Tap Tempo/Tuner Switch Issue

[Euanh91]

Hi all!

So I've been gigging consistently (6 nights a week) with my Helix ever since the beginning of February and it's been perfect, bar one issue that started a few months ago. 

My tap tempo switch seems to be failing to correctly sense my taps, if you get what I mean. When I press and hold for the tuner, sometimes the tuner won't turn on at all.. sometimes it will, but will turn off again as soon as I lift my foot. When I use the tap tempo function, it almost always either drops the tempo to the lowest possible value (20), or raises it to the highest possible value (240).

It's like it fails to sense some of my taps, while also sensing taps I haven't done. Just got a mind of it's own to be honest.


Anyway, anyone else had a similar issue? I figured it could be just wear and tear (I use it a fair amount every night) unless it's a software issue and the switch itself is physically fine. 

Any ideas? Do I just need a new switch?

Thanks!

[mkornell]

Yeah, sounds like a a bad microswitch due to wear and tear. When you step on a footswitch, it pushes a plunger down onto a microswitch on a circuit board inside the unit. The behaviour you describe is a classic failure mode for those little things.

 

If your Helix is still in warranty, you should be able to get it fixed for free. If not, any competent guitar service shop could replace it. (And if they can't, they're not competent.) And if you're handy with a soldering iron, the DIY route is an option.

 

Over 10 years, I had to replace 7 or 8 of these microswitches on a previous MFX unit. The bulk of the work lies in disassembling and reassembling the unit. The work with the soldering iron takes about 20 seconds.

[soblivion]

I've had this same issue on the HD500. It got to the point where the tuner would engage on it's own. I was able to get it repaired under warranty.

 

I later got the HD500x and it never failed, but I did lose the "clickiness" of the button.

Fortunately you can get a replacement board here:

http://www.fullcompass.com/prod/280562-Line-6-50-02-0234

or the individual switches:

http://www.fullcompass.com/prod/184172-Line-6-24-31-1105

 

Replacing the board is pretty easy. I'm going to work on replacing the switches on the original board as well. I don't know for sure, but I think the Helix uses the same switches(I may be  way off on that).

 

My question is can you use something like this with Helix?:

https://reverb.com/item/806628-one-trick-pony-tap-6-line-6-tap-tempo-controller-footswitch-by-molten-voltage

 

I use the tap tempo as much as some would use a wah. An external pedal would save a lot of wear and tear.

[jbuhajla]

Open a support ticket with Line 6. 

[JLondon]

I had the very same problem with mine and I mean, exactly.  Soooo frustrating!  Was about to send it in for repair when the next update came out.  I went ahead and updated first and the problem went away for some reason - I have no idea - above my pay grade.  A year and numerous updates later and I've never had the problem since.  I have no idea why, but it evidently wasn't the hardware.  I would suggest that you either do a factory reset or install/re-install the latest update before sending it in.  It's worth a try and you're most likely going to have to re-do your presets/irs anyway as I'm pretty sure it's the first thing Line-6 will do when checking it out anyway.

[weens]

interesting! I'm also having the problem where my tap tempo footswitch on my Helix LT will not tap in tempos correctly, no matter how you do it..... fast, slow, twice, three times, heck 10 times sometimes, etc. It is really a lucky draw as to whether the tempo will change.....sometimes it does, sometimes you have to just keep trying until it does. just awful.

 

also interesting to hear that a factory reset worked for you! I did the same thing (is that the one where you hold the two middle switches on the bottom row while powering on?), and the behaviour still persists. the line 6 guy i'm talking to in my support ticket is hopeless too, and is literally admitting that he can replicate the behaviour, and has nothing to say apart from "maybe tap 3 or 4 times, and sometimes it isn't instant". gee, ya think? haha. just unreal.

 

I may take matters into my own hands in the new year, and send it in to a nearby electronics place that services a lot of line 6 gear to see what they can do...

 

 

I had the very same problem with mine and I mean, exactly.  Soooo frustrating!  Was about to send it in for repair when the next update came out.  I went ahead and updated first and the problem went away for some reason - I have no idea - above my pay grade.  A year and numerous updates later and I've never had the problem since.  I have no idea why, but it evidently wasn't the hardware.  I would suggest that you either do a factory reset or install/re-install the latest update before sending it in.  It's worth a try and you're most likely going to have to re-do your presets/irs anyway as I'm pretty sure it's the first thing Line-6 will do when checking it out anyway.

[rzumwalt]

I have been having the same problem as well, and found this thread. Very helpful to all who answered. For those who had the problem, were you using firmware v 2.30 when it happened? I just got frustrated enough with mine to really pay it any attention, but it had been going on for a while, so I can't remember whether it started at the time of the last upgrade.

