison pedal and it didn't work at all. I am guessing you have to buy a line 6 pedal for it to work.

 

I was also surprised there wasn't an EQ pedal. It would be great to have a 4 band parametric eq, and a 6 band Boss type eq available.

8. Add an EQ pedal.

 

The majority of the pedals in the M13 are mono. It would be nice to have more stereo effects.

9. More stereo effects.

 

10. A delay set up like the new TC Repeater.

 

I use an Eric Johnson Stratocaster into two Vox Ac 30 top boost amps. When going through the M13, even with all the pedals turned off it changes the sound I am use to hearing. All of the sparkle is gone. Like putting you hands over your ears. All of the multi-effects units I have tried so far have the same problem.  Plug your guitar straight into the M13 and turn off all the effects and listen to the sound of your amp. Then unlpug your guitar and plug it straight into a good sounding clean tube amp and you will hear what I am talking about. I was able to correct it for the most part by adding a demeter compressor after my guitar and in front of the M13, but I don't want to have to carry any extra pedals.

11. Make it so your guitar and amp sound are not degraded at all.

 

When you are recording with the 1.07 version looper and hit the reverse or 1/2 speed functions, the looper automatically takes you out of record mode and puts you into play mode. I don't like that at all.

12. Make it so the looper only goes out of record when you want it to, by hitting the play button. or give us the option to choose how we want the pedals to function on the looper.

 

13. Make it so you can assign the effects loop to be turned on or off for each different scene, or globally.

 

These next two ideas couldn't be done in an update, but are ideas for the next Pro generation of the M13:

 

14. For the next Pro generation of the M13. Add a USB port.

 

15. For the next Pro generation of the M13 add two expression pedals to it

 

From all the suggestions I made it might sound like I really hate the M13, but I don't. I like it and there are some great sounds in it.

In fact I found some unique sounds that are possible on the M13.


I noticed from browsing different forums that the people at line 6 really seem top take notice and listen to any good ideas that their customers have.

I think a lot of the ideas I suggested might be easily done, and make the M13 even better.

 

Are they already working on a new update beyond 1.07? if so. when might this be out?

 

Are they planning on coming out with a whole new Pro or Plus version of the M13? if so, when?

 

All the very best!

Terry

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


.

  • artsoul Just Startin' 7 posts since
    May 6, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 11, 2009 2:58 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    to stop a loop just hit the play button again then just rerecord the loop---easy (I'll admit that it took me a little headscratching)

     

     

    You can copy complete scenes i do it all the time -- have you the advanced manual its a free download

  • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
    Jan 25, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 11, 2009 1:47 PM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    Wow, that's a pretty comprehensive list.  I'd guess that about half of those are simply technically infeasible to be handled in a firmware update.  For example, I'm sure there's simply not the processing power to have 12 simultaneous effects, and I would imagine that in order to have true stereo looping capability would mean the available recording time would decrease.  Also, I wonder why you use the "shocked" to describe some of your reactions.  I knew every effect that was on the M13 before I bought it because I did research.  It basically was meant to be include all the effects from the 4-button stomp series and the Verbzilla.  That's why I don't expect huge deviations from the effects that are there.  I could see them add a few wahs from the PODs series, but other than that, I'd bet that Line 6 will be reluctant to have the effects on the M13 be that different from the 4-button stomps.

     

    Also, I think the reverbs are fine for what they are.  The spring reverbs sound great, and the Octoverb is simply awesome.  I also have a TC Electronic Nova System, and while the reverbs on that do offer a lot more in the way tweaking, the overall sound quality between the two units is similar.  As far as the tone degradation thing, I'd have to disagree with you.  I've used mine (with other pedals) with a Vox AC15CC, a Spider Valve 212, and a Blackstar HT-5 and I can honestly say there's little to no difference in the tone with it.  It's certainly not any worse than any other effects pedal would be.

