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1074 Views 11 Replies Latest reply: May 4, 2012 12:27 AM by RonMarton RSS
tccc Just Startin'
tccc
14 posts since
Apr 14, 2012
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May 1, 2012 3:24 PM

Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

I'm guessing that no-one here is likely to have the answer to this, but perhaps someone may have an idea!

 

I've got a mix of cheap omni lavaliers and headsets now which work fine with the XD-V75 beltpacks. The sound isn't too bad, and they were all supplied wired to TA4F from the start.

 

I bought a selection of Sennheiser MKE-2 Gold lavaliers which were factory wired to LEMO connectors. Thinking this wouldn't be a problem, I went by the wiring diagram at the link below, which details how to wire an MKE-2 to a TA4F connector...

 

www.soundbydesign.net/pdf-downloads/wiring/mke2.pdf

 

The MKE-2s have the shield wire, a blue wire and a red wire. I've wired these to the pins detailed in Method 1 in the document above, but when connected to the V75 beltpack I get no audio from the mic at all (absolutely silent, not just extremely quiet or anything like that).

 

I don't suppose anyone has done this before and knows why this might be?! Everything I can find online seems to suggest that mics wired as per that document work fine with Shure transmitters.

 

Any wisdom greatly received!

 

Thanks.

  • tccc Just Startin'
    tccc
    14 posts since
    Apr 14, 2012
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    May 1, 2012 4:37 PM (in response to tccc)
    Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

    I've done a bit more digging, and apparently the MKE-2-4 mics (which is the model I've got) have the blue and shield tied at the capsule end of the wiring, hence the usual 2-wire method doesn't work. Solution appears to be blue/shield wired to pin 1, red to pin 3 with an 8.2k resistor across to pin 2, and then pin 3 tied to pin 4.

     

    Any line 6 guys see a problem with wiring the mic in this way for the beltpacks? That's a method given by sennheiser as compatible with shure transmitters.

     

    It does say that this will increase the mic output by 10 to 14dB - is that still going to be well within the headroom on the V75 transmitters?

     

    Many thanks.

    • RonMarton Iknowathingortwo
      RonMarton
      357 posts since
      Jan 12, 2012
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      May 1, 2012 5:01 PM (in response to tccc)
      Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

      Our posts crossed.

       

      As you say, it now appears the two-wire resistor scheme is the only one that'll work.

       

      From personal experience I can report that it takes gargantuan overload for a TBP12 to clip, so I'm guessing you'll be fine unless you intend clipping an MKE 2 to the bell of a brass instrument or have it near a bass drum.

       

      If you don't make it, Sarge, ...I'll tell 'em you went down fighting.

  • RonMarton Iknowathingortwo
    RonMarton
    357 posts since
    Jan 12, 2012
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    May 1, 2012 4:52 PM (in response to tccc)
    Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

    I may be adding two plus two and coming up with five here, but I don't believe you'll do any damage trying what I have in mind.

     

    During preliminary checking prior to wardrobe-induced multi-beltpack mixing and matching of MKE 2's with MKE 1's (yuk) and 4's (ugh!), (for TV "panel" and "chat" shows, mostly), some batches of 2's have appeared out of phase with the other models when Lemo'd to identical transmitters. (Sennheiser's own SK 5212's, 50's and 250's.)

     

    This is borne out by SoundByDesign's note that different colour codes may apply to MKE 2's when they're factory-wired to connectors.

     

    Also, their higher gain un-balanced wiring scheme features the red wire as "signal" connected to pins 3 & 4.

     

    So, try reversing the red and blue wires on one unit.

     

    I'm guessing that accidentally having previously applied a few volts to the "signal side" of the capsule should not have caused irreperable damage and accordingly hope that the swap will work.

     

    (It would surprise me if you needed their higher gain scheme that applies volts to one side via the 8.2kOhm resistor, as the XD-V digital signal path is really quiet and more headroom prior to clipping's never going to hurt.)

     

    Besides, Hollywood tells us to never cut the red wire first...

     

    ...Just make sure you clear all civilians from the building.

    • tccc Just Startin'
      tccc
      14 posts since
      Apr 14, 2012
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      May 1, 2012 5:05 PM (in response to RonMarton)
      Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

      Ah Ron, first to reply as always, and usually with a touch of humour too

       

      The Sennheiser document I've found does say that if you use the 'amplified' method then the output will be out of phase. I've also just measured the resistance between the blue wire and the shield and they are definitely connected on these mics that I have. I'll get the soldering iron and give your suggestin a quick go now. So you're thinking...

       

      Pin 1 - shield

      Pin 2 - blue or shield

      Pin 3 + 4 - red

       

      ?

      • RonMarton Iknowathingortwo
        RonMarton
        357 posts since
        Jan 12, 2012
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        May 1, 2012 5:22 PM (in response to tccc)
        Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

        Well, that is what I originally had in mind and there should be no harm in trying it...

         

        But the internal blue-to-shield configuration of Sennheiser's "-4" version would seem to demand the resistive high gain scheme.

