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Great Comparison V1.9 Vs 2.0


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#1 vjclaus

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 01:53 AM

Somebody at youtube started a real great comparison between v1.9 vs 2.0

 

for me the 1,9 works better

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=stlVpOJLzPk


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#2 hurghanico

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 02:22 AM

Somebody at youtube started a real great comparison between v1.9 vs 2.0

 

for me the 1,9 works better

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=stlVpOJLzPk

 

thanks for the above link

IMO the  2.0 Les Paul is a good one

the Strat 1.9 is better than 2.0

and the 2.0  335 and 175 seem almost toys in comparison with those of the 1.9


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#3 Junis

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 01:01 PM

I had sucess to solve one problem, put the marsonite plank body in all spank positions and sounded very good, in my opinion better than the spank of 1.9. but I do not have any idea to improve the semi, anyone?


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#4 Junis

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 01:04 PM

I just can not understand who insists that spank the 2.0 is better than 1.9, this video makes it very clear


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#5 TheRealZap

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 01:07 PM

I don't need a video to tell me that 2.0 is better than 1.9... my ears do that...

it's subjective is the point... i think you're wrong... you think i'm wrong... and in the end we're both right... because it's just an opinion.

 

I just can not understand who insists that spank the 2.0 is better than 1.9, this video makes it very clear


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#6 Junis

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 01:17 PM

but zap, watching this video, you really think the spank the 1.9 is better? I'm saying based on this video

I don't need a video to tell me that 2.0 is better than 1.9... my ears do that...

it's subjective is the point... i think you're wrong... you think i'm wrong... and in the end we're both right... because it's just an opinion.


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#7 phil_m

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 01:31 PM

In that video, the difference between 1.9 and 2.0 isn't that dramatic to me, but still, I think in general the HD just feel more realistic while playing. The sound is only one side of the playing experience. The way the guitar reacts to my playing is just as important.
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#8 ozbadman

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 01:55 PM

but zap, watching this video, you really think the spank the 1.9 is better? I'm saying based on this video


"Video? We don't need no stinking video" :)
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#9 TheRealZap

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 02:04 PM

just for the sake of speaking about it intelligently... i watched the video... and yes 2.0 still wins by a mile...

the muddy mids in 1.9 never really bothered me... but side by side... 2.0 pulled out the earplugs for me and sounds much cleaner and defined.

again just my opinion... yours is worth as much... 

but zap, watching this video, you really think the spank the 1.9 is better? I'm saying based on this video


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#10 guilhordas

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 03:10 PM

Zap,just now I see, very nice your semi upgrade, great, I got the 5 positions , so that now the semi were much higher than the other models, this normal? you set the other to balance with the semi?


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#11 TheRealZap

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 03:58 PM

I used the LP humbuckers for the 335, and the special p90s for the casino, which are a little hotter themselves, but then i changed some pot/cap values to smooth it off.

I tend to make them run a little higher volume wise, because i tend to use the volume control to roll those down a little as well.. just gives it a little more dynamic throw on the volume control. I didn't balance them with any of the other models... just made the semi models work in and of themselves :)

thanks for checking them out.

you can of course adjust the preset volume easy enough without disturbing the core tone.


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#12 anonyrat

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 04:53 PM

Well the video just proved to me what my own observations were when I upgraded.

1: Of the electrics, except the LP and the new Casino which I really like a lot, they were all insipid sounding and

2: Low on volume. Using the presets in the HD500 that I was using for 1.9 Most of the electrics were way down on what I had before.

(Now on a lot of the single coiled guitars I was doubling-up on a position - i.e. two bridge tele pickups at the bridge in exactly the same position.

I have moded nealy all the v2.0 guitars that way plus most I have upped from 4db to 6db to get back to par with 1.9)

3: Maybe it is just me but on my pre 2.0 guitars I am sure they were all Linear but the v2.0 all seem audio

4: Again to me some of the neck positions sound more trebly than v1.9


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#13 silverhead

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 05:32 PM

Well the video just proved to me what my own observations were when I upgraded.

1: Of the electrics, except the LP and the new Casino which I really like a lot, they were all insipid sounding and

2: Low on volume. Using the presets in the HD500 that I was using for 1.9 Most of the electrics were way down on what I had before.

