May 22, 2009 7:46 AM
Help me pick a good distortion pedal
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I know, some of you probably think I'm nuts haivng all the SV amp models available and still wanting pedals. Well, maybe I am. But the bottom line is that the SV provides great base amp sounds. And some of them sound fantastic with external drive pedals. The MXR GT-OD that I just bought is outstanding with the SV. Sounds like a plexi in a little metal box and completely overcomes the shortcoming of the internal stomp effect.
So now that I've got that plexi overdrive sound, what I'm looking for is a distortion pedal that will get me a JCM-800 in a box. I'm trying to keep the form factor at the compact pedal level or smaller due to space restrictions on the board that I have planned. I've looked at, but have not tried, the following:
Any others that I might be missing?
For those interested, and for compatibility assessment with the above pedals, the remainder of my board is pretty well picked out:
Try the OCD. I have it and like it.
Daniel-Ganfield wrote:
Try the OCD. I have it and like it.
Do you consider that a distortion or an overdrive? I do have that one on my list to try. Obviously I'm looking for something a little more saturated than an overdrive and for use with higher gain hard rock rhythms and leads. It also wouldn't hurt if it played well using an overdrive before it.
They may be too large for what you're looking for, but the Satchurator is probably worth a listen, along with the Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Mayhem.
Cheers,
Fester2k
fester2000 wrote:
They may be too large for what you're looking for, but the Satchurator is probably worth a listen
Yep, the form factor on that and the Twin Tube are a little large for my needs. And what I've heard of the Satchurator online and from reviews is that it is really shrill if you put the tone anywhere above 9 o'clock. The YouTube reviews that I like are by ProGuitarShopDemos, they are very thorough. And I noticed right away that the guy on that demo had the tone below 9. Sounded muffled. And when he raised it up higher...very shrill. Still, I gave it a listen, and if I find one in the wild, I might just check it out and see for myself.
I can't believe none of us mentioned these, but the Blackstar HT-Dual (and really all the Blackstar HT pedals) get great reviews. Again, form factor may be an issue, but they seem to be priced really well, especially for what you're getting.
Cheers,
Fester2k
HT is cool, but what disqualifies that is power requirements. 16V. The DC Brick I'd be using has only 9V or 18V.
Never mind. See below.
fester2000 wrote:
I can't believe none of us mentioned these, but the Blackstar HT-Dual
Damn you. I am looking at this more now and it is really cool. I'd have to figure out the power arrangement and somehow arrange for it's adapter to be fed from the same AC feed given to the DC Brick. But to do it, I'd have to dump a pedal. Maybe the flanger. I only use that on a few things anyway.
What sold me was this:
you could try the xotic bbpreamp, or the keeley ts9dx flexi 4x2
+1 On the Xotic BB Preamp. There's a few demos on youtube about it.
Those Keelys are a little pricey...But along that line and price I would suggest a stock MIJ DS-1...I think those sound great...
spaceatl wrote:
Those Keelys are a little pricey...But along that line and price I would suggest a stock MIJ DS-1...I think those sound great...
I've had something like three of those over the years. I think they can sound good and they are pretty cheap. Maybe I'll get one and have Keeley do the mod later? He only charges $75 in that case.
It's all about the R4 and R5 diodes....In the clean boost mod you simply clip them out and it turns into a wicked clean boost (Tube Screamer, Overdrive etc...)...I did that to a stock one ($30 new these days) and that is my main OD, Screamer/treble booster...In the Keely mod, I think what they do is replace R4 and R5 with an LED on a toggle so you can go between stock diode, LED and bypass...Basically, the diodes give the distortion....However, when you value these to give more distortion the potential level drops in tandem...The LED seems to be what most folks are into that mod these things...
You said you are wanting that JCM800 vibe...I am pretty sure that the 80s split channel versions used the diode clipping trick to get nice distortion...It's the same trick the DS-1 uses but I am sure the parts and values are different...Maybe looking at the schematics, a cool value could be figured out...
This post is just some idea streaming...
OCD bro....My choice for a stand alone killer OD......
