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Up to Discussions in Variax Guitars / Bass / Workbench
816 Views 15 Replies Latest reply: Nov 25, 2009 3:15 AM by lindsayward RSS
tenbrink Just Startin'
tenbrink
6 posts since
Nov 15, 2009
Currently Being Moderated

Nov 15, 2009 12:33 PM

variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

Hello! I've had my variax 500 electric guitar a couple of years now and it has worked flawlessly until now. When I play barre chords with the lowest keynote on the a-string (for example a high E) the b-string and the g-string doesn't "agree" and i get that tremolo effect which occures when the guitar isn't in tune. However the guitar is perfectly tuned cause when checking the strings separately on those frets that are problematic they're in tune. And I tested to record when first playing on the b-string and then I dubbed that with playing on the g-string and it sounds perfect. It's only when they're played together at the same time it sounds out of tune. If i tune down the b-string just a little it dissapears, but then all other chords gets out of tune. As i've just had it in for intonation I know that that isn't the problem, and i've checked that all frets are in tune. My guess is that something is wrong with the technical part of the guitar, maybe the piezo mics are damaged or something in the "computer" of the guitar. I don't know what to do, I guess I need to get service, but when searching for a service center in sweden i get no results, why is that?

Tags: variax, of, out, tune, intonation
  • amx05462 Power User
    amx05462
    3,480 posts since
    Sep 1, 2008
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 15, 2009 1:23 PM (in response to tenbrink)
    Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

    sounds  like  the  first  thing  to do is  to reflash  the  firmware.

  • mdmayfield Just Startin'
    mdmayfield
    250 posts since
    Feb 24, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 15, 2009 3:31 PM (in response to tenbrink)
    Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

    Two suggestions:

     

    1. Change your strings

    2. Listen to the tuning *unplugged*. It might be a physical problem.

     

     

    Idea: (You may already know this, but I will post it anyway for the benefit of the forum)

     

    Tuning is a funny thing. For example, the note E needs to be tuned higher as the 5th of an A chord (A-C#-E) than as the 3rd of a C chord (C-E-G) to blend just right. Singers, violin players, trombone players, etc. do this instinctively. But on instruments like piano and guitar, where a note can only have one pitch, each note is tuned to the average spot so that it comes close, but is not perfect, for all chords.

     

    If you tune so that the G string sounds just right on the 1st fret in the E chord (G# as the 3rd, E-G#-B) then it will sound flat open in a C chord (as the 5th, C-E-G). The only solution is to compromise - make the G string a little flat for the C chord but a little sharp for the E chord.

     

    This "compromise" system is called equal temperament and is what electronic tuners automatically use.

    • tenbrink Just Startin'
      tenbrink
      6 posts since
      Nov 15, 2009
      Currently Being Moderated
      Nov 15, 2009 4:33 PM (in response to mdmayfield)
      Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

      I changed the strings just before I had it intonated. The problem was the same with the old strings. If this problem has to do with the tuning, then why haven't I had it the first 4-5 years? I think i bought my variax in 2004 and this problem occured in september this year. I have always used the same brand of strings, d'addario xl exl110, cause it was the sort of strings the guitar was delivered with.

       

      the guitar sounds in tune when playing it unplugged. one way of how to test if it's the hardware that's defect would be to put a real pickup on the guitar and see how it sounds through that.

      • amx05462 Power User
        amx05462
        3,480 posts since
        Sep 1, 2008
        Currently Being Moderated
        Nov 16, 2009 2:41 AM (in response to tenbrink)
        Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

        yes  you need workbench to flash  the  chip.  i see  no service  center  in your  area either.  do you know  anyone   who has  workbench   that  could   do a  reflash  for you. you could  try rigging  a  pickup like  you already  said  just to test  it  but if  it  sounds   right   playing   it  not  powered  it  will sound  the  same  with a  pickup.  if  thats  what  you need  to  do  to be  sure  then do that  but  i still think you need  to flash  the  chip.  as far as the  service  center  youll have  to find  the  nearest one  to you (i know  theres  none  listed   there)  ship  it  both  ways   and   pay for  repair .  im assuming  your  warrantee  is  long  done.

        • tenbrink Just Startin'
          tenbrink
          6 posts since
          Nov 15, 2009
          Currently Being Moderated
          Nov 17, 2009 4:03 AM (in response to amx05462)
          Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

          i can't understand how they can't have a service center in sweden, the closest is in germany, and that will be really expensive, shipment and service costs. this is so annoying. it would be nice with a comment from someone at line 6. don't they answer any questions?

           

          so if it is as supposed the chip, what may have happened? i mostly just use the t-model, the spanks and the lester, and haven't even saved any preset. the only thing i've done was to upgrade the firmware, but that was 2 years ago and the guitar was fine after that. i friend hade a floorpod xt so that's how was able to upgrade, but he has sold it. I don't think I know anyone else using any line 6 gear. How about the usb audio interfaces, does any of them have the function to plug in your variax and use monkey or something like that? that would at least be motivated to buy cause even if it doesn't solve the problem I probably can sell it or use it in my studio, a workbench bundle will be harder to get rid of and would be useless if it doesn't fix my guitar.


          and about an external pickup, i'm thinking about using one from my old crap guitar, but i don't know if it will fit under the strings without carving a whole in my variax, which i'd rather not do. another idea I have is to record the guitar with a regular mic in front of it with quite much gain and then put on some distortion, just to see how that sounds.