  • Line6Andy Line 6 4,345 posts since
    Jun 5, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 13, 2009 10:10 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    This a a great list to send to the feature requests link, which is found here:

     

    Feature requests

    http://line6.com/company/contact/productFeedback/?topic_id=3

     

  • esp5150 Just Startin' 4 posts since
    Mar 11, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 3, 2010 10:55 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    I think there are a few more updates needed for the M13.

    First off, the tone change when activated needs to be addressed. I use mine through the efects loop in a heavily modded 5150.  Yes I know the loop on these amps is not the best, but I have tried other FX units and even stompboxes, and only the m13 changes the tone when the loop is on. (loss of bottom mostly)

    Next, we need a few more distortions and overdrives. To name a few, the Marshall Guv'nor, a modded Boss DS-1,  an MXR distortion III, and maybe even the horrible but somehow awesome Boss HM-2 heavy metal pedal.  You can actually use this pedal as a preamp, and when done correctly, sounds pretty damn good.  Thus the need for more overdrives and distortions.

     

    Another great feature would be the  DF-2 Feedbacker pedal that Boss made in the 80's and 90's.  This would give people even more ways to make wacky sounds and give solos that extra feel.

     

    Last, I really think that there should be a function for "all fx off".  Some amps dont have a footswitch activated fx loop and this would make things so much easier when trying to turn multiple fx on and off with one switch.  My suggestion is to use the tap tempo button that could be used as "FX ON/OFF" or "tap tempo" and user selected through the setup page..

     

    My 2 cents,

    Mike Smith

    • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
      Jan 25, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Mar 3, 2010 11:00 AM (in response to esp5150)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      You can turn all the effects within a scene off by stepping on the switch for that scene when you're in latch mode.  If you're in the scene already, this means you have to hit the "scene" switch first to get to the scene selection screen, but still that's not that big of a deal to anticipate while playing.

       

      I wouldn't expect Line 6 to change the functionality of buttons that are already labeled something.  They seem very hesitant to do that with their products, for whatever reason.

    • Karl_Houseknecht Expert Line 6 User 3,732 posts since
      Jan 25, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Mar 3, 2010 11:54 AM (in response to esp5150)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      esp5150 wrote:


      First off, the tone change when activated needs to be addressed. I use mine through the efects loop in a heavily modded 5150.  Yes I know the loop on these amps is not the best, but I have tried other FX units and even stompboxes, and only the m13 changes the tone when the loop is on. (loss of bottom mostly)

       

      How do you have your M13 configured?  DSP bypass or true bypass?

    • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
      Jan 25, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Mar 3, 2010 12:05 PM (in response to esp5150)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      Regarding the whole "tone loss" thing, I have to say that I don't hear that at all.  I run my M13 in my Egnater Renegade's loop, and I can turn the loop on and off with the amp's footswitch.  I don't hear a difference with having the M13 bypassed or just turning off the loop.  Sometimes amps have buffers in the loops that can actually cause these types of issues, especially since the M13 is really designed to run at instrument level rather than line level.

  • esp5150 Just Startin' 4 posts since
    Mar 11, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 3, 2010 12:22 PM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    I have the M13 running all the reverbs delays and modualtions through the FX loop.  I can turn on the amps FX loop with all M13 FX bypassed in either true bypass or DSP and the tone will be unaffected.  Once I turn on one of the FX on the M13, mainly delays or reverbs, then the tone will sound a little compressed and have a slight loss of low frequencies  (I know you can adjust the tone of reverbs and delays also).  It's worse at low volumes then at high volumes, but overall has nothing to do with the amps FX loop.  I can run my Eventide or my Rocktron Intellifex through the FX loop and there is no tone change, and they are both instrument level and not line level. Its not a volume thing as much as a lack of low end and compression.  It may be that I have an issue with mine and need to update the firmware on it (which I am doing later today anyway).  As far as the "FX ON/OFF" thing is concerned,  I just thought it would be less tap dancing and am aware of pressing the same button in the scenes menu.  I'll probably just end up getting an FX loop switcher and call it a day, since my Laney GH100l is the only amp that doesnt have a FX loop on off switch.

    I plan on making a Youtube video of my modded 5150, so I'll show the tone change in the video also.