(Now on a lot of the single coiled guitars I was doubling-up on a position - i.e. two bridge tele pickups at the bridge in exactly the same position.

I have moded nealy all the v2.0 guitars that way plus most I have upped from 4db to 6db to get back to par with 1.9)

3: Maybe it is just me but on my pre 2.0 guitars I am sure they were all Linear but the v2.0 all seem audio

4: Again to me some of the neck positions sound more trebly than v1.9

 

I think those are great personal observations. You don't say whether you plan to use v1.9 or v2.0 going forward, but your observations certainly illustrate that the move from 1.9 to 2.0 requires a commitment to tweak existing presets (either HD500 or JTV) in order to 'get back to par'.

 

What I think it boils down to is this: if you're happy with par and want to remain there, then stay at 1.9 and continue to use your existing HD500 presets. When I say 'you' here and in the following I mean the general You, not you specifically anonyrat.

 

However, if you want to take advantage of the new HD modeling (now being applied to guitars as it was earlier to amps) then you will need to adjust to the new modeling. By 'take advantage' I am not referring to the new stock models in v2.0. I am referring to the new DSP engine - most notably the increased dynamics of the HD modeling. There is ,imho, much more realistic sensitivity of the guitar models to aggressive strumming and picking, and more realistic behaviour of the Tone control knob at the upper end, not to mention the enhancements of Workbench HD.  I think most people would agree that the playing dynamics are improved - you can really hear the amp responding much better now to the 'digging in' when you are playing.

 

But if your goal is to reproduce exactly the same v1.9 tones, using the same HD500 presets..... well, then, you don't need or want v2.0. How lucky! You avoid any need for upgrading and tweaking. On the other hand, you compromise on playing dynamics. There is no right or wrong choice here; to each their own.


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#14 clay-man

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 06:28 PM

I don't need a video to tell me that 2.0 is better than 1.9... my ears do that...

it's subjective is the point... i think you're wrong... you think i'm wrong... and in the end we're both right... because it's just an opinion.

 

I like these videos because it helps tell me if I should bother buying a JTV to step up from my 600.

 

One of the reasons why I was so comfortable with getting an old Variax in place of a JTV is because the modeling technology is the same before the HD update came.

The HD update might be a real game changer in the modeling guitar race, and it definitely catches my eye and makes me wish i had a JTV more.

 

I knew it was unrealistic for me to get 1.4k for a 69s maple neck.


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#15 TheRealZap

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 06:30 PM

not knocking the video at all... think its great when people take their time and put these together... not everyone has multiple variaxes etc.


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#16 anonyrat

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 08:15 PM

You don't say whether you plan to use v1.9 or v2.0 going forward, but your observations certainly illustrate that the move from 1.9 to 2.0 requires a commitment to tweak existing presets (either HD500 or JTV) in order to 'get back to par'.

 

 

Good question. I think I will be happy with v2.1 :)  As to get back to par I really have never been at par - every v1.9 patch was tweaked - some v2.0 are tweaked.

Yes I like the new dynamics but what good are dynamics when a) the sound is wrong (ES-335 I have one and can do A/B comps L6 sounds like a low pass filter has been applied) B) The volumes too low - There is a lot of difference between the Variax sounds and the mag PUs. 


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#17 germanicus

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 09:19 PM

thanks for the above link

IMO the  2.0 Les Paul is a good one

the Strat 1.9 is better than 2.0

and the 2.0  335 and 175 seem almost toys in comparison with those of the 1.9

 

100% agree. 

The new strat is way too thin. Much rather have the one from 1.9 available in the firmware.


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#18 dkemusic

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 01:15 AM

Personally I don't think the video is really making a fair comparison.  It's common knowledge many of the 2.0 models are lower in volume, comparing them without compensating for the volume difference between the 2 is not a valid comparison IMO.  You can't make comparisons just plugging the guitars in, you need to also set the amp up for the guitar.

 

That said the more I use 2.0 the more I notice that particularly the G thru hi E strings are too low even compared to low E thru D and some models those strings don't even sound like they are on the same guitar.

 

Overall I still think 2.0 is quite an improvement on the most of the models, but I do think the volume and balance need to be tweaked on quite a few of the models, the strats, semi's, and rbilly's in particular.  I hope that is something that the next update covers, It's quite evident in the video as well that the top strings are lacking balance (at least to me).