I just upgraded to 2.50 (didn't have my Helix with me for the last two weeks, or i would have done it sooner). I notice that it seems quite a bit better after the upgrade. (This is based on turning the tuner on and off several times and tapping in several different tempos for a total of about a minute and a half of testing, so not exactly a scientific experiment at this point.) However, my gut feeling is that a software glitch would either be corrected or not, it wouldn't be "mostly" better, and therefore it must just be coincidence that it is working better right now, and obviously will start working poorly again in the middle of my next performance. But that's a gut feeling because I don't have any knowledge or expertise with this sort of thing on which to base an actual opinion.

Has anyone noticed a similar "mostly" fixed tap tempo button when upgrading to 2.50, or is my gut feeling probably correct?

I will offer this advice to anyone who needs it, if it is mechanical: It seems to be more likely to occur when I press the switch all the way down, as opposed to stopping before it hits bottom. I can rest my foot on my pedal board and rock it forward onto the switch so that it goes down just past the point where it clicks, but doesn't go all the way to the bottom, and it seems to be most consistent when I do that.

[weens]

I have been having the same problem as well, and found this thread. Very helpful to all who answered. For those who had the problem, were you using firmware v 2.30 when it happened? I just got frustrated enough with mine to really pay it any attention, but it had been going on for a while, so I can't remember whether it started at the time of the last upgrade.

I just upgraded to 2.50 (didn't have my Helix with me for the last two weeks, or i would have done it sooner). I notice that it seems quite a bit better after the upgrade. (This is based on turning the tuner on and off several times and tapping in several different tempos for a total of about a minute and a half of testing, so not exactly a scientific experiment at this point.) However, my gut feeling is that a software glitch would either be corrected or not, it wouldn't be "mostly" better, and therefore it must just be coincidence that it is working better right now, and obviously will start working poorly again in the middle of my next performance. But that's a gut feeling because I don't have any knowledge or expertise with this sort of thing on which to base an actual opinion.

Has anyone noticed a similar "mostly" fixed tap tempo button when upgrading to 2.50, or is my gut feeling probably correct?

I will offer this advice to anyone who needs it, if it is mechanical: It seems to be more likely to occur when I press the switch all the way down, as opposed to stopping before it hits bottom. I can rest my foot on my pedal board and rock it forward onto the switch so that it goes down just past the point where it clicks, but doesn't go all the way to the bottom, and it seems to be most consistent when I do that.

 

Yep, you're right...... I also recently updated to 2.50, and they've definitely made it better. It's even in the update notes...... I'd like to think it had something to do with me hounding them on the support tickets XD. They did mention it would be something they would look at patching when I chatted to them in the support tickets.

 

I'm not sure exactly why it's semi-fixed now, but according to the update notes it has something to do with the unit not recognising any tempos that are tapped in slower than 40bpm. Previously it did, so it was constantly somehow fudging the tempo everytime you tapped it in. You can of course (if you really wanted to) set the helix's tempo to 40bpm and under manually via a knob, but honestly why would you...

 

I'm like you...... have just done a quick test for a few minutes by just tapping in various tempos, and it seemed to do a decent job at keeping up. Will have to wait till my next gig to truly put it to the test. This however begs the question of, how did this error exist in the first place?!? To me, this is absolutely unacceptable..... tap tempo is a fundamental feature of the helix, so much so that it is literally a bloody switch on the unit itself! How on earth does a multi million dollar company like Line 6 screw this up in the first place........did nobody test tap tempo? has nobody there ever used the dozens of existing delay (and other) pedals with tap tempo on them??? absolutely unreal right? haha. The meme "you had one job" comes to mind XD.... it's unacceptable to release a product to customers who've dropped that much money on a premium unit like the Helix and then have an arguably fundamental feature of the unit be totally broken

[rzumwalt]

Yep, you're right...... I also recently updated to 2.50, and they've definitely made it better. It's even in the update notes...... I'd like to think it had something to do with me hounding them on the support tickets XD. They did mention it would be something they would look at patching when I chatted to them in the support tickets.

 

[...]

Well, I guess I have you to thank then for raising the issue to them. I'm hesitant to call something "unacceptable" when it has to do with something way over my head. I still don't even understand how a programming error could even cause a glitch that seems to perfectly replicate a broken mechanical contact in the first place. I actually searched for this thread looking for a physical maintenance solution. But I get the frustration; it does seem like a pretty core function. 

I've now played with it for a couple hours and the tap tempo button still seems basically fixed. The last go around I could only get it to mess up once, and I was intentionally trying to replicate the behavior. So I'm not sure it was a glitch at all. I guess I'll try to remember to post back here in the future if anything changes.

[MGblade]

I also have issues with the tap tempo of my lt, i use it alot, pushing the knop and twisting it a couple of times seems to work for a while and then it starts to malfunction again, I also have to hit it fairly hard to work, had the same problem with my podhd500x, replaced the tactile switch abouth 5 times in that one.

now I found this https://goo.gl/images/46DLxb

midi tap tempo switch for line 6 devices.

ordered one yesterday.