Want to trigger patch/effects changes via Logic (HD PRO)

[dryicekills]

I'm fronting an acoustic rock/folk band, and I've been using some effects on the HD Pro to really liven up the sound of both vocals and guitar (dual patch). However, singing and playing the parts sometimes prove too much when trying to trigger these changes. If I wanted to trigger all of my effect/path changes from a DAW session running click tracks, where would I start? I'm totally new to MIDI. I know that the POD doesn't act as a MIDI interface on its own. Would one of those M-Audio Uno cables do the trick? and where do I start within the session? Thanks.

[duncann]

At minimum, you'd want something listed here. I use a cheap one with an HD500X and Reaper with no problems.

 

Then take a look at appendix B of the advanced user guide for the specific information about CC#s, PC messages, etc.

 

Not exactly sure what Click Tracks is or how it might affect your DAW's use of outgoing midi messages, but you'll also have to figure out the actual sending of midi from whatever DAW you use.

[sixstringsk]

I do this in Logic with excellent results.  I setup my backing tracks including some keyboard parts, guitar rhythm when I'm playing solo and other parts to better fill out our songs.  I also do all of my MIDI programming within the program.  I bounce all of the audio and export the MIDI tracks into Ableton Live when I perform though.

 

I'm sure there could be easier ways to do this, but I've been doing it this way so long and it works for my purposes.

 

1: To setup in Logic you will need to view the event list by choosing Show>View List Editors.

2: In this Event List you program your changes.  Set your playhead at the position along the timeline when you want a change to occur.

3: In this next step I am referring to Logic 10.  I remember the view looking slightly different in Logic 9, but I can't remember exactly the difference.  Anyway, you will want to select "Controller" in the drop down next the the plus sign.  Then press the plus sign to add and event.

4: Edit the event added accordingly.  The channel (Ch column) will need to match what you have assigned within your HD Pro.  Click and hold the number while you move your mouse up or down to change.  The Num column is the MIDI CC that is sent out to make the changes.  MIDI CC #51 corresponds to footswitch FS1, #52 to footswitch FS2, and so on through FS8 on the Pod.  I have a Pod HD500X which, of course, has footswitches.  I know the HD Pro doesn't have footswitches, but I assume you can still program them?  The next column is Val.  Change the number to 127 if you want to turn the effect ON and set it to 0 if your want to turn it OFF.

 

I hope this helps.  I'm just unsure of the footswitch assignment functions within the HD Pro if they are different from the 500X.  If the editing pages are the same, then I believe this will set you in the right direction.

 

Regards,

 

Shane

[dryicekills]

@shane Thank you, that is definitely a good start. Though I'm curious, why do you use Ableton for the live set? I've never used the program at all, only logic, so any input helps. I am also planning to use my interface (getting a Saffire Pro 40) as a way to send two independent monitor mixes to in-ears for myself and the other guitarist. For this reason, I assumed Logic would be my best bet.

[sixstringsk]

Logic is definitely a great DAW and it is my preference when making music.  But, Ableton Live is such a great tool in a live setting for performance.  Live has this session view which lets you load scenes.  Each scene is basically a song and can be fired (played) individually.  So you can build a whole set, or in my case our entire song database, and it has endless possibilities.  Within each scene you can load multiple audio and MIDI tracks and route them to your hearts desire.   I also have MIDI tracks with pre-programmed lighting firing off in time with the song's backing track.  I have a MIDI clip that changes my POD HD500X within the song.  I have another clip that makes changes to a TC Helicon VoiceLive unit adding harmonies or other vocal effects in time with the backing track.  

 

Ableton also has the ability to be MIDI mapped, meaning each scene can be externally "fired" from my POD or any other MIDI capable device.  My band is on in-ears too and I have the CLICK audio routed to them.  The AUDIO files are routed to the FOH.

 

Now, Ableton is not for everyone and it isn't free.  You can do all of this within Logic.  In my opinion, it's just more cumbersome.  I've read of people doing so and they have all of their songs within Logic along the timeline one right after the other.  They user markers to identify each song's starting point and skip between the markers to play the song they wish.

 

Here is a great resource that I used to get started with Ableton Live.

[dryicekills]

Logic is definitely a great DAW and it is my preference when making music.  But, Ableton Live is such a great tool in a live setting for performance.  Live has this session view which lets you load scenes.  Each scene is basically a song and can be fired (played) individually.  So you can build a whole set, or in my case our entire song database, and it has endless possibilities.  Within each scene you can load multiple audio and MIDI tracks and route them to your hearts desire.   I also have MIDI tracks with pre-programmed lighting firing off in time with the song's backing track.  I have a MIDI clip that changes my POD HD500X within the song.  I have another clip that makes changes to a TC Helicon VoiceLive unit adding harmonies or other vocal effects in time with the backing track.  

 

Ableton also has the ability to be MIDI mapped, meaning each scene can be externally "fired" from my POD or any other MIDI capable device.  My band is on in-ears too and I have the CLICK audio routed to them.  The AUDIO files are routed to the FOH.

 

Now, Ableton is not for everyone and it isn't free.  You can do all of this within Logic.  In my opinion, it's just more cumbersome.  I've read of people doing so and they have all of their songs within Logic along the timeline one right after the other.  They user markers to identify each song's starting point and skip between the markers to play the song they wish.

 

Here is a great resource that I used to get started with Ableton Live.

 

Thanks again. Does Ableton lend itself to be run as a mixer for in-ears as well? Since we don't have an external mixer, that is another goal of mine. I planned on running Logic with live tracks routed to a bus for each member, then out to my Saffire Pro to serve as independent mixes.

[sixstringsk]

I would think this is possible.  In Ableton, you can route each audio track to a different output.  So, it seems like what you want to do can be accomplished.  We do use a mixer and I route all in-ear audio (CLICK and CUES) to an output on my audio interface that feeds a channel on my mixer.  This channel is then only sent out to our in-ear transmitter.  I have all of my FOH audio combined into one track in Ableton and it is then routed to a different channel on my mixer.  We do have a bit of this audio fed to our in-ears as well, along with being sent to the FOH speakers.  You can have multiple tracks in Ableton.  So, for instance, you could have BASS, KEYS, BACKING VOX, EXTRA GUITARS, etc. loaded into separate tracks within Ableton and then sent to as many outputs as your interface allows.  By the way, I'm speaking of using the Session view in Ableton.  There is also an Arrangement view that is more similar to any other DAW.  I don't use the Arrangement view.

 

In Ableton you wouldn't need to use a bus, the routing for each track has it's own output parameters.

 

But, like I said earlier... you can accomplish this within Logic.  It's just not a great "performance" DAW in my opinion.  Ableton Live is most certainly designed for performing live with it.  It's also on sale right now for 30% off and there is a demo to try it.

 

Good luck to ya!