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2786 Views 19 Replies Latest reply: Dec 23, 2010 9:09 AM by mjordan111111 RSS
mjordan111111 Just Startin'
mjordan111111
9 posts since
Nov 5, 2009
Currently Being Moderated

Dec 18, 2010 9:19 AM

DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

Friends,

 

Have spent hours with great guitars and players in front of my DT50/HD500 combination.  A/B-ing with SV MKII, etc.

 

Although I can achieve a number of decent low-gain  tones, I dearly miss the MKII Blue Insane.  Along with Vetta Comp and a  bit of delay, this produced my main lead tone.  Round, sustainy,  articulate, blooming, and never harsh.

 

This tone is  simply not achievable with the DT50/HD500 combination.  I move from  decent (but not great) Brit tones, to harsh and nasty high-gain (Uber,  Mesa, Engl).  Fine for thrashing around, but harsh and non-musical for  singing lead tones.  Have tried every combination of cabs (and no cabs),  mics, compression, OD, EQ, etc.  Nothing nearly as satisfying as the  MKII.

 

Having sold the MKII, shortboard, and X3 to purchase this rig, I'm having some serious buyer's remorse.

 

Suggestions?

Tags: hd500, dt50
  • Rowbi Expert Line 6 User
    Rowbi
    7,745 posts since
    Nov 25, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 18, 2010 9:46 AM (in response to mjordan111111)
    Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

    Can you post your patch for someone to look at?  Also, are you using line, live modes and output setting combo or stack power amp?  I assume you are using the l6 link, and that you have both dt50 and hd500 updated?

    • mjordan111111 Just Startin'
      mjordan111111
      9 posts since
      Nov 5, 2009
      Currently Being Moderated
      Dec 18, 2010 10:16 AM (in response to Rowbi)
      Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

      Thanks for the response.

       

      I updated the HD500 as soon as I received it.  I understand I have to update the head through a midi-to-USB connection, which I do not have.  If there is another way, please let me know.

       

      I don't have a single patch from the DT50/HD500 combination for someone to look at.  I've created dozens, and all fall short.

       

      I'm using the L6 Link.

       

      I knew Insane was a Line 6 creation.  Any chance you'll be adding it to the HD?  For my money, it beats all the models.

       

      Thanks again.

  • mjordan111111 Just Startin'
    mjordan111111
    9 posts since
    Nov 5, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 18, 2010 10:20 AM (in response to mjordan111111)
    Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

    Also, I wonder if the difference I hear is the fact that the SV is 6L6 vs. ELs in the DT50?

    • Rowbi Expert Line 6 User
      Rowbi
      7,745 posts since
      Nov 25, 2006
      Currently Being Moderated
      Dec 18, 2010 10:44 AM (in response to mjordan111111)
      Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

      it may be worth the £20 to get an m audio UNO sport midi to USB... I think there may be a dt50 update that mit be worth applying... Nd as it's a new model of amp, my guess is that there will likely be the odd small bug fix in the future too.. So it will be worth buying.

      as far as the patches go, if they all don't sound great then please do the above... Hopefully that will make a difference...  Just a thought, on it's own into headphones does your pod sound good, and on it's own does your dt50 sound good?

      no idea on the insane being in the dt50.. You should put in a new feature request to line 6 so they know (as I don't work for them so i have no idea). Cick the contact us link at the bottom of this page for the feature request form.

      cheers, rowbi

      • mjordan111111 Just Startin'
        mjordan111111
        9 posts since
        Nov 5, 2009
        Currently Being Moderated
        Dec 18, 2010 3:43 PM (in response to Rowbi)
        Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

        The basic sounds are coming from the HD500, which is up to date.  Don't believe an amp update is the ticket here.

         

        I don't believe I'm going any further with this.  Believe I'll be returning this on Monday.  Disappointed.  Sounds like an X3 through a PA system.  Ick.

        • swhs Just Startin'
          swhs
          5 posts since
          Sep 13, 2010
          Currently Being Moderated
          Dec 18, 2010 5:27 PM (in response to mjordan111111)
          Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

          I think the best way to go is old school...........Eng powerball.....with analog pedals that make u drool. Digital can never replace the thump u get in ur chest from an overdriven boutique cranked up. A peice of advice: there is a reason why marshalls and engls and oranges are worth more than the digital crap.....save up and go for the original!   digital is beibery ! u like the innocense but in the long run STEVE MORSE rules!!!!!!!

          • johnnyayyy Iknowathingortwo
            johnnyayyy
            1,170 posts since
            Feb 24, 2010
            Currently Being Moderated
            Dec 18, 2010 6:35 PM (in response to swhs)
            Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

            swhs wrote:

             

            I think the best way to go is old school...........Eng powerball.....with analog pedals that make u drool. Digital can never replace the thump u get in ur chest from an overdriven boutique cranked up. A peice of advice: there is a reason why marshalls and engls and oranges are worth more than the digital crap.....save up and go for the original!   digital is beibery ! u like the innocense but in the long run STEVE MORSE rules!!!!!!!

          • mjordan111111 Just Startin'
            mjordan111111
            9 posts since
            Nov 5, 2009
            Currently Being Moderated
            Dec 19, 2010 10:52 AM (in response to swhs)
            Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

            Folks,

             

            Thanks for responses.  I continue to work this thing.

             

            I own/have owned a bazillion killer botique and vintage amps, and my analog pedal board is 4' wide.  So, I have a feel for what stuff sounds like.

