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#1 Reason413

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 09:39 PM

I think Ron may be the one to help me with this....

 

when we play gigs, our gear consists of the following..

 

XDV-35 w/ Shure SM86 Capsule

XDV-30 w/ Shure SM86 Capsule

Shure PGX1 Wireless Guitar pack

Shure PGX wireless reciever

Apple Ipod...

 

The last few gigs there has been a problem where out of nowhere we get a loud SNAP ( like those snap firecracker things you throw down on the floor ) that comes through the speakers... most of the time, this happens one time and never happens again during the show...  There was no audio dropout at the time either...  lately its been a situation where the sound we get sound like when you uplug a microphone when the channel is still on....   Now  I am honestly thinking the true culrpit is the Shure Wireless Guitar   BUT I do think we had this happen recently when we went with the Ipod wired into the house snake through a D.I box and we had the issue...  It could be the Ipod but I doubt that...      What could this be??  

 

I've checked the battery compartments and the batteries are not shaking loose... my wireless capsules are screwed on tight and the wires that I can see on the element look fine as well.....  I also have used different XLR cables on both XDV recievers to rule out bad cables...   What could this be? how can I diagnose this ?  The sound guy tonight had no idea... we got the loud POP during sound check 3 times... and once during the performance we got the loud SNAP sound... but again.. there was no dropout in the sound at all so I'm not sure what do to or how I could even begin to troubleshoot..  I LOVE my XDV and the Condenser mic capsules on these have been the most impressive sounding mics I've come across,  So as I stated, I figure Ron Marton might be able to shed some light on this for me :) 


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#2 RonMarton

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 11:28 PM

I'm honestly quite humbled by your faith in me, Reason413...

 

...But in all good conscience must also point out that I very often get it wrong.

 

(Just as well really, because I feel that, among others, it's those challenges that keep us going.)

 

All I can ever do is point towards various things that I've been privileged to learn as a result of the boundless generosity countless others have granted me over the forty plus years that I've been professionally engaged in showbiz audio.

 

Now, ...to this particular challenge...

 

It strikes me that you were well on the way to solving it for yourself, as you've already adopted our primary diagnostic technique of systematically eliminating possible causes by methodically starting at the very source (the capsules) and working "downstream" from there through the entire signal path.

 

I'd just add that an almost total "declaration of innocence" for your wireless systems could be pretty much confirmed "on the test bench" by having ALL of their components left running for the entire life of their batteries, but with the outputs of your four receivers going to a "turned-up-loud" loudspeaker, or loudspeakers.

 

(Whether you choose to perform this "no-signal soak test" with four separate instrument amps that have mic inputs or via the mic inputs of a small mixer into a single powered loudspeaker, or one at a time into your domestic Hi-Fi system, would make no difference.)

 

The point is to set up a long-term test in a way that the loudness of the offending "splat" might be enough to startle the neighbourhood, if not to actually stop the hens from laying, …so that its appearance cannot be missed. 

 

Should the dreaded "splat" then fail to materialise over those hours, I think you'd have a pretty convincing clearance …and from what you've reported so far, along with the nature of the sound itself, I'm suspecting that such a "no show' could indeed be a very likely outcome.

 

This possible clue, however...

 

...BUT I do think we had this happen recently when we went with the Ipod wired into the house snake through a D.I box and we had the issue...  It could be the Ipod but I doubt that...

 

...might have some bearing on the issue, even though I feel that you're correct to suspect that your iPod is not in and of itself a very likely culprit.

 

However the "house snake" and its attendant possibility of

  1. Incorrect wiring and/or
  2. Phantom power being "de-phantom-ed" and "forced" up your iPad's unbalanced output as a consequence of that incorrect wiring and/or 

  3. A similar thing happening to any receiver/s that might have been using unbalanced jack connections, rather than correctly-wired XL cables and/or
  4. Another fault in the DI itself that may or may not be a consequence of a wiring error in that snake... 