Better than the old Tube Screamers....but you can still get the TS tone as part of the unit...and there's a lot more....
OM
Hey man,
If you're looking for JCM-800 in a box, check out the Marshall Guv'nor 2. I haven't played through a JCM-800, and I don't use it much with my SV112 because I like its gain structures the way they are, but that's exactly how Marshall markets it and how a lot of people review it - JCM-800 in a box. If you're interested in hearing it with an SV (mine has SVpre set to yellow, G12-K100 speaker, and bias set to 40 mV), let me know and I'll try to put together a YouTube video or a recording for you.
nprenger
Don't know why I forgot to add the Guv'nor. I actually saw a couple of old videos of you playing one, but not with your SV.
Yeah, unfortunately those videos aren't too flattering for the Guv'nor. The tone was awful. I thought it sounded a lot better in person - I don't think my camera was up to the task.
nprenger
Well, I wasn't going to say...
But I totally understand. It's hard to make a good demo for online consumption. And there are precious few of the Guv'nor 2 out there on YouTube. Most are not demoing them through decent equipment or capturing it with a decent mic.
But if you can, I'd love to hear that pedal with the SV. I'm going to add it to my "try" list. These are pretty easily found at GC.
Right now, that Blackstar HT-Dual is topping my list, but you can never have too many gain options.
Hi Karl
I used the Guv'nor for a while...and although...IMO....it's a pretty good sounding pedal...I personally found it a little bit too brittle running through my SV....
I haven't played the Blackstar...but it sure sounds nice...I've heard of guys switching the tube out on it and getting stunning results....
Have fun in your quest!!
OM
Karl- Don't know your budget but there are three pedals that I've tried that kick major @ss but a little pricey- Lee Jackson's Kata distortion (awesome for us old school 80's rats if you can find on ebay) Mesa V-Twin and Soldano's GTO. Nothing against BOSS or Marshall pedals but they can't sing and sizzle like these (Just my opinion, not knocking anyone's suggestions here) I haven't tried the Blackstar but it sure sounded good in that video.
Kinda surprised anyone would want a distortion pedal out in front of these, they have a bunch of gain. Not liking the gain from the Spider Valve or are you just using it for extra boost?
Rick
I like the gain on the SV just fine. But GAS is a cool thing too. I bought the OD to overcome what I see as a shortcoming in the internal stomp of the SV. And since I wanted a good chorus and delay pedal I thought, hey, why not a good distortion pedal to round it all out? And I've had some GAS for that Blackstar HT-5 since Jared started down that path. So when Fester recommended the HT-Dual, I thought...hey, why not?
Distortion pedals are cool. For one thing, you can play at much lower volumes than you could without one. On stages where you need to have a lot less volume (church, for instance) that's a good thing.
I gotta check out those you listed!
Another thing that's cool here...I've had a hankering for a good tube Marshall for a long time. But I don't want to pay the Marshall price. The HT-Dual seems like it might just fit the bill: tube, former Marshall folks behind it. Even has a direct recording emulated output. And hooked into the SV, I bet it's the bees knees. The one thing the SV is just a tad light on is a decent Super Lead sound. Yeah, they have the Crunch Blue, but that's slightly too tricked out. And the Insane blue is a little too...insane. Metal Blue is good too, but missing the mids, and it sure ain't a Super Lead, more like a SLO on steroids. I'm just looking for something to fill the gap.
Yeah, you have a couple good points-SV can get close but not really nail the Marshall tone. I see a lot of requests on here for folks asking how to get that tone too. I also like the mids from a Marshall and dial the mids really high on my amps when playing live. I had a TSL100 for awhile but sold it and bought a Triple Recto. Sold that too- Which is why I bought the HD100's....Simplicity of setup- I had to run pedals, tuners a wah/volume, GMajor etc and just really got tired of setting all that up every week. By the way, some of the awesome mids from the Marshalls are from the power section too (EL34's)..Not sure if we can ever truly nail that tone with 6L6's but you should be able to get pretty close with one those stompboxes....
rblyn wrote:
By the way, some of the awesome mids from the Marshalls are from the power section too (EL34's)..Not sure if we can ever truly nail that tone with 6L6's but you should be able to get pretty close with one those stompboxes....
