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4cm Using Hd500 And Blackstar Stage 60


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#1 windhover

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 08:27 PM

Firstly, let me say a big thank you to Jim Reynolds, without the 4CM resources he has posted on this forum I don't think I would have known where to start.

 

Thought I would post my experience using this method with my Blackstar stage 60 combo....

 

I put a basic patch together following Jim's instructions and began to tweak. After a while I realised I didn't need the studio EQ to boost the signal from the pod ( hooray! another block free for more effects) and also didn't need to adjust the levels in the mixer. So that was it with the Blackstar, just connect up the cables and it was good to go. The master on the pod needs to be at about 2 o clock to keep my volume levels at roughly what they would be without the pod.

 

So there you go, the only tweaking I now need to do is the fun kind - playing with all the effects in combination with the amp channels...


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#2 fechart

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 10:14 AM

Hello there,

 

I´m glad you are happy with your new setup...

 

The only thing that catches my attention is that you aren´t needing the Studio EQ to boost your signal... the POD´s FX Loop is really a tone and signal level sucker. Did you take a good listen to your amp´s "natural" sound compared with the sound when connecting the POD? There must be a difference.

 

Personally I use a DI Box between the amp´s FX Send and the POD FX Return to achieve two things:

 

1. Avoid tone and signal level sucking

2. Level the volumes of my amp´s preamp and the models in the POD (amp´s preamp MUCH higher than POD´s models)

 

It works well for me, my amp´s FX Loop is serial and I have a FX Mix knob (from wet to dry).

 

With this setup I don´t need the Studio EQ to boost the signal, despite I sometimes use it just to give more gain to my amp´s preamp or some stompboxes I have.

 

So... welcome to the 4CM world!

 

Cheers!


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#3 windhover

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 06:24 PM

Hi fechart, thanks for the reply.

 

That was exactly my reason for posting, no Studio eq boost required at all. I've just done another A/B and to my ears can hear absolutely no reduction in tone or signal with the POD.

 

I've had my POD for under a year, maybe there's been a fix? Believe me, i was surprised as anyone when it just worked as advertised!

 

Do I understand from your post that you are somehow incorporating the POD pre-amp models into your 4CM setup, how does that work?

 

All the best


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#4 fechart

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Posted 28 July 2013 - 11:33 AM

Hi Windhover!

 

I´m glad that you got rid of the Studio EQ with good results :)

 

I don´t use the POD´s preamp models, I use the full models + cab sims. Just works better for me... That´s when I bypass my "real" amp´s preamp (that´s to say, not inserting the FX LOOP Block in the chain).

 

Most of the time I just insert the FX LOOP in the chain and use my "real" amp´s preamp and enjoy my Laney TT50C dirt, adding effects and EQ from the POD.

 

I have several stompboxes too, so I take my dirt from them or from the amp´s channels 2 & 3. Practically never use the POD models. My ears are used to valves and analog pedals!

 

Here I paste a block diagram showing you how I connect all. If you would like to share info about the 4CM, please contact me here or at fechart@yahoo.es

 

Cheers!

 

4CM_zps295cd319.jpg


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#5 windhover

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Posted 28 July 2013 - 02:19 PM

Thanks mate, that makes sense to me now. If you take out the loop on the POD you have guitar - POD - power amp. For some reason I was thinking using 4CM would take away this option.

That's how I've been using the POD up until now but was finding my tone too compressed somehow. It would sound ok (ish) at home but with a band it just didn't seem to cut through the mix. It sounded much worse with the cab modelling on interestingly. I guess the POD interracts with different amps very differently and you just have to tweak it to your own setup/ears.

 

Thanks for making me realise I still have both options in 4CM though, that's great!


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#6 fechart

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Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:49 PM

The POD adds compression to the tone, and I agree with you that with bedroom levels that´s OK-ish, but live... it´s another story.

 

The tone yeah, depends a lot on the amp, your ears, your guitars, and lots of factors...

 

With the full models/pre models issue, as well as with the cab sims thing, you have to try. There depends a LOT on your "real" amp and speakers (I guess with a full or half stack you don´t need cab sims!)

 

And finally yes, with the 4CM you have the 2 options, going with the POD straight to the Power Amp stage using the models provided by the POD, or adding the FX LOOP and using your "real" amp´s preamp. The concept of the 4CM is that you have your "real" amp´s preamp in the loop of the POD, and the POD straight to the Power Amp stage... that´s why you should use the COMBO OR STACK POWER AMP Output Mode on the POD, despite many people here prefer using STUDIO/DIRECT...

 

Good luck bro, I´m glad that I could help.

 

Cheers!


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