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Incorporating Old ( Good ) Qsc Speakers With Stagescape And L3m's


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#21 1finger

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 05:31 AM

A few more hours of tweaking , and the mixer is sounding better.
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#22 scotterp

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 12:43 PM

 I think the mixer was designed with a know-nothing numbnuts could use , or an experienced engineer with unlimited time for tweaking hundreds of parameters.
- I feel a bit " left out " in the design. That's why I'm a bit hesitant to invest further in this setup.

It is indeed designed for us know-nothing numb nuts (no offense taken) to get great sound out of the box without having to be an engineer. Since I've been using the M20D, I consistently get compliments on how good our local bar band of old fart rockers sounds compared to most other similar weekend warrior bands. 

 

I still don't know what I'm doing when it comes to professional live sound engineering, I just know what sounds good to me, and this fantastically designed box will allow me to continue in that vein. We can setup faster than ever before and sound-check is a breeze. It was a very sound investment for me, and my bandmates are very happy I did so. Maybe you would be better off with what you are most familiar/comfortable with. 

 

No slight intended. The M20D was designed to eliminate the need for a sound guy for us guys that have the responsibility of playing in the band as well as being responsible for the sound, and don't have the experience/education of a professional sound guy. I think they hit a bullseye for us. It also has so much more for those that do indeed want/need to get into the details - a place I fear to venture!

Cheers!


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#23 mishulix

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 05:43 AM

[offtopic]The mixer is brilliant. It really helps in mixing and with a pair of good headphones, when you are mixing from behind the FoH you can judge aproximatively ok the balance between instruments, of course having first made a soundcheck. What I would reccomend is to use the help of a proffesional sound engineer that you like and help you make a good preset, and always use that preset as a starting point for every soundcheck you make. I bet you will need afterwards very little tweaking for the little quirks that every location has, and then you are set. The sound check for us nowadays is 2-5 minutes after we finished installing equipment :D. We do it like this and our band is sounding great, even when there is no sound engineer to take care of the sound, and we do it from stage (me, with a pair of headphones, as I said). Of course, always a dedicated sound engineer will make little adjustments all the time when needed, but I can do it rather ok from stage too, considering the number of people that come and praise the sound. But, first I used the help of a trained proffesional and the results are really obvious. All compressions set in stone, all eq for everybodies voice, we use the same monitors and microphones, and the sound is identical, save for different FoH settings (a little bass needed here, a little more highs there, etc)[/offtopic]

 

Still offtopic, we just finished this summer-autumn a tour of 37 outdoor locations and used the M20d as our only mixer. Backup was the Yamaha O1R from the soundguys, but we never used it. Mobile stage and all. A good Meyer FoH, everithing good. The sound engineer was going in front of the stage with the iPad and mixed us from there, most of the times the stagemixer was setup laterally and he could have not hear that good if we didnot have the M20d with the wireless possibility. Really great. Only bad thing about this setup is that the iPad loses the wireless conection to the mixer constantly and I cannot understand why. The signal is great, even from near the stage, the iPad sometime disconected from the mixer. Sometimes was disturbing for the sound guy, because at times it took 20-30 seconds to re-link with the mixer. Our wireless is a Apple Ethernet-to-USB adapter, connected to a TL-WR841ND wireless router.

 

That was our main complaint about the mixer, else the preamps and the quality of the eq, comp etc are at least on par with every other mixer we played, and we played including on high end digital Yamahas and Digico. Those sound engineers all said it's a small litlle beast, initially put-off by the Line6 name (every one asked first about the preamps), but after sound check, rather impressed for our setup and sound.


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#24 1finger

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 07:47 AM

Thanks.
That's what I've done for years is mix in a studio , so I know well how to use all the effects.

I think it's the small room I'm trying to get an initial mix in , that giving me a harder time than the mixer perhaps. I used the onboard presets for each input , but found them to be merely a rough starting point. It may having been faster for me to start each input from scratch , as a general mic input. ??
It's like Line6 making things "easier" , when in fact it somewhat makes things appear more complicated or confusing.
My buddy has a Vetta head. He has recently joined my ban , and has never been happy with the sound he got. Having been impressed by my ability to "tweak" audio and achieve favorable results , he asked me to look at his amp.
Once again , Line6 tries to make it "easy" for people who don't understand EQ well , and they break things into "presets". It has all these speaker cab EQ simulations , which allows them to boast a million options in a box. This had him a little messed up with his sound , and for good reason. I hooked his Vetta head up to my 4x12 cab , went in an manually disabled the cab simulation for each internal amp , manually adjusted them , and voila. Got it sounding really nice.
He didn't see to try this. They don't exactly , make it obvious. Seems they are too concerned ; in their design of products , in making them idiot-proof.