Agree on all of your points above, especially this one. That MXR 10-band EQ helps a lot too.
Thanks, Daniel! ProGuitarShopDemos have the best pedal demos on YouTube.
"I'm playing a Les Paul through a 65 Amps Soho, but later on I'll plug in a Strat. This is the bypass signal."
I can hear Andy's voice in my sleep for how many of his demos I've watched.
Have you looked at the "purple plixi" pedal for both the plexi and the JMC800 tones? Andy demos this pedal at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPuOmPqwqIE
Ok, so tell us why you decided on these pedals? ![]()
Daniel-Ganfield wrote:
Ok, so tell us why you decided on these pedals?
Well, this is after years of being a modeling user and discovering what works for me both live and recorded. So after research and trial, I picked what I perceived to be the best of each need. I'm not a big "effects" user. The most I go for is chorus, delay and sometimes wah. I do like a little variety in the gain department. And I also need some "utility" pedals.
Tuner: Korg Pitchblack. The other choices were Boss TU-2, which is only accurate to +/- 3 cent, or the Digitech Hardwire Tuner. I liked the compact format, display, price, tuning action, and >= 1 cent accuracy of the Pitchblack.
Noise Reduction: ISP Decimator G-String. This is what I was hoping for in an NR pedal: 2 stage reduction. It goes both pre and post distortion in the chain. I wanted this functionality, but not at the expense of buying the Pro Rack G. It's pricey, but beats the competition soundly. I had tried the regular Decimator and liked what it did before the amp and in the loop, but wished it had both of those together, not separately. Plus, that original Decimator wasn't designed to be used in the loop. The G-String contains the NR algorithms of the Pro Rack G in that department.
Wah: Dunlop 95Q. Adjustable Q and switchless. I am of the mind that a wah should engage in the low register, not the high. I like switchless but didn't want to go for the larger format Morley. This one sounds good with the SV too.
OD: MXR GT-OD. I wanted a simple OD pedal that sounds great. And for the price (I got it for $61 new off eBay) this one is a steal. Sounds like a plexi in a box at higher settings. Way better than any Tube Screamer.
Distortion: Blackstar HT-Dual x 2. I started off wanting just a plain old distortion pedal that mimiced a JCM800 in a box. But after finding this thing, I started to rethink my entire rig. What if I could have a pedalboard that was self contained to the point of being able to use it direct to the board or recorder? In other words, as a backup amp or direct rig? The sheer variety of tones to be had and the tone quality of this pedal seems to offer that possibility. And it's tube distortion. Yes, I know, there are op-amps in there that boost the signal up to the point where the tube can really work magic, but the distortion itself comes from the tube. The diode clipping stage comes after the tube and only functions as a kind of limiter. Anway, these in my rig will let me get American clean and high gain in addition to British crunch and high gain. And they interact with ODs well. Add a cab emulator direct box (see below) after the whole board and it's direct time live. ![]()
EQ: MXR 10-band. Simply the best EQ pedal for guitar I've owned. I love what it does with the SV. This will be used to shape the distortion stages on the board or amp.
Chorus: MXR Stereo Chorus. Best analog chorus out there. 18 volt operation = high headroom. Has that sound that I instantly identify with from so many recordings. It's the chorus I've always wanted out of my PODs but can't seem to find.
Delay: Digitech Hardwire DL-8 Delay/Looper x 2. This pedal craps all over the Boss DD line. Sounds fantastic. Convincing tape and analog delay sounds. Crystal clear digital delay. Tap tempo in all modes. True bypass switching or DSP bypass with trails. 18 volt operation. And it has a 20 second looper with unlimited tracks. Not that I'll use a looper much, but it's a great feature. I chose two in order to have instant access to delay time/type for rhythm and leads.