          • roblof Just Startin'
            roblof
            129 posts since
            Jan 24, 2007
            Currently Being Moderated
            Nov 17, 2009 1:57 PM (in response to tenbrink)
            Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

            There is a service center (actually the distributor for the nordic countries) in Stockholm called Luthman (www.luthman.se) but you need to go via a dealer since they normaly not are the frontend for end users.

             

            If you for some reason can't go thru a dealer you might give them a call to see if they will help you anyway...

             

            First I'd try to borrow a xt-live or x3-live from a music store or friend and use the free workbench software and reflash the guitar again to see if this helps. Then you don't have to buy the workbench hardware.

          • amx05462 Power User
            amx05462
            3,480 posts since
            Sep 1, 2008
            Currently Being Moderated
            Nov 17, 2009 1:57 PM (in response to tenbrink)
            Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

            probably  the  only thing  thats  gonna  fit  under  the   strings  is an old   top mount  guitar  pickup or if you know  someone  with a  dogear p90 laying  around or someone  with   a roland  gk pickup or  maybe  one of those  thin  acoustic  pickups. what  you could  try  is  getting  a  support  ticket that  would   put  you  intouch  with   a line 6 tech.  i dont  know  how  to do that  because  ive  never  had  to but    i know   that  you can   work  one on one  with  a tech  that way.

             

              the  trouble  woth  the  usb  audio  interface  is  getting  it  connected  to the  guitar if you look at the  attatched  photo  of  thw  workbench  hardware   theres  two cables    and  the  interface. so  it  changes  the  guitar connector  to  usb  that way. i think  theres  a  chip  in there  that does  something  too.

             

               yeah  there is  i just looked  at it  so it  probably  has  some  miniscule  program  on it.

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          • lindsayward Just Startin'
            lindsayward
            91 posts since
            Mar 7, 2007
            Currently Being Moderated
            Nov 25, 2009 3:15 AM (in response to tenbrink)
            Re: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

            I would recommend getting Workbench if you're interested in experimenting with different guitar setups - it's really a super-cool feature that makes your Variax so much more interesting!

            I know you said you haven't needed/wanted to play with it yet, but if you think you might be interested, you should find it's a lot of fun and very useful (especially for virtual capos for me).

            Here's a review from way back: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?s=2b8843937a39145248750e8cbaa3f6f8&t=1041279

             

            I got my firmware updated at a store that sold Line 6 stuff in my town (not where I bought the guitar), so if you have a store nearby that might let you use some of their gear, that might be the cheapest way to test if it's firmware.

  • Line6Andy Line 6
    Line6Andy
    4,345 posts since
    Jun 5, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 17, 2009 2:55 PM (in response to tenbrink)
    RE: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

    Hello,

       Outside of the software reflash and changing strings (to make sure there is not a string issue), you may want to have a qualified guitar luthier/tech go through the guitar to make sure there are no other problems with the nut or saddle piece that could be causing some other issue that would knock the intonation out of tune.  You can also take a look at this Peterson FAQ where they discuss how to correctly intonate and setup a guitar, as well as the ideas behind tempered tunings:

       

      http://www.petersontuners.com/index.cfm?category=85

       

       

       Please be sure to award Helpful and/or Correct points to community members who respond with helpful or correct answers, and close out the ticket as “answered” if your situation has been resolved.

    • tenbrink Just Startin'
      tenbrink
      6 posts since
      Nov 15, 2009
      Currently Being Moderated
      Nov 18, 2009 10:27 AM (in response to Line6Andy)
      Re: RE: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

      sorry, i'm so new here and didn't know about the award system.

       

      i didn't do the intonation myself, i did let a tech do it in a guitar shop that a friend recommended as he always has his guitar intonated there. but maybe he wasn't qualified for the job or just made it really quick and just assumed it was an intonation issue. i've already changed strings 2 times so that cannot be the cause.

       

      by the way, why doesn't any of the pod studio usb audio interfaces have a variax input?

    • tenbrink Just Startin'
      tenbrink
      6 posts since
      Nov 15, 2009
      Currently Being Moderated
      Nov 18, 2009 10:33 AM (in response to Line6Andy)
      Re: RE: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

      oh and i forgot to ask, have there been issues similar to my problem where a reflash has fixed it, that you know of?

  • Line6Andy Line 6
    Line6Andy
    4,345 posts since
    Jun 5, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 19, 2009 9:53 AM (in response to tenbrink)
    RE: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

    Hello,

        You may want to have the tech redo the intonation to make sure there is no problem there. 

        None of the POD Studio devices have a Variax input, but you can submit your feature request at the following link:

       

      Feature requests

      http://line6.com/company/contact/productFeedback/?topic_id=3

       

       Please be sure to award Helpful and/or Correct points to community members who respond with helpful or correct answers, and close out the ticket as “answered” if your situation has been resolved.

  • Line6Andy Line 6
    Line6Andy
    4,345 posts since
    Jun 5, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 23, 2009 4:20 PM (in response to tenbrink)
    RE: variax out of tune, intonation didn't help

    Hello,

        It's been a couple of days since we've heard from you. We're going to assume your question has been answered and close this thread. If you still have questions please feel free to open a new question with us and we will answer your questions accordingly. Thanks!

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