…are all worthy of further investigation.

 

Depending how far away your FOH mixing position may be, (in other words, how long that snake really is) a gig or another test with all four receivers and the iPad bypassing any snake by being located at FOH may be another step towards localising the issue, if it's at all possible for you to operate like that. 


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#3 dboomer

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 03:13 PM

Hard to guess from here ... it could be anything.  Any chance your mics are going though a temperature or humidity change?  It is not uncommon for condenser mics to crackle if this is the case.

 

Is there any phantom power being applied to the outputs of the  receivers?



#4 Music2Party

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 12:13 PM

Hi All I have just bought a Line 6 XD-v35 Lavalier system and have also purchased a headset copy of the HS 70T in tan complete with a 6.35mm jack plug compatible with the V35 BP available on eBay and am happy to supply the link if wanted?

I took both my Line 6 system and my UHF Sennheiser FreePort EM1 Reciver and SKM3 Hand held Microphone to our local hotel to use both to assist the owner and local music shop in a demo of a new Yamaha StagePass 600i portable pa system for the hotel. I tried my line 6 headset system first and all was fine next my Sennheiser system was tried again no problem? When both the line 6 and the seenheiser was used together I too had a crackle and loud pop from my line 6 channel? Now I did discover that the guy from the music shop doing the demo was running both my line 6 and the Sennheiser XLR channels from the mixer of his StagePass 600i on Line input and not Mic input as this system has a switch for both on the first four channels. Now my mixer does not use this system of inputs as all my mic inputs have a gain control? Unfortunately as the restaurant had to be used to get the tables ready the demo had to be stopped so I did not have time to try the systems with both switches put to mic rather than line input. So my question is was this due to the wrong channel input or could I have another problem like our friend posting above. I did used all 6 line 6 channels but this din't stop these noises? 

Looking forward to your valuable help.
John Webb ( Party Host)
Music2Party Eastbourne Sussex UK

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#5 dboomer

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 02:03 PM

Hi John

 

If you run any mic into a line input the noise factor probably goes up 20 times or more.  Does your headset have an adapter or is the Ta4 connector directly soldered to the wire.  In my experience adaptors make lots of unpleasant noises.  I try to use adaptors only when I need a temporary fix.  If this is going to be permanent I would get it done properly.



#6 RonMarton

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 03:32 AM

From this, John...

 

...and have also purchased a headset copy of the HS 70T in tan complete with a 6.35mm jack plug...

 

...I'm assuming your headset did indeed arrive terminated with the correct plug for the beltpack in question, so you've no failure-prone adapters in the line to exert undue strain on the transmitter's socket. 

 

Two other issues, however, spring to my mind...

 

The first relates to the reservations I have about buying electret mics on eBay, …unless the seller is a reputable dealer selling genuinely new stock that carries a full warranty.

 

Various forms of abuse can cause an electret capsule to issue the dreaded (and irredeemable) intermittent "snap, crackle and pop", ...exposure to extremes of temperature and moisture being but two of those that leave no physical clues for the unsuspecting buyer.

 

The second concerns the successful integration of your XD-V35 receiver with other systems, for which I'd heartily recommend abandoning your use of tip-sleeve jack cables to connect your receiver.

 

The XD-V35 receiver's "Unbalanced Out" jack really is only meant for those who are using their XD-V35 as a (sonically identical) "cable eliminator" between an instrument and its jack-equipped amplifier on stage, …NOT for integrating with mixers and PA systems.

 

Also handing an XL male plug to someone almost (but not quite) ensures that they'll incorporate it the way it's designed to work, as a mic level source, exactly as Don Boomer has been at pains to point out...

 

...If you run any mic into a line input the noise factor probably goes up 20 times or more...

 

…So leave your jack cable at home and "go to the aid of the party" with a cable along these lines: http://www.studiospa...ack/invt/588270...

