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Signal With No Amps Selected

hd500x dry signal

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#1 lelandberg

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Posted 12 January 2014 - 09:05 PM

So my input is set to guitar and my output is to power amp in-going into the PWR Amp input on my Blues Delixe. With no amps or pre-amps selected, why do I have a clear audio signal from my guitar? It is as strong as the if an amp was on. The end result is that an amp selection merely colors this dry signal. 


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#2 Dutchguitarist

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Posted 12 January 2014 - 09:58 PM

You will always have an output signal even without an amp selected.(that's part of the POD's internal architecture) However, if you find the signal too strong, you can use the mixerblock to lower the output level


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#3 edstar1960

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 03:02 AM

What do you have the 1/4" OUT switch set to on the face of the HD500?   It is positioned next to the expression pedal. 

You can choose between amp or line for this switch.  Line will give you a much hotter signal.  Amp will give you a signal suitable for a guitar amp in.

Also what do you have the MASTER volume set at?  Recommended value is to have this turned to max.  But you can lower it if you prefer the sound.


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#4 lelandberg

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 07:30 AM

You will always have an output signal even without an amp selected.(that's part of the POD's internal architecture) However, if you find the signal too strong, you can use the mixerblock to lower the output level

The mixer block as far as I can tell lowers the volume of the entire signal. It's doesn't seem to change the ratio of dry to modeled signal. The difference in my dry signal and the modeled signal is about 2 db.


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#5 lelandberg

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 07:33 AM

What do you have the 1/4" OUT switch set to on the face of the HD500?   It is positioned next to the expression pedal. 

You can choose between amp or line for this switch.  Line will give you a much hotter signal.  Amp will give you a signal suitable for a guitar amp in.

Also what do you have the MASTER volume set at?  Recommended value is to have this turned to max.  But you can lower it if you prefer the sound.

Yes I have the switch set to AMP. I have to use the Master volumne to adjust the loudness in the room as I am using the  PWR Amp input on my Blues Deluxe (there is no power amp adjutment on the amp).


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#6 lelandberg

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 09:54 AM

Okay: I just got off the phone with support. My input settings are 1.Guitar and 2,Same. The tech said that number 2 setting at Same will double the signal of the input source. Instead, I should set 2 to Variax as this will reference the digital input and since nothing is there, the second input source is ignored. I'll try this tonight. ..... Okay I just tried it out and no dice. In fact, with amps off or amps on, it sounds exactly the same. I rolled back the firmware from 1.2 to 1.1 and it seems to have fixed the issue. Now there IS a difference when turning on and off the amp modules.


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#7 edstar1960

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 01:06 AM

Interesting.  I misunderstood your OP.  I thought your signal via the HD500 was too strong - I did not realise that the amp fx block seemed to still have an effect on the signal even when turned off.  Interesting that it has fixed the issue rolling back the firmware.

 

Sometimes reflashing fixes these problems - so what happens if you reinstall 1.2 - does the problem reappear?  Or is it still fixed?


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#8 Rewolf48

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:51 AM

The Amp block has two states On and Off.  When On the simulation is active and the knobs control the settings, the Off it is not off as in disconnected, but rather Off as is effect is bypassed so the clean signal is passed through, which is something that is often wanted - you might for example want a bit of clean guitar with heavy amp distortion.

 

To change Off to mean no signal is passed at all simply switch the Amp model off and change the Amp (bypass) Volume down to zero by using the Volume knob.  The On and Off volume states are stored separately.


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#9 Charlie_Watt

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 06:13 AM

I use no amp all the time for Acoustic patches.  Lets you add effects without limiting the bandwidth.


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#10 NucleusX

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 08:01 AM

Just to add something you might already know..

 

Setting input 1 to guitar, and input 2 to variax will give you the best signal to noise ratio

through your entire chain, I'd think twice about giving that up!

Or use the extra DSP slot for a noise-gate set high... Just my 2 cents.


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#11 lelandberg

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 10:38 AM

Interesting.  I misunderstood your OP.  I thought your signal via the HD500 was too strong - I did not realise that the amp fx block seemed to still have an effect on the signal even when turned off.  Interesting that it has fixed the issue rolling back the firmware.

 

Sometimes reflashing fixes these problems - so what happens if you reinstall 1.2 - does the problem reappear?  Or is it still fixed?

reinstalling 1.2 took care of the original problem but reintroduced a new and puzzling isse. I am working with tech support on this one. Here is the situation. I would be interested if anyone else can produce this:

I started with a new tone,(Nothing in the chain) Added AC 30 TB then Added a second amp, Sol 100 Crunch. I noticed I had no second amp sound. Rolling the channel volume up and down produced no difference. On a whim, I added a noise gate in the effects chain before the split. The amp works. If I turn the noise gate off, the amp won’t work. If I move the noise gate into the split ahead of only the second amp, the amp doesn’t work. The effect must be before the split.
Additional information:
I tried all effect types and the above is true for all except for Vol, wah, or pre-eq. (they have no influence over this anomaly).


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#12 Charlie_Watt

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 12:12 PM

What do you have your Input2 set to???? 


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#13 radatats

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 12:31 PM

What you are describing is the normal operation.  The signal from input 1 will only go to path A and the signal from input 2 will only go to path B.  The only way to get them to "share" paths or crossover is to add a FX block or amp to the Pre section. 

 

- The first MONO block in the pre section will sum both signals, reduce the combined signal level by 6db and send the result to BOTH paths A and B. 

 

- If there is no block in the Pre section or you use a STEREO block (volume, wah, etc.) the signals remain separate allowing you to have two independent paths. (ie. guitar path A, vocal path B  )

 

- If you want your guitar to go to both paths with no block in the Pre section, set input 2 to SAME.     B)


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#14 lelandberg

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 12:39 PM

What you are describing is the normal operation.  The signal from input 1 will only go to path A and the signal from input 2 will only go to path B.  The only way to get them to "share" paths or crossover is to add a FX block or amp to the Pre section. 

 

- The first block in the pre section will sum both signals, reduce the combined signal level by 6db and send the result to BOTH paths A and B. 

 

- If there is no block in the Pre section the signals remain separate allowing you to have two independent paths. (ie. guitar path A, vocal path B)

 

- If you want your guitar to go to both paths with no block in the Pre section, set input 2 to SAME.     B)

This is not the way I have it set up. The input is split into two and this used to work. Only if there is actually something plugged into the second input or variax are the 2 paths exclusive. If what you say is true, a Volume Pedal in that position would do the trick but it has no effect.


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#15 lelandberg

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 12:40 PM

What do you have your Input2 set to???? 

Variax - per the Line6 Tech support.


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#16 radatats

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 01:26 PM

You are correct... my mistake.  It must be a MONO block or amp.  Stereo blocks such as Volume or Wah preserve the stereo separation.  My description is also correct, there are multiple threads that talk about signal paths, please feel free to search them...

 

With Guitar in input 1 and Variax in input 2 there will be no signal passed to path B without a MONO block of some type assigned to the Pre section.


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