Not pictured:
Power supply: Dunlop DC Brick. 7 9V outputs and 3 18V outputs. Meets my power requirements. Only problem are the Blackstars. Their 16V adapters will run off the AC feed to the brick.
Board: Pedaltrain PT-2. Cool device. It's simple, and I like that. Plus it has a nice hard case or carry bag. I haven't decided which of those to get. Depends on which bargain I find.
Direct box / Cab emulation: Behringer Ultra-G GI100 DI. I have tried this puppy and it is awesome for the $50. Very convincing 412 cab emulation and direct box all in one little package. Can be powered by phantom power or 9V. Takes a wide variety of input levels from instrument up to speaker output from an amp. I plan on using this between my SV and it's speakers as a direct send or as a means of just using the pedal board as a self contained solution.
Is this to supplement your pod rack you were using or is this a replacement?
Kudos to your wife for dealing with your GAS. However if you post here that you are back to an M13 for external effects you'll need to check into GAA (Gear Acquistion Anonymous) for a 12 step program.
LOL, for sure. No, I won't be going back to the M13. It does have all these categories, but like I said, I know what I want.
My wife is generally okay with the GAS, so long as I pay for it by selling stuff, or from gig money.
Thanks! That was more of an answer than I expected. ![]()
I guess I've been thinking about this too much. ![]()
I've noticed that you were headed this direction for a long time. It has been interesting to follow your tone/rig quest. You've gone through alot of gear in the last year. I hope it works out for you man. You know your sh.t, and do your homework, so I'm sure it'll be awesome. I don't see your talkbox on that pedalboard though.
Shoot, you had to bring that up, huh? Now I'll have to find a way to make that happen. ![]()
Okay, I pulled the trigger on a good bit of the pedals and the board/power supply. Got a great deal from Musician's Friend's sale, 20% off, because I qualified at the highest tier. Saved $240. Today I purchased:
The plan for the board took a slightly different shape because of the extra high gain pedal, but I think it's going to be worth it. Still have the delays, chorus and wah to purchase as gig money allows, but this is a great start. I've also decided to go with the Hardwire Stereo Chorus instead of the MXR after trying the Hardwire. Quality stuff. Here's the new layout:
hey Karl.. look slike a mean pedal board.
I'm just wondering how you're going to wire up that noise gate pedal. it looks like it's 2 noise gates in one, so will you use one half before the effects, and the other after the SV preamp (before the loop effects) or would it be after the loop effects?
Rowbi wrote:
I'm just wondering how you're going to wire up that noise gate pedal. it looks like it's 2 noise gates in one, so will you use one half before the effects, and the other after the SV preamp (before the loop effects) or would it be after the loop effects?
Yep, it's not apparent from the picture, but I am going to install some kind of jack system on the board in order to be able to do the four cable method. The G-String goes both pre and post gain and has separate inputs/outputs for each. The way I plan to do the jacks, I can just use a short patch cable to jumper them if I want to run straight though.
Funny observation about all this GAS. Last night at rehearsal I had to use just my HD100, EQ and FBV Express since the X3 Pro and Shortboard went on eBay. I felt naked and definitely missed a few features, but it went rather well. When discussing the upcoming pedalboard with our keys player, he pointed at my Express and said, "Well, that little thing right there seemed to do everything you needed it to tonight."
Now that was a major bummer on my GAS, but still, he had a point. The SV is one fine sounding amp to start with. And my little 4 channel setup that I have going does the job. The feeling of nakedness on my part shouldn't have bothered me so much because it dawned on me that....hey?....I've gigged this amp twice in this configuration before and thought it was awesome.
LOL.
Not that there weren't shortcomings I've noticed over time. Sometimes the distortion is a bit too loose on the bottom end, like a little mushy. Less so with the EQ in the chain, but still there. This is something that reviewers of the HT pedals have said doesn't exist on them. Nice crunchy low notes. And very articulate. So I'm hoping that a quality outboard pedal mixed with a quality amp like the SV is just the thing I've been looking for.
Maxon.