 

Dan


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#19 hurghanico

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 01:53 AM

...I am referring to the new DSP engine - most notably the increased dynamics of the HD modeling. There is ,imho, much more realistic sensitivity of the guitar models to aggressive strumming and picking, and more realistic behaviour of the Tone control knob at the upper end, not to mention the enhancements of Workbench HD.  I think most people would agree that the playing dynamics are improved - you can really hear the amp responding much better now to the 'digging in' when you are playing...

 

I may be wrong, but I believe that emulate a tube amp is much more complex than emulate a guitar, especially for how much concerns the dynamics ..and so I imagine that a good tube amp emulation requires much more programmer work time than a guitar emulation to get the job done..

 

It seems to me that the main difference in the modeling between a jtv and a first generation Variax is due mainly to the management of the alt tunings, that in the last generation certainly requires more DSP power ..

 

when came out the POD HD series the HD amp models were already present in the devices.. and I absolutely agree, they are 100% HD in comparison with the oldest ones.. especially for the dynamics..

why the Variax HD guitar models come out only now after years from the first jtv release? .. strange! .. no?

 

what qualifies the new guitar models as HD?

 

sincerely I would like to see evidence that the HD dynamics are so improved in the last 2.0 fw, and that it is not only a different makeup of overtones and volumes that changed so far (and mostly for the worse, I would say)..


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#20 infor-bumeran

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 02:10 AM

that video does not do justice to the actual sounds v.2 looks worse and interpretation in different settings,

working a bit in the HD version sounds far exceeds the old version


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#21 hurghanico

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 03:21 AM

that video does not do justice to the actual sounds v.2 looks worse and interpretation in different settings,

working a bit in the HD version sounds far exceeds the old version

 

I would like to believe what you say.. really!!
but with the HD500 it was love at first sight, though not without some initial little difficulties ..

and more or less the same thing happened with my Variax 700 ..
but for this 2.0 fw I do not feel even a little initial attraction
to start with.. at the moment..

which for me translates in: wait to buy a jtv until they release significant better electric models than my 700..


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#22 arislaf

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:00 AM

hurghanico, about the 700...Comparing the jtv with the 700 is 2 different worlds.Sure the electronics of the 700 were not supperior of the jtv, but there was not any lag at all...And the feel of the guitar (700) was much more better that the jtv.Although the sound of the jtv captures the correct tones of the modeled guitars, the 700 captured the soul of the guitars..You know it is not a stratocaster, but is the soul of the strat, and in some tonalities better and worse than the strat...700 had it's own character...

And the acoustics (for me) were much more better than the jtv's...And the feel of the 700.. O my god...so nice...I spent countless hours with it...As for the pick ups that not exist, for me it was better, it gave a unique character to the guitar..

 

For the point:

 

JTV 2.0 is more realistic sounded than the 1.9, but after downgrading to 1.9 and comparing, i found that the 1.9 is better than the 2.0..

At least (for me) I have more sounds to use.


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#23 Junis

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:29 AM

I'd love to see a video comparing the 700(or 500,300) with the Variax JTV


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#24 hurghanico

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:43 AM

...Although the sound of the jtv captures the correct tones of the modeled guitars, the 700 captured the soul of the guitars..You know it is not a stratocaster, but is the soul of the strat, and in some tonalities better and worse than the strat...700 had it's own character...

And the acoustics (for me) were much more better than the jtv's...

 

maybe I need just the soul and not too much realism.. who knows?!!.. on what it depends

the only thing I know is that many 700 sounds still makes me enjoy, and what I hear in the 2.0 demos not as much..

therefore if the well captured soul is the magic ingredient: long live the soul!!


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#25 phil_m

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:25 AM

sincerely I would like to see evidence that the HD dynamics are so improved in the last 2.0 fw, and that it is not only a different makeup of overtones and volumes that changed so far (and mostly for the worse, I would say)..

 

 

You're welcome to your opinion, but I'd say your opinion is extremely short-sighted without having actually played a JTV with the HD models firsthand. You're basing it on a few Youtube videos and clips and whatnot. I'd say you have you to play a guitar to know if you like it.