         

        As to being "first to reply", that's mostly due to the "down under" time zone I occupy.

        • tccc Just Startin'
          tccc
          14 posts since
          Apr 14, 2012
          Currently Being Moderated
          May 1, 2012 5:45 PM (in response to RonMarton)
          Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

          Doesn't work unfortunately

           

          I'll get hold of some resistors tomorrow and try it as per the 'amplified' wiring scheme.

           

          Once up and running, the combination of XD-V75s and MKE-2s should sound pretty good I'd imagine! I can make use of the level output control on the receiver to compensate for the increased signal from the mic, and save having to pad the console channel.

           

          Will let you know!

  • jokus Just Startin'
    jokus
    1 posts since
    Dec 21, 2011
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    May 2, 2012 11:30 AM (in response to tccc)
    Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

    1-P5027366.JPG

    Hi TCCC,

    ich think this will help you. I paid someone to try this versions for me and now I've got two different adapters for my Sennheiser MKE-2 and my HS-2 wired to sennheiser ewolution. First adapter (1) produces slightly more lows, second one (0,047) a little bit less lows. Both sound really good! (German: rot = red, weiß = white, Widerstand = resistor).

    Best wishes! - Jokus

    • RonMarton Iknowathingortwo
      RonMarton
      357 posts since
      Jan 12, 2012
      Currently Being Moderated
      May 2, 2012 3:37 PM (in response to jokus)
      Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

      Vielen Dank, Jokus!

       

      (This looks like an earlier version of the MKE-2 to me. Maybe Sennheiser's earlier "red", rather than the "gold" in question.)

       

      Mit unserer Kapsel gibt es nur blauen und roten Drähte.

    • tccc Just Startin'
      tccc
      14 posts since
      Apr 14, 2012
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      May 3, 2012 6:10 PM (in response to jokus)
      Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

      Thank You Jokus

       

      As Ron says, the MKE-2 Gold models (which are the ones with a welded diaphragm to help reduce the effect of sweat on the capsule) have different colour wires to your diagram, but the principal is the same.

       

      Just to clarify for the purposes of anyone reading this thread in the future:

       

      1) When correctly wired to a TA4F connector, the MKE-2 Gold Dot mics sound brilliant through an XD-V75 - the sound has that very airy 'opera' edge to it, and the output level is fine without having to pad the pre-amp on the desk. I should imagine the original MKE-2 and newer MKE-2 platinum should work equally well.

       

      2) If your mic is an MKE-2-4, you will probably find that the blue wire and shield are tied at the capsule end. You can quickly confirm this by checking the resistance across the two wires with a multimeter. If this is the case then when wiring your TA4F connector, you need to use Method 2 detailed in the document below (and you'll need a 1/8w 8.2k resistor - preferably surface mount). Method 1 will give no output at all.

       

      3) If your mic is an MKE-2-5, or any other variant supplied from the factory with pigtails (no connector) then Method 1 should work. Given that the soldering job is so fiddly, you'd be best advised to double-check first by measuring the resistance between the blue and shield wires and ensuring the two are not connected. You'll be rather disappointed if you spend time wiring them as per Method 1, only to have to start from scratch and use Method 2!

       

      www.soundbydesign.net/pdf-downloads/wiring/mke2.pdf

       

      I have to say, for around £350 for the XD-V75TR, plus £40 for a used MKE-2, and a little bit of fiddly soldering, I don't think you could get a better-sounding wireless lavalier system for theatre use even if you spent 4x more.

       

      Could one of the Line 6 guys please add this mic to the compatible microphone document on here when they get a chance?

      • RonMarton Iknowathingortwo
        RonMarton
        357 posts since
        Jan 12, 2012
        Currently Being Moderated
        May 4, 2012 12:27 AM (in response to tccc)
        Re: Sennheiser MKE-2 wired for XD-V75 beltpack

        Great news !

         

        Now that tccc has very kindly both cracked the codes for implementing MKE-2's  ...and taken the trouble to document it all, maybe others viewing this thread with similar applications in mind might also find these observations useful:

         

        In my experience, the MKE-2 Gold is the only natural-sounding omnidirectional (hence more wind resistant) lavalier that has fully recovered from a drenching.

         

        This was from a rugby referee (on a very hot day) forgetting his vest-mounted comms gear and tipping a bucket of water over himself at half time.

         

        The mike splatted and spluttered its way back to full performance as it gradually dried out.

         

        In addition to its open "airy" naturnalness, its slightly unwieldy cable makes it one of the most rugged I've used.

         

        (By the way, I hate the skinny Kevlar cable of the "platinum". It seems to tangle itself while you watch!)

         

        I'd also "second" tccc's observations regarding the excellent value for money inherent in a purchase of Line 6 beltpacks.

         

        I feel that anything of comparable ruggedness normally costs at least twice as much, is nowhere near as ergonomic and (in many cases) is hampered by a significantly lower battery life.

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