 

…And enjoy every minute !  :)


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#7 Music2Party

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 04:32 AM

Hi Guys thank you for replies. Firstly although bought from eBay the supplier does offer a returns policy and also after contacting him by email I have been assured that it has taken him over 6 years to find a high quality headset flesh colour microphone from China that works as it should do he said. He now supplies these to theatre groups and many professionals as well. You inform him which system you have when ordering and it arrives with in my case a stereo 6.35mm correctly wired jack attached to the lead.

It is the only one I have found that has a detachable lead so I can unscrew and remove my head mic if I wish to sit down to eat at a function, without having to remove the lead and belt pack transmitter that has been hidden inside my shirt and clipped onto my trousers. This headset works very well on my 2k sound system connected to a Pioneer mixer as we also use music videos for evening entertainment. As i said this Pioneer mixer does have two dedicated mic channels that are only for microphones and have gain controls. From what I have read I would guess the problem I had was from the music shop guy not knowing how to demo his equipment when faced with Line 6 which he knew very little about. The hotel is also interested in buying 2 xd-v55 headset systems and a separate hand held mic but wants to also have the facility for the after dinner speaker etc to be able to remove their headsets to eat? Which I believe the line 6 supplied does not?

As these XD-V55s are now using the same belt pack connector as Shure I believe? So is there another headset you know of that does this please? As you don't seem too impressed with my eBay one I feel!


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#8 RonMarton

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:17 AM

Well John,

 

…It sounds like your headworn mic supplier...

 

...is a reputable dealer selling genuinely new stock that carries a full warranty...

 

So, given its successful operation with your standard rig, it would seem that you really are onto a good thing !

 

...The hotel is also interested in buying 2 xd-v55 headset systems and a separate hand held mic but wants to also have the facility for the after dinner speaker etc to be able to remove their headsets to eat...

 

...As these XD-V55s are now using the same belt pack connector as Shure I believe? So is there another headset you know of that does this please?...

 

Here's my all-time favourite headworn (for speech applications) that I use with my TBP12 beltpacks that are identical to those supplied with the XD-V55: http://www.amazon.co.../dp/B002BO53LO/.

 

I own twelve of them …and there's a brilliant miniature screw-in connector at the "behind the ear" armature that several of my "speakers" have used to enjoy the catering free of the mic itself, exactly as per your query.

 

On the other hand, most simply don't bother, as the Samson SE 50s are so unobtrusive and comfortable.

 

You'll find my review of them here: http://www.amazon.co...ews/B002BO53LO/


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#9 Music2Party

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 11:51 AM

Hi again guys check this out for yourselves as world wide postage is offered? http://www.ebay.co.u...=item460d942daa

 

Enjoy and your spec comments will be make interesting reading I am sure

Cheers John


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#10 RonMarton

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Posted 28 November 2013 - 12:03 PM

That headworn mic to which you've so kindly linked looks to be fabulous value, John !

 

It won't be nearly as unobtrusive, comfortable, adaptable (or as ruggedly sweat-resistant) as the Samson SE50, but for a third of the asking price, a heck of a lot of us would be quite happy to live with that, ...given that you reckon it sounds OK in the right hands. 


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#11 Music2Party

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 06:01 AM

Believe it or not guys I just took a chance because of the price and the sellers email comments? I am a retired pro drummer from the late sixties so as you know in those days it was very much appoint a sound guy from within the band! As I was the one with city & Guilds Electrician qualifications that job fell to me.

Due to the dreaded tennis elbow in my right arm that forced my drumming retirement. So our business venture together with my Sue as a dj entertainer was  born in 2008. It soon became clear as an ex pro musician I had far more experience and talents to offer clients than just being a dj? So we bought in the master of ceremony and the party host into our entertainment shows. So as i said my eBay headset find sounds sweet is not a problem to wear all night, but I have no idea about the spec as headset mics go? As was already said it is half the price and that is why I decided to try one?