     

    Thanks Guys

  • Lazarus101 Just Startin' 2 posts since
    Jun 27, 2010
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 27, 2010 9:08 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    I'm going to be purchasing an M13 tomorrow and as far as i can see with the latest update it has nearly everything i want apart from one thing which would be an acoustic modeller. Would this be possible??

  • withlin Just Startin' 56 posts since
    Jan 3, 2008
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 27, 2010 6:22 PM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    You need to have it updated to 2.01, not 1.07. The Whammy and EQ pedals are in the 2.01 update.

  • maestroj Just Startin' 31 posts since
    Feb 8, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 28, 2010 2:14 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    About the reverb qualities, i can only say this. In the past i had a tc- electronic rack unit and the sounds of reverbs sounded colder in the tc then in the m13. Concerning warmth and feel about the sounds , i would rate M13 above the tc. But that s a personal opinion.

  • sandro Just Startin' 7 posts since
    Apr 2, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 28, 2010 7:58 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    Would like to have some more chorus models and maybe an auto-wha model.

    • jlynnb1 Just Startin' 7 posts since
      Jan 26, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Jun 28, 2010 9:46 AM (in response to sandro)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      yeah, the Tron Up is an auto-wah.

      • parirami Just Startin' 72 posts since
        Dec 14, 2009
        Currently Being Moderated
        Jul 8, 2010 9:18 PM (in response to jlynnb1)
        Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

        It's been a while since the last update --- is there any news?

        • sandro Just Startin' 7 posts since
          Apr 2, 2007
          Currently Being Moderated
          Jul 9, 2010 12:42 AM (in response to parirami)
          Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

          Yes, I really think it's time for an update.

          • parirami Just Startin' 72 posts since
            Dec 14, 2009
            Currently Being Moderated
            Jul 20, 2010 1:53 PM (in response to sandro)
            Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

            Yes sirs! It's been a long long while. What ever happened to the features we've requested? I'd be fine hearing something even as mundane as a teaser - or a ranking of the top 50 features requested.

             

            Because I'm a marketing guy here's a creative brief for a campaign that will benefit both the company and us users:

             

            • Line6 to Create a social media angle to explore user preference via poll
            • Publish the shortlisted feature list online preferably facebook/twitter and this forum
            • Let your M13/M9 vote on it - top ones get to be the priority for subsequent releases!
            • To guard against tough expectations, pre-screen the choices to the ones easiest to implement
              and/or ready to launch given your internal targets.
            • Maintain buzz by announcing bits and pieces of the upgrade online. Silence,
              is wasted opportunity.
            • Maybe your marketing guys and I could talk... I got into Cannes you know. =) LOL (What a shameless plug of myself).

             

            Good and controlled Rumors are good for business!

             

            What's the insight? We're itching for it but we're pretty easy to please - even just a tease. Let's reward the customer loyalty

            and I can bet at least half of the M13 users will recommend it within that week of announcement. Expect forums all over the

            net to be on fire if you announce it this way!

  • bigjohnny69 Just Startin' 19 posts since
    Mar 20, 2010
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 28, 2010 8:31 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    I agree with the aforesaid, as regards the auto-wah. My previous "pedalboard" was the Line 6 pod x-3, so i have no global experience. However, my m-13 soounds very good, even if i connect it directly to my sound card (saffire by focusrite), especially regarding its "ambient" sounds.I believe that an auto-wah, that can be controlled through the tap-tempo button would be very nice and usefull.

    Regards to all   

  • x-man Just Startin' 36 posts since
    Jun 4, 2008
    Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 27, 2010 2:28 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    Yes, I think it's time for a new update.

     

    Nine months have passed since the last firmware update and there were many ideas in the meantime.

     

    Let's go Line6 !

    • lenoir Just Startin' 30 posts since
      Jun 23, 2008
      Currently Being Moderated
      Jul 27, 2010 10:38 AM (in response to x-man)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      Many ideas, for sure. But also many bugs that need to be fixed...

      • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
        Jan 25, 2007
        Currently Being Moderated
        Jul 27, 2010 10:59 AM (in response to lenoir)
        Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

        What bugs do you have in mind?  There are a few relatively minor ones I can think of offhand (like the jumpiness of the MIDI sync), but what else are you thinking of?  I just don't think I would say there are "many" bugs that need corrected.

        • lenoir Just Startin' 30 posts since
          Jun 23, 2008
          Currently Being Moderated
          Jul 27, 2010 1:49 PM (in response to phil_m)
          Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

          There's MIDI sync, of course, and also various MIDI lags like when controlling more than one FX with CC1 or CC2... but I remember you don't consider these as very important, so I won't continue on the MIDI subject and just talk instead about modulation and delay FXs that need to be normalised because of volume change problems. There's also a problem with pitch tracking FXs and active pickups. And certainly a couple more that I don't know about or remember of 'cause I'm not concerned by them. These bugs are minor ones (or not, depends on what side of the fence you stand) but they still are "many" and need to be fixed. Or not, but that's another story...

          • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
            Jan 25, 2007
            Currently Being Moderated
            Jul 27, 2010 2:02 PM (in response to lenoir)
            Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

            I wasn't trying to minimize anything.  I just couldn't remember seeing a lot of complaints about different things.  I happen to agree with you that those things should be fixed.

             

            As I think about it more, the one bug I would consider the most important is the whole issue of some modulation and delay effects boosting the volume.  To me that's something that should have been fixed a while ago.  It's not like a dealbreaker,  but there are times when it is annoying.

             

            All I meant by saying there weren't many is that when you look at all the features compared to the bugs, it seems like the M13/M9 line isn't doing too poorly.

            • parirami Just Startin' 72 posts since
              Dec 14, 2009
              Currently Being Moderated
              Jul 28, 2010 1:15 AM (in response to phil_m)
              Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

              Yes that volume leveling is very important - i encounter that alot when in latch mode and I switch between cleans, delay settings and solo settings.
              the volume drop on cleans without delay is apparent (like an illussion) because my delay settings have a higher volume.

               

              I seem to hear less sparkles on the fuzz pi too vs. the original. Feature requests, bugs & such updates need to be ranked and prioritized.

               

              This is why I'm suggesting a social media approach to polling/online survey based on shortlisted items that line6 selected.

  • horbag Just Startin' 26 posts since
    Jul 17, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 5, 2010 3:41 PM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    put a route 66 overdrive on the next update. what do you think????

    • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
      Jan 25, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Aug 6, 2010 5:29 AM (in response to horbag)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      Well, the overdrive portion of the Route 66 is really just a TS808 clone with the addition of a bass boost switch.  Visual Sound pretty much says this on their website.  The TS808 is already modeled, so I guess I wonder if it would be worth having two models that are so similar.  I guess that the somewhat tricky thing when it comes to overdrives and distortions.  So many of them are based on just a handful of classic circuits that it really gets into nuance when you have them side-by-side.  I think from Line 6's perspective, they want to offer a full spectrum of effects.  I'd rather have them invest in things that are missing completely or adding more functionality to existing effects.

  • sandro Just Startin' 7 posts since
    Apr 2, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 6, 2010 6:58 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    Well, Line6!! Now we are waiting for the next update! I hope it's coming soon!

  • rschua7 Just Startin' 5 posts since
    May 21, 2010
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 6, 2010 7:41 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    I wish M9/M13 will have the ff:

     

    1. Acoustic simulator

    2. Global EQ

    3. Model Packs

  • x-man Just Startin' 36 posts since
    Jun 4, 2008
    Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 7, 2010 7:35 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    Any (good) news about next M13 firmware update ?

    • sandro Just Startin' 7 posts since
      Apr 2, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Sep 7, 2010 7:39 AM (in response to x-man)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      No good news...