Dude, I recommend the Keeley modified Sparkle Drive. I have an SV 212 and generally do not like the sound of distortion pedals in front of the amp models. I have tried many of them, and they all sounded muddy in front of a distorted amp. However, I recently picked up a Keeley-modded Sparkle Drive on Ebay and it sounds incredible in front of the JCM and Tweed models on the SV. I haven't tried it yet with the other amp models but expect similar results. It's a very transparent overdrive that adds that extra drive and edge I was looking for without adding any mud. Just an awesome pedal! Can't recommend enough. It works great with my Strat and my Les Paul which is really saying something. I used it for the first time at rehearsal the other day and got mucho compliments on my tone. Rock on! Pete
Sparkle Drive is a neat pedal to start with. Classic TS circuit with a mix knob. I bet Keeley does a great mod on that.
I've already caught my limit on the pedals, but thanks for the suggestion! The Sparkle Drive was definitely one I considered when I was looking at overdrives.
seems to miss the point to me TBH.
Just invested in a Korg D3200 desk.
The HD100 records fantastically well - really excellent overdriven sounds.
HD100 , shortboard ...what more do you need....really?
The Blackstar pedals are lovely, but, they dont suit this amp.
docjonty wrote:
HD100 , shortboard ...what more do you need....really
An accurate tuner, a good set of JCM sounds, chorus that you can tweak in correctly, delays that you can tweak right, good noise reduction, an EQ, a wah you don't have to put your entire weight on to activate...
But that's probably just nitpicking. ![]()
It is a great amp. But it can get better.
Just one more thing I would add, is that I installed the Strymon SVpre in my SV 212 and this was a big boost in sound quality, which was already great to begin with, but is now really incredible! I think it also improves the sound and response of the amp when you use distortion pedals in front of it. In fact, I liked the Strymon board so much that I went a bit further and also installed a footswitch control mod in my amp so that I can change the push level of the SVpre on the fly during live performance. Having that capability at one's command is awesome, it's one of the best things I've ever done! Pete
pbecker314 wrote:
Just one more thing I would add, is that I installed the Strymon SVpre...
Everyone that has one seems to like it. However, given the troubles I've recently had with my 112, I'd rather not void the warranty on that or my HD100 too soon. So when the warranty is up, I'll either install the SVPre and take my chances, or look for a decent used DSL 50 or something along those lines. Either way, less digital, more analog.
Heard it live with a JCM and JVM last week,
Blew both of them away.....no SV pre, no fancy EQ...bugger all.
I dont buy this serial modifying business.
The amp is what it is.
I hear a lot of amps and few come close.
As to JCM sounds...they are in there.
Listen to that clip I posted.
Its a pastiche of an early 70`s high gain marshall with a bit more grunt.
docjonty wrote:
I dont buy this serial modifying business.
I'm not modding anything. It's an amp with some good base amp sounds. I'm putting some good effects around it. That, and giving it a few tonal options it doesn't do particularly well right now. Really. There's a space in those models where a good JCM-800, 900 or 2000 should be. It goes right from 50 watt plexi to variac'd 68 super lead to molten Soldano. It's missing a big stretch of Marshall tone, IMO. And what's there can get a bit mushy on the low end.
Hey, it may not work for you, but it might work for me. Sure seems like Jared got his HT-5 to sound great through the SV cab. Doesn't seem like a stretch to me that the HT-Pedals would sound great through one of the clean channels too. And at low volume to boot. But hey, to each his own.
I thought that clip sounded kinda thin. Sorry. Might be my speakers.
Have you thought about the Alchemist? I hear you can get one at Best Buy...No really, I heard that...
spaceatl wrote:
Have you thought about the Alchemist? I hear you can get one at Best Buy...No really, I heard that...
Indeed you *can* get them at Best Buy, at least the one near my house. My advice: get the head, avoid the combo. Both sound great clean, but only the head sounds awesome all by its lonesome in the OD arena, no pedals needed.
Cheers,
Fester2k
If you really want a good one karl I cannot recommend the Blackstars highly enough for that authentic Marshall tone - if that`s what you are really after.