Please be so kind as to enlighten me as to how the spec compares to others thanks.

Thanks guys and just to keep you updated the Hotel decided to purchase 2 x XD-V55 Tan headset systems + a V55HH hand held microphone so it can be used with either system instead of the headset if wanted.


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#12 Music2Party

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 06:25 AM

Hi Guys an update for you all! The headset mic from eBay failed last night so it has not lasted longer than 9 days and only been used for 3 performances?

So don't buy one please! I now have a problem as the Lavalier mic supplied was rubbish and done nothing but keep feeding back? So now I have a XD-V35 system that I can't use a headset with other than either buying a V55 BP and only use 6 of the 12 channels or get a V35HH for that system and buy a complete XD-V55HS system as apparently Line6 don't supply a headset mic for the XD-V35 system any more? And the 70H or 70HT supplied with the XD-V55 or 75 has the TA4F connector so I am snookered thanks Line6! If I had known the eBay headset was not going to last and that Line6 were going to stop supplying the 30H Headset I could have bought the XD-V55HS in the first place. But hindsight is a wonderful thing! Still as they say guys life's a lollipop then we die! 

If you have any ideas on solving this problem I would be grateful to hear from you?


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#13 dboomer

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:32 AM

The HS30 mic is still available.

Feedback with any mic is simple because you are providing too much gain and crossing the system unity gain threshold. Working with lav mics for live sound reinforcement is always difficult. The headset mic will feedback at the same gain level ... But... You will typically only need 1/10 the gain using a headset instead of a lav mic.

#14 RonMarton

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 10:43 AM

...the Lavalier mic supplied was rubbish and done nothing but keep feeding back?...

 

Aah, …actually I couldn't agree LESS, John !

 

(Bear in mind that I'm a Sound Supervisor/Audio Director with over forty years of ongoing experience who has neither affiliation with nor loyalty to Line 6, or to any other supplier or manufacturer.)

 

I'd like to not only corroborate Don Boomer's typically concise and sage advice about feedback, but also add two points:

  1. Given the price of any XD-V "L package", the included Line 6 LM4 directional lavalier effectively arrives "free of charge" and
  2. In my experience the LM4 is one of the most natural sounding, rugged and feedback resistant options from all of the directional lavaliers I've used, (and I've used plenty) ...only suffering by comparison to far more expensive alternatives in terms of its susceptibility to handling or cable noises and far less flexible mounting options.

Speaking of value, check out the price of the equally rugged, far more feedback resistant and fine sounding headset mic that (as Don's pointed out) will simply "plug and play" into your beltpacks:

 

http://www.gak.co.uk...icrophone/54886

 

OK, so it's not as brilliantly unobtrusive and flexibly comfortable as my favourite Samson SE50 omni headset mics, but it is equally rugged (while being more feedback resistant) for only two thirds of the Samson earset's asking price …and unlike the SE50, will plug directly into your V30/V35 beltpacks.

 

Oh …and I'm really sorry to hear that the seemingly wonderful "removable boom" mic you posted turned out not to be the bargain we had hoped.

 

We're hugely in your debt, mate !  :wacko:


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#15 Music2Party

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 05:57 PM

Hi Ron thank you for your link, but I also saw that and asked my local line6 dealer to get me one? But when they rang the UK Line6 Supplier they told Mike that Line6 has withdrawn this model that they made for the XD-V30 I believe. That I guess is why GAK are saying phone for delivery? So as said above I am left with either a V55BP and a HS70 in tan? But after working out the pricing it is a cheaper option to buy a XD-V55HS System complete. Then at a later date buy the Hand held Transmitter for the 35. I can now confirm the problem with the eBay headset is in fact the lead up by headset connector? As if plugged into the V35 BP only it lights the audio light with the lead not connected to the headset, but if bend or held in a certain way the audio light will go out. So just maybe his headset is fine by the ultra fine lead being screwed on and off is not of high enough quality to put up with it? Time will tell as I am sure as I have opened a faulty item case against him he will be in touch? Plus it is not all  bad as once have the V55BP I will be able to try your favorite Samson SE50 mic if I am not happy with the line6 HS70! 