 

Personally, I think the HD models are a whole other playing experience to the first gen of modeling. I had a Variax 300 for a while, but I never got to the place where I could play it consistently because while I thought it sounded OK, it always felt like I was making quite a trade-off between playing it and the real thing. I think there's always going to be some trade-off, but the question is how big can we tolerate. With the HD models, though, I feel the gap has gotten pretty small. There are some models where I can tell very little difference between the JTV and the real thing.


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#26 hurghanico

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:28 AM

I'd love to see a video comparing the 700(or 500,300) with the Variax JTV

 

me too,

 

time ago there was a video comparing the 700 to a jtv (but obviously with an old fw) done by forum member called "merlin"

I'll try to find it and post it here if it still exists somewhere..

 

in the meantime maybe you could find interesting to watch this video comparing the 1.9 fw JTV to the real things..

 

(As you will note, them same fragments of songs are played in both videos)

 

 

update:

 

still the same guy comparing a 500 to a JTV supposedly with the old 1.9 fw

 


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#27 Junis

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:40 AM

cool, I had already seen this video, and this video, except for the 335. jazztone 4 and strat, I consider the 2.0 far superior in every way ,but the strat with marsenite plank body is better than 1.9, test! and semi with ZAP upgrade is very good

I made confusion,I had already seen this video, but I'm talking about another of this same guy he compares the 1.9 to 2.0


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#28 hurghanico

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:40 AM

...You're welcome to your opinion, but I'd say your opinion is extremely short-sighted without having actually played a JTV with the HD models firsthand. You're basing it on a few Youtube videos and clips and whatnot. I'd say you have you to play a guitar to know if you like it...

 

maybe you're right, but the Variax undoubtedly also serves to record, and I do not like the recorded sounds I'm hearing around, and I prefer the older ones ..
unfortunately at the moment I have not the chance to try a jtv already updated but I can hear how it sounds when recorded, and for me is not encouraging..

this my short-sighted opinion.. sorry!


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#29 Junis

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 07:00 AM

would have been nice if the line 6, before the release hd, had done research with consumers to know which models should change or not? I know that maybe this is impossible but it would have been cool


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#30 stevekc

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 08:11 AM

I have 2 variaxs

After trying the HD 2.0 update on one for a while Im reverting both back to 1.9 or possibly 1.72

 

Im not hearing anything in HD 2.0 but hype myself. Even a 7 year old VG-99 does much better guitar modeling than HD 2.0


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#31 vjclaus

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 09:22 AM

me too, i roll back to 1.72 with the old acoustic sounds and i tweak the eq´s on the fx-rack higher(presence!). the guitar works good for me.

i think a softwareupdate is a good thing, if there were huge improvement, but you listen to the comparison of v1.9 vs 2.0 and v 1.9 to old v500, the difference is not very big.

Cause everytime you change your settings (update)  you´ll have to change (tweak) your sounds to your personal taste, and in the end it´s more an "tweaking" than an guitarplaying!

 

i always say: never change a winning system - don´t tweak to much --> play your guitar (it´s all in your fingers)

 

greetings vjclaus


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#32 johnbartus

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 11:04 AM

The comparison video totally reflects my experience with HD 2.0 models vs. 1.9 -- most notably the Spank models. I have played Strats onstage and in the studio for more than 30 years. I've owned more Strats than I care to remember, with both maple and rosewood fingerboards, ash and alder bodies, stock alnico/DiMarzio/Vintage Noiseless/EMG/Texas Special pickups, classic vibrato/American Deluxe vibrato/Kahler vibrato/hardtail. I have built a couple of custom Franken-Strats as well. I also own a Variax 600, 300, 700 Acoustic, JTV-69, and JTV-89. And a Pod HD500 that I'm just getting into. I like my Variaxes for the versatility I can have at a gig or in the studio. But for sheer playing joy, I love my Strats. That being said...

 

The HD 2.0 Spank models do not sound like any Strat I have ever played or owned. The 1.9 models are far more accurate in recreating the Strat tones I rely on. As I mentioned before, the video is only a confirmation of my actual experience with the new HD models, and why I downgraded back to 1.9.

 

And I certainly agree with what many have posted about the 335 models... what happened there?  :unsure:

 

Yes, tone is a subjective thing, YMMV, etc. But take people who have played Strats for years, decades -- and have them do a blind test on 1.9 vs. 2.0. I bet at least 9 out of 10 will prefer 1.9. HD Spank ≠ Strat.