Hey, Doc, you kinda gave me the idea with that vid you posted about the HT-DistX. Good stuff! Got one of those too! ![]()
Well, I got a nice surprise and my pedals came a day early. Will try them with the SV later tonight at a rehearsal where I can pump it up. But from playing into my UX2 with them, they sound amazing. Truly Marshall in a box. I'll be spending the better part of the next couple of days putting the board together. Won't have anything for your consumption before mid next week.
Hello Karl, I have a question. I'm not being facetious, really just curious. I was looking at the list of boxes you got and you have three distortions and an overdrive? I was wondering how do you plan on configuring them? Or should I say using them? Is one for one sound or are you gonna use some in combo with each other? Your pedalboard has me considering the same avenue as I can't really use my wah. Very nice choices btw...![]()
cgtrox ![]()
cgtrox wrote:
Hello Karl, I have a question. I'm not being facetious, really just curious. I was looking at the list of boxes you got and you have three distortions and an overdrive? I was wondering how do you plan on configuring them? Or should I say using them? Is one for one sound or are you gonna use some in combo with each other? Your pedalboard has me considering the same avenue as I can't really use my wah. Very nice choices btw...
cgtrox
Thanks. I think I've figured it out this way after messing around some tonight, at least for the hair cover band:
HT-Dual 1: Clean channel as an OD and level boost which will boost the Dual 2 and the DistX. Dist channel as solo with output boosted, British
HT-Dual 2: Crunch channel as a cranked plexi kind of gain, almost classic rock. Dist channel as hot rodded Marshall, 80's Hair tone
.
HT-DistX: Big hairy recto sound for the modern stuff.
I actually ended up getting rid of that GT-OD. Great pedal. But with the HT's, not needed at all. They sound FANTASTIC with the SV and fill a niche that the SV is missing. At least the Duals do. The DistX just sounds slightly different and more refined than the SV Metal Amber. Oh, and did I mention? All the tones are servicable at low volume. Can't be done on the SV alone.
Yep, I'm looking forward to getting that 95Q wah tomorrow. I can't stand worrying about whether the SV wah is switched on or off. Can't tell you how many times I thought I was wah-ing away but doing ridiculous volume swells instead. The 95Q is brilliant. Just rock it and forget it. Like it should be.
i have demoed the M.I. Audio Crunch Box, and it's REALLY good for that hot rodded Marshall tone, and it's not too expensive.
My ultimate fave is the BJFe Dyna Red, but those are expensive and hard to get.
I have also had good results with some of the Tech 21 pedas, like the GT2 and Trio-OD.
plenty of great options when it comes with Marshall in a box pedals. A recent one I demoed really impressed me, the Tonefreak SEVERE high gain distortion.
I hope you know, you dugged up a really old post ![]()
But with that said, I have a pedal that I think everyone should have or atleast try before they die ![]()
MXR Fullbore Metal!!!!!!!!! It doesn't sound that good with a stack, but it brings a 1x12 to life! My Fender Champ 15... sounds like a Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier with the Fullbore Metal and I ain't even scooping!
Well isn't this special! I hadn't been here for a while; and here's this thread!
I just ordered the HT Dual pedal yesterday... I'm planning on trying it with an AB switch in the effects loop, just to see what it's like going from the HT Dual directly into the tube power amp. That will cut out the ss preamp; if it sounds really good I'll just add a couple of pedals and I'll have like about 4 amps right there!
Everything I've heard about these, every clip I've seen, they sound like they'll do a LOT more than just a decent Marshall tone.
I will let y'all know, and I hope to hear more about Karl's experience with it (them?? damn!)
Les (really like my SV112, I do!)
I did try an Alchemist combo, and I really just didn't like the basic sound. SV112 was ALL over it for basic tones. Just my $.02
If money aint a problem, I would go with this one... http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Radial-Tonebone-Plexitube-Distortion-Pedal?sku=153935 ![]()
The Radial stuff is waaay top notch and built like a beautiful, shiny tank!
cgtrox ![]()
Have you tried any of the Barber stuff|? Heard really good things about that one. ![]()
cgtrox ![]()
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