             

            But, all that stuff is simply not portable.  Would love to have a variety of sounds in a single amp and small pedalboard.  So, I'll continue to work with this thing.

             

            MJ

        • Rowbi Expert Line 6 User
          Rowbi
          7,745 posts since
          Nov 25, 2006
          Currently Being Moderated
          Dec 19, 2010 2:25 AM (in response to mjordan111111)
          Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

          mjordan111111 wrote:

           

          The basic sounds are coming from the HD500, which is up to date.  Don't believe an amp update is the ticket here.

           

          I don't believe I'm going any further with this.  Believe I'll be returning this on Monday.  Disappointed.  Sounds like an X3 through a PA system.  Ick.

          Trevor made some good points...  the other chap also made some good points about other amps... I would say that valve amps are great, otherwise why would we all want modellers that simulate those sought after amps... But it's not helpful to say "go and buy something else"... is it!

           

          back on topic... the firmware in the DT50 is very relevant.... if you're using pre models in the HD500... as the POD switches some things in the DT50, and there have been some tweaks along the way to improve things... trust me on that...

           

          but if your mind is made up that it's not for you, then that's cool.  I hope you get the sound you're after from something else, as there's lots to choose from these days.

           

          Cheers

           

          Rowbi

          • swhs Just Startin'
            swhs
            5 posts since
            Sep 13, 2010
            Currently Being Moderated
            Dec 19, 2010 2:37 AM (in response to Rowbi)
            Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

            definately u r right dude but for about 2000usd's u should deliver rather than boasting about hd500 or dt-50 being as good as as an axe fx. get my point "unless u got it - dont flaunt it"

      • mjordan111111 Just Startin'
        mjordan111111
        9 posts since
        Nov 5, 2009
        Currently Being Moderated
        Dec 19, 2010 11:07 AM (in response to Rowbi)
        Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

        Don't suppose I can USB from the HD500, and use the L6 Link to update the head?  If not, that would be a helpful feature.

      • mjordan111111 Just Startin'
        mjordan111111
        9 posts since
        Nov 5, 2009
        Currently Being Moderated
        Dec 23, 2010 9:09 AM (in response to Rowbi)
        Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

        Used a MIDI to USB.  Learned that firmware is up-to-date:  1.10.

         

        Oh, well.

  • Crusty_Old_Rocker Expert Line 6 User
    Crusty_Old_Rocker
    3,096 posts since
    Jan 24, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 18, 2010 11:12 PM (in response to mjordan111111)
    Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

    Are you using PRE models in the HD500 or full amp models?

     

    If you're looking to replicate SV or Vetta II tones, you're better off using the full amp models in the HD500 and set the DT50 to NFL I and Class A.  This way you'll be using the DT50 purely to amplify the full amp model tone.

     

    I struggled when I first got the HD500 and DT50 to get it performing like my Vetta.  Once I started using this type of setup I was able to get the tones I was looking for.  You can use the pull switch on the Master volume to tame the touchiness of the levels.

     

    The PRE models in the HD500 pretty much transform the DT50 into the amp being modelled which is a far cry from the way that the Spider Valve and Vetta model amp tones.  So, you're not going to get what you're looking for from the PRE models.  Don't get me wrong though, the PRE models in the HD500 with the DT50 are absolutely amazing, but this type of amp modelling is nothing like using a Spider Valve or Vetta II.

     

    Cheers,

     

    Crusty

    • mjordan111111 Just Startin'
      mjordan111111
      9 posts since
      Nov 5, 2009
      Currently Being Moderated
      Dec 19, 2010 11:00 AM (in response to Crusty_Old_Rocker)
      Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

      Thanks for the response, Crusty.

       

      Are you suggesting I eliminate the L6 Link and use the line out of the HD500 into the DT50 set on Class A?  Or, are you suggesting I edit my patches to use Class A?  If it's that latter, I feel like I've tried all these options using the L6 Link.

       

      This morning I monitored the HD500 with high end headphones (no DT50).  I was really impressed with many of the sounds.  Certainly would sound great on a ProTools session.  Had great feel, too.

       

      However, I was really hoping to hear that stuff coming from the DT50.  (I'm not a fan of performing by running a POD through the house and monitoring through a wedge.)  But, no such sounds.  To my ear, a far cry from playing through the actual amp.

       

      I'm finding very suitable clean and classic rock sounds.  What I cannot find is the smooth, never harsh, gainy-sustainy SV Insane Blue stuff.  All my attempts at lead sounds fall short.

       

      Still working...

      • gtrman100 Iknowathingortwo
        gtrman100
        479 posts since
        Jan 24, 2007
        Currently Being Moderated
        Dec 19, 2010 7:22 PM (in response to mjordan111111)
        Re: DT 50 plus HD 500-- rats

        Crusty wasn't suggesting that you not use the L6 link. It's the magic that makes the HD/DT50 such a great system. He was saying that the 'pre' models allow the DT50's power amp to mate with the HD preamp like the original amps would. But, you can always use the 'full' amp models if that gets you closer to the tone you're searching for.

         

        Unfortunately you can't update the DT50 with a midi interface. I agree with Crusty that it would be worthwhile to beg, borrow or steal a midi interface to do the update. I believe the current flash memory version is 1.10. Mine came with that installed at the factory.

         

        As you know, modelers are much harder to get the desired tone than a tube amp. Try using the Uber, Treadplate and Engl pre and full amp models with a distortion in front. I've got a good heavy tone from the "classic"(Rat) model in front of the Uber model. Keep trying- it'l be worth it!

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