 

Looking forward to HD Version 2.x...

;) 


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#33 phil_m

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 11:21 AM

Yes, tone is a subjective thing, YMMV, etc. But take people who have played Strats for years, decades -- and have them do a blind test on 1.9 vs. 2.0. I bet at least 9 out of 10 will prefer 1.9. HD Spank ≠ Strat.

 

Looking forward to HD Version 2.x...

;)

 

 

Did you see the post I made comparing the Variax Spank model to a real Strat? They were pretty darn close. The biggest difference to me actually was the output level. The Variax model is a little hotter than the real thing, but that can vary from Strat to Strat.

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, per se, but I don't how you can say the HD Spank isn't accurate.


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#34 jdenkevitz

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 11:21 AM

The comparison video totally reflects my experience with HD 2.0 models vs. 1.9 -- most notably the Spank models. I have played Strats onstage and in the studio for more than 30 years. I've owned more Strats than I care to remember, with both maple and rosewood fingerboards, ash and alder bodies, stock alnico/DiMarzio/Vintage Noiseless/EMG/Texas Special pickups, classic vibrato/American Deluxe vibrato/Kahler vibrato/hardtail. I have built a couple of custom Franken-Strats as well. I also own a Variax 600, 300, 700 Acoustic, JTV-69, and JTV-89. And a Pod HD500 that I'm just getting into. I like my Variaxes for the versatility I can have at a gig or in the studio. But for sheer playing joy, I love my Strats. That being said...

 

The HD 2.0 Spank models do not sound like any Strat I have ever played or owned. The 1.9 models are far more accurate in recreating the Strat tones I rely on. As I mentioned before, the video is only a confirmation of my actual experience with the new HD models, and why I downgraded back to 1.9.

 

And I certainly agree with what many have posted about the 335 models... what happened there?  :unsure:

 

Yes, tone is a subjective thing, YMMV, etc. But take people who have played Strats for years, decades -- and have them do a blind test on 1.9 vs. 2.0. I bet at least 9 out of 10 will prefer 1.9. HD Spank ≠ Strat.

 

Looking forward to HD Version 2.x...

;)

 

The new strat sounds nothing like my actual strat. Obviously, like almost any type of guitar, there can be tremendous variation tonally between models from different years and specifications. However, 2.0 Strat sounds like it has a balsa wood body.

 

I really do not care if its a more accurate 'HD' replication of the guitar they used.

 

 

Let L6 know. Heres a topic I started asking for the capacity to load older models...

 

http://line6.com/sup...e-in-workbench/


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#35 hurghanico

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 11:47 AM

I'm not saying you're wrong, per se, but I don't how you can say the HD Spank isn't accurate.

 

maybe they used your strat to do the new modeling??.. ah ah.. just joking here.. but.. who knows?!?!. .or maybe they used another very similar guitar?

I agree that the 2.0 spank is very close to your strat, but that doesn't mean that it sounds better than the previous 1.9 model..

I see many customers here me included who prefer the previous strat sound, maybe that's not important for Line6 but IMO it should be so in case we were the majority


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#36 Bobbyl

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 12:51 PM

As I always say-The HD strat and 335 are not guitars I would buy in the real world. The 1.9 strat and 335 are guitars I would buy in the real world.


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#37 Junis

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 02:01 PM

I already am becoming boring saying the same thing, but I insist, try to put the marsonite planks body in place spank body, I found that much improvement.
My final opinion, after several gigs is that strat, 335 and jazztones worsened much but the rest of the models are much better, despite the very low volume in comparison to 1.9


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#38 arislaf

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 02:06 PM

I would say that the jazzies got better on th v.2 IMHO, but all in all, v.1.9 was better...I try to udjust on v.2 for the moment..


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#39 Junis

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 02:10 PM

something I've been thinking too, I think the delay for this update was so, we have created a huge expectation, that would be the greatest wonder of the world, and despite the advances, some models walked back and disappointed


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#40 jdenkevitz

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 04:00 PM

The Masonite body is a good substitute when used with the Strat pickups. 

I also recommend folks drop the resistance on the Tone control to darken the sound more akin to the 1.9.


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