Anyways...... Yes off topic , I know.
Great products. Just designed wrong IMHO.
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#25 jaminjimlp

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 12:26 AM

I think it's the small room I'm trying to get an initial mix in .

This is the exact problem that I had when I first bought the system I'm made a scene in my little room where the band practices and had our first gig the sound was horrible because of feedback and way too much bass. You really need a friend with a large warehouse or a auditorium that you can go and set up in and do all your tweaking in there or just get to your next gig get there about 3 to 4 hours early so you have plenty of time to mess around with it start with a brand-new Scene plug your stuff in one thing at a time used a small icons or the starter presets to load for each particular instrument and microphone and then name it for that particular place and then just fiddle with everything and don't forget about the 31 band EQ on your L6 link speakers.

Then of course don't forget to save your scenes and your presets before turning the machine off.
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May you be blessed and our Lord Jesus keep you!!!


#26 SiWatts69

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 05:05 AM

Then of course don't forget to save your scenes and your presets before turning the machine off.

 You don't need to save them before powering down, they'll be there when you next boot up... as they were when you powered down. The only need to save is when you have a perfect setup for venue A and you adjust for the venue you're in but realise you did a bad job and want to go back to the original./.. if you've overwritten the good setup, you're stuffed.

 

What I'm starting to do is to have a number of setups: one for rehearsals which are done a particular way and then save a setup each time we gig. That way, if we go back to a venue, I load the venue's previously used setup and start from there. If it's a venue we've not been to before, I have a default "gig" setup which we start with and then save the resultant finished state as a new setup at the end of gig.


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#27 jaminjimlp

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 09:57 AM

 You don't need to save them before powering down, they'll be there when you next boot up... as they were when you powered down. The only need to save is when you have a perfect setup for venue A and you adjust for the venue you're in but realize you did a bad job and want to go back to the original./.. if you've overwritten the good setup, you're stuffed.

 

that is why I said to save it then he won't need to worry about messing around with it some where else and not have his good starting point to go back to.....because I did that in the beginning as well. :o

 

I do the same thing you stated in your second paragraph...  I think its a good habit to get into.  


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#28 SiWatts69

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 04:44 PM

Sorry Jim. I wasn't trying to contradict you, but was giving a more detailed set of facts for the sake of clarity for new users. No offense intended.


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#29 Digital-sound

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 10:46 PM

I imagine having mixed in a studio for 15 years is exactly what makes the M20d difficult to navigate. I find it very intuitive but far less studio experience.

I use 2 L3T's and 2 L3S's. Best system by far I have used. Some can sound great, but none are so simple to use for the working musician who really doesn't want to mix sound, but spend time playing and knowing they have good sound.

Can't be beat....,today.
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#30 1finger

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Posted 03 December 2013 - 04:55 AM

I imagine having mixed in a studio for 15 years is exactly what makes the M20d difficult to navigate. I find it very intuitive but far less studio experience.

I use 2 L3T's and 2 L3S's. Best system by far I have used. Some can sound great, but none are so simple to use for the working musician who really doesn't want to mix sound, but spend time playing and knowing they have good sound.

Can't be beat....,today.


I can respect this. I'm sure by the time I get "used" to it , they will release another model.
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#31 jaminjimlp

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Posted 03 December 2013 - 05:56 AM

Sorry Jim. I wasn't trying to contradict you, but was giving a more detailed set of facts for the sake of clarity for new users. No offense intended.

None taken my Line 6 brother!!! Even though The Lord delivered me from smoking dope 10 years ago, the short term mem sometimes is a little foggy, so i appreciate you filling in the blanks for me :)
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May you be blessed and our Lord Jesus keep you!!!


#32 1finger

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Posted 03 December 2013 - 04:23 PM

None taken my Line 6 brother!!! Even though The Lord delivered me from smoking dope 10 years ago, the short term mem sometimes is a little foggy, so i appreciate you filling in the blanks for me :)


Listen dope head , nobody cares

Lol .........just kidding. Great posts.
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