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#16 RonMarton

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Posted 01 December 2013 - 02:22 PM

I must say, John, that I think you'll find the V55 to be far better configured (in every way) for what you're doing than the V35 that's really intended for more "musician friendly" integration with "stomp boxes", guitar leads, instrument amplifiers and the like.

 

If your eBay supplier honours that warranty and the faulty fine cable in question proves to be  a "one off" manufacturing defect, you may end up a real "win-win"...

 

Here's hoping !  :rolleyes:  :)


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#17 Sheriton

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 01:33 AM

Hi John,

 

If you've not already discovered it, Line6 now has a UK web shop available here. They're showing the HS30 as being available and in stock; there are other options available too.

As an alternative, I use the Pulse branded headset mics from CPC - they've done many musical theatre productions for me (and are currently doing a panto) and strike a very good balance between price and quality.


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#18 RonMarton

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 09:04 AM

Great find, Sheriton !

 

Those "Pulse" brand headworn omnis may not be quite as "bendy", comfortable and adaptable as the single-ear Samson SE50s, but they seem almost as "invisible"and come with the beltpack's TA4F connector already wired …for less than half the price !

 

They're also even cheaper in the USA, from here: http://www.mcmelectr...3000X4-/35-4230


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#19 Music2Party

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Posted 04 December 2013 - 01:03 PM

I was totally wrong about the company selling these headset mics on eBay, as I have received a complete replacement and a postage label to send back my faulty one. Also have now ordered a HS30 black headset which I am waiting for, as I also thought that the XD-V55HS was over the top and not worth the money to be used just for speech? Sorry I doubted you all. It would appear this HS30 was made for the XD-V30HS and will be finished once the stocks run out or that is what I have been told anyway? I will then buy a XD-V35HH and that will cover all my needs. 

 

I haven't tried it yet for a long time as my headset failed and the Lavalier mic wouldn't pick up good enough so I used my Sennheiser hand held UHF for the last two shows. As the Line6 systems use 24-bit precision for a full frequency response of 10Hz to 20kHz and a wide dynamic range of up to 118dB (A weighted), XD-V35 digital wireless signals are so clear and strong that they sound and perform as if you’re using a wired microphone? But I also use a wireless router with my iPad to control my DMX lighting is it possible this will interfere with my XD-V35 system being so close? Any body know please?


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#20 RonMarton

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Posted 04 December 2013 - 01:57 PM

I'm glad the headset mic's worked out for you, John !

 

...But I also use a wireless router with my iPad to control my DMX lighting is it possible this will interfere with my XD-V35 system being so close? Any body know please?

 

While it is "possible", it's probably also avoidable.

 

To my mind, the best initial step you could take would be to have your router and DMX operating in the newer "n" standard 5Ghz WiFi band that will totally avoid any possible "conflict" with the 2.4GHz spectrum being used by your XD-V35 ...and grant your whole router/DMX system far better performance.

 

Should that not be feasible, experiment with your six different channels to find the one that gives you the fewest red lights at your receiver when your DMX's WiFi is actually operating ...and use that one so your mic won't slow down or stop your lighting control.

 

Conversely, should you find "the boot to be on the other foot" in that your DMX's "old model" WiFi is causing your mic to "drop out", you'll first need to switch your mic to the older RF1 scheme, as explained in the "V30 Compatibility Mode" appendix of your "XD-V35 Wireless Pilot's Handbook".

 

Having done that, you should then operate your mic according to the "WiFi Interference" section of this document: http://line6.com/sup...phones-faq-r230

 

I'm almost certain that you will find that the two systems will work together …and work very well.  :)


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