I too am having problems with the FBS system in the Stagescape. It does'nt seem to be cutting any of the feedback especially in the monitors where I need it to work the most. What's up with this issue?
Feedback Reduction Barely Working
Posted 03 September 2013 - 07:28 AM
You wouldn't be able to actually "hear" it set any filters. They are too narrow for human hearing to detect.
Feedback management is set on the input page in deep tweak. It is automatically assigned to those inputs that typically have problems but not set to all presets (e.g. electric guitar settings). You want to use it in the universal setting if you are running any music through the mixer.
I would suggest as a start you make certain that your mixer is running the most current version of the firmware. It is available on the downloads tab from the main Line 6 page. Secondly create a new setup just in case somehow a switch was set in the wrong place. Try a test with a single mic (vocal preset). Switch to the input tab while in deep tweak and you should be able to see it set filters as you bring the system up into feedback.
That said, there is a limit to how much it can do and feedback will occur with all systems. This will depend on your exact system, its layout and the acoustic space you are trying to work in. Typically you can expect 3 to 12 dB improvement in gain before feedback.
If you are also using Line 6 speakers I would recommend shutting the Feedback switches to off and let the mixer do the work.
Posted 03 September 2013 - 08:00 AM
As Don points out you need to use less aggressive FBS settings for instruments (universal) or you'll get some weird side effects happening. For the acoustic guitar issue I would try using the PARA EQ to try to tame it... They tend to be too boomy anyway on he lower strings. Depending on what notes are actually feeding back either notch them (likely somewhere between 185 and 220hz) or even try a gentle shelf EQ from 220hz down and lower the whol range til you get a nice even sound, which should help deal with the feedback as well.
Posted Yesterday, 12:43 PM
A suggestion that I would offer when chasing down feedback. Mute the other channels when ringing in a particular channel. I can't tell you the time that I've spent trying to get rid of feedback on one channel, only to find that an open mic or instrument somewhere else on the stage was actually feeding back while I was trying to dial in the first channel.
Now I start by muting all the other input channels. Getting control of the feedback on the channel that I'm working on, then as a last step, unmute each of the other channel one at a time. If you get feedback when un-muting one of the other channels, then you can start on that channel for your next channel to test. Mute all of the other channel and repeat.
Posted Today, 01:02 AM
I have no solution for the FBS not working, but just want to throw in some thoughts on feedback issues:
I found out that using Line Array type of Speakers are VERY prone to feedback (No matter if using an analogue Soundcraft desk, a behringer Xenyx something analogue desk or the M20d), just hold a mic or acoustic guitar somewhere near the speaker (even 30-40 centimeter will do the trick, no matter if on the side or behind the speaker) and off goes the typical "hummm" or "hiss". At the Moment we are using H&K Soundcaddys. As said before until last year we gigged with an analogue Soundcraft EFX-8 from one of our guitarists and now with my M20d. We had feedback issues every time during our last gigs, no matter if using the new M20d or the old desk. Mainly the feedback is coming from one of the acoustic guitars which is using a combination of Piezo and microphone pickup. Unfortunately we cannot get the guitarist away from using one of the soundcaddys also as his monitor and he is always sitting just on the side of the soundcaddy. Bad augury, I know.
BUT: I used the preset for acoustic guitar direct for his Martin, which was not having ths FBS on the channel strip. Changed that to acoustic mic´d preset, which is featuring the FBS on the Strip by default. Looking forward to hear the difference at the next gig.
I´m also looking Forward to buy some L3T and use these on our gigs. Hope it will be a big improvement over the Soundcaddys, because our Soundcaddy Line Arrays are not designed to work as monitor AND FOH at the same time IMHO
So, my conclusion is: OUR feedback issues are related to combination of ignorance, too less knowledge of the M20d and not the right use of our equipment, and isn´t really to blame on the M20d or the FBS built-in. Nevertheless our Sound has improved tremendiously since using the M20d
What we did and will do once again in the next few weeks is a technical rehearsal where we are going to test some new setups I have created and just Play around with all the Options the M20d offers until everyone in the band is satisfied with his and the Overall Sound of FOH and monitors. We can Play around without time pressure during the soundcheck before a gig. Maybe this is also an Option for you to just get together with the band and Play around with your Options until everyone in the band is satisfied and you can reduce or even eleminate feedback issues. At least this will give you a good Basic Setup for the next gig with only a little (or in some venues a little bit more) tweaking necessary.
Posted Today, 09:18 AM
If switching the piezo channel to include FBS didn't help much then you have a very difficult problem. That would mean that the sound back to the guitar is so loud that is is resonating the body back into the saddle pickup. Have you tried a Feedback Buster plug in the sound hole?
Posted Today, 03:34 PM
Get your backline players to reduce their on-stage volumes AND direct their cabs away from FOH so it is there purely for them. Now try doing an initial soundcheck with just vocal monitoring and backline (leave the FOH off at this stage), getting the monitors to a point where your singer(s) are happy. If you then "push" the monitors up an extra 5-10db with singers in place behind their mics, you'll likely induce the worst of the feedback frequencies for the M20 to notch out and can then drop the levels back down. Then record something.
The last time we ran the rig out, we did just that. Singers happy and on-stage levels sensible. We then did a basic mix in headphoneswith the recording before heading out front with everyone to tweak the mix and set FOH levels. Aside from a few inevitable whistles early doors ( as the room acoustics had changed with people) the M20 notched out the extra frequencies pretty quick. We were complimented on two fronts... how good we sounded AND on how sensible our overall volume was. Loud enough to be enjoyable but not so loud that people had to shout to each other to be heard.
My only gripe at present is a bass player who tweaks his bass guitar volume control during the set... we've a full gigs worth of recordings where his levels start out great but by the end of the first set his input has got too hot and is distorting.
Posted Today, 04:23 PM
But I totally agree. Feedback is drive by people being too loud, and often the guitar player (waaaay more than us bass players!). Then the vocal wedge is never loud enough.
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