      • howdthattaste Just Startin' 48 posts since
        Jan 10, 2008
        Currently Being Moderated
        Sep 7, 2010 11:57 PM (in response to sandro)
        Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

        i read this thread about every 2 months hoping for some breaking news. Meanwhile, some other people made some nice suggestions that there should be some type of list or poll regarding our requests for the next firmware update. We'll here is a wiki i created that will hopefully keep our thoughts and ideas organized as well as let L6 see what we've been thinking:

         

        http://m9m13update.wikispaces.com/

         

        this is a public page, no log in required, anyone just hit "Edit" (read the guidelines, etc) and add your ideas! Once we have enough content, I can add some fancy polls, surveys. Forgive me if L6 already have public domain article or wiki, but i didn't find one.  anyway, i hope you guys use it.

  • corne Just Startin' 25 posts since
    Feb 1, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 8, 2010 12:51 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    Hi y'all,

     

    I would say that getting feature updates is merely a privilege other than a right, right? I was very happy with the M13 when I bought it, and I was very thankful for the last major update which brought us even more value for money with the free great extra's.

     

    So I guess I'm just a happy camper with the great stuff I've purchased. Not expecting anything from Line6 other than that I'm sure they've got the best team to keep making the good stuff for us.

     

    Have a nice day,

    Corné.

    • jonahsprout Just Startin' 50 posts since
      Jul 15, 2009
      Currently Being Moderated
      Sep 24, 2010 5:10 AM (in response to corne)
      Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

      I'm super happy with the m13, but line6 has to come out with either updated firmware or the m13 mk2 eventually.

       

      As far as effects go in order of importance something like the HOG and POG, reverse reverb, delay with hold, the Dr. Distorto models and a bitcrusher. I think most distortions need a blend option too. I'd be great to see more Line6 original creations too they have always been good and fun, but I haven't seen any in a long time.

       

      What I would most like to see is more flexible effects routing. Hide it somewhere if you don't want to scare people. Having the option to be more creative with the way effects run would add so many more sound possibilities without having to actually add models.

       

      From a design point of view I would like to see line6 focus on making the next model upgradable, bring back the model pack idea and make regular updates. I won't be buying a new piece of digital gear otherwise. This isn't because of any failure of the m13 I just tired of the planned obsolescence in digital gear.

      • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
        Jan 25, 2007
        Currently Being Moderated
        Sep 24, 2010 5:34 AM (in response to jonahsprout)
        Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

        I don't understand how your comment about planned obsolescence applies to the M13.  The M13 is upgradeable.  Of course there are hardware and processing limitations, and that will always be the case with digital effects.  When companies design these effects they have to do so with a cost in mind, and they do make decisions that will limit them down the road.  I guess I don't see that so much as planned obsolescence as much as just the way the market works.  As time progresses and more processing power and memory are available for less money, newer products will inevitably be able to pack more features in for a lower price.

        • jonahsprout Just Startin' 50 posts since
          Jul 15, 2009
          Currently Being Moderated
          Sep 24, 2010 6:03 AM (in response to phil_m)
          Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

          Yeah, you're right it doesn't really apply to the m13. I love how affordable and powerful digital gear is, but I've just been feeling down about it lately. I think the POD updates got me thinking about it and the fact that I recently was forced to sell a piece of "vintage" music equipment. It was sorta nice to have something that was older than me and stil be worth something, you know?

          • phil_m Expert Line 6 User 4,243 posts since
            Jan 25, 2007
            Currently Being Moderated
            Sep 24, 2010 6:11 AM (in response to jonahsprout)
            Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

            Well, yeah, I understand you there.  But, on the other hand, one of the main reasons, if not the main reason, vintage gear is still worth something is simply that it's rare.  It was generally more expensive when it was made, and fewer people could afford it.  So that means there's simply less of it around.  Digital gear (and, really most modern guitar gear, in general) is more affordable and accessible to a lot more people.  So the market is more saturated, and depreciation is a lot more pronounced.  It's just the double-edged nature of supply and demand, I suppose.

  • Ultron Just Startin' 6 posts since
    Jul 24, 2008
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 4, 2010 7:24 AM (in response to Trancegodz)
    Re: Ideas for the next M13 update

    NECRO-BUMP

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