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Jtv-59 - Battery No Longer Powers Up Guitar


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#1 AdInfinitum

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Posted 03 April 2014 - 12:29 PM

I have a JTV-59 that was working perfectly fine on battery power. I just purchased a second battery because I know that these batteries have a limited recharge life. I recharged my original battery and then charged up the back-up. Of course, when I put the original battery in, it no longer powers up the guitar. Then tried the new battery (after a full charge up), and it also did to power the guitar. I then used the stereo cable and breakout box and the guitar does power up via the breakout box, but both batteries do not power up the guitar (no lights on the battery indicator).

Any ideas? Is there a "reset" or a discharge that I can try? I'd prefer not having to ship the guitar back to Line6 (I have an early reproduction version that required a replacement of the three way switch, although Line6 did not put on the switch plate to cover the switch hole).

Thanks
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#2 arislaf

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Posted 03 April 2014 - 01:54 PM

Stupid question, but the charger lights up correct when you are charging?


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#3 AdInfinitum

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Posted 03 April 2014 - 02:14 PM

OMG - I forgot to turn the battery charger on!

Only kidding - it is plugged in and charging correctly. Plus, the battery indicator on the Variax does not light at all. Even when the battery ran down, I always got at least one green light.
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#4 Charlie_Watt

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Posted 03 April 2014 - 03:22 PM

Sounds like there is something wrong with the battery box itself in the JTV since neither battery is working.


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#5 edstar1960

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 07:46 AM

If the battery charging has the correct indicator lights and the batteries have had the full recharge and the indicator lights have started blinking at the appropriate rate to indicate charging complete then it does sound like it must be a problem with the battery box as Charlie_Watt has suggested.

 

One more thing to check before you have to contact Line 6 support for help - are the batteries sliding correctly into place within the battery compartment and making contact with the terminals?   If they do slide in perfectly and make contact then I suggest you call Line 6 for assistance.   Hope you get it sorted.


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#6 AdInfinitum

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 08:26 AM

Thanks everyone for the replies. I tried leaving the battery in the unit overnight, hoping that the JTV required to get past a threshold of current or charge to activate the battery. I was right. I just checked and the battery registered four green lights. So, all is good.
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#7 Charlie_Watt

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 01:49 PM

That makes no sense!  Glad it's working though.  It should work or not work and time should not be a factor.


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#8 silverhead

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 01:54 PM

... I tried leaving the battery in the unit overnight, hoping that the JTV required to get past a threshold of current or charge to activate the battery. ....


You mean you left it in the charging unit overnight, right? Not the JTV?
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#9 AdInfinitum

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 02:34 PM

No, I left the fully charged battery in the JTV overnight and now it is working. It may make no sense, but . . . it worked. There is probably a component failure in the battery circuit. Sometimes having a continuous source of current gets the component to start working again.
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#10 Sngwrtr

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 09:13 AM

Wow ... I am just now experiencing this same problem.  I have had my JTV-59 for two years.  Initially had two batteries.  Recently purchased a third battery as one battery was charging only to three lights.  Anyhow, took a break from JTV and left it unplugged with no battery in compartment for maybe three weeks.  When I went back to use it, could not get either of the original batteries to display any green lights when secure in compartment.  Took newly ordered battery out of box and charged it fully.  Placed it in battery compartment of guitar - nothing!  I have tried three different batteries (all Line 6 batteries) and none of them can produce even a single green light on indicator.  Guitar works fine as "electric" but none of the unique features, of course, work without charge!  Is there any chance I can resolve this without returning guitar to Line 6?


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#11 edstar1960

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 09:25 AM

Wow ... I am just now experiencing this same problem.  I have had my JTV-59 for two years.  Initially had two batteries.  Recently purchased a third battery as one battery was charging only to three lights.  Anyhow, took a break from JTV and left it unplugged with no battery in compartment for maybe three weeks.  When I went back to use it, could not get either of the original batteries to display any green lights when secure in compartment.  Took newly ordered battery out of box and charged it fully.  Placed it in battery compartment of guitar - nothing!  I have tried three different batteries (all Line 6 batteries) and none of them can produce even a single green light on indicator.  Guitar works fine as "electric" but none of the unique features, of course, work without charge!  Is there any chance I can resolve this without returning guitar to Line 6?

 

I suggest you try what the OP did.  Place one of the fully charged batteries in the JTV59 and leave it overnight.  Then check it's status in the morning and if it's the same issue as the OP then the JTV59 should spring into life after having the battery in place overnight.


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#12 AdInfinitum

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 09:29 AM

I also hooked up my JTV using the power cable to make sure that the unit was working with AC power.  at first, it was intermittent - the volume was low, then crackly, then worked.  This happened a few times.  But, after about 10 minutes, it was working fine with the cable/AC power.  I then thought that sometimes capacitors or filters get discharged and maybe because I let the battery's charge get too low when I left the battery in the unit (I've been playing my Transperformance lately), that the JTV just need to have current flowing through it to get all the components firing or at least above a threshold.  I'm not an EE, but, it worked.


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#13 Sngwrtr

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 09:30 AM

Thank you for pointing that out.  I should have mentioned that I did precisely that (having browsed the forum last night).  As of this morning, no signs of life.  Still have battery in compartment a hopin' and a prayin' for life this evening when I return home from work, but the cynic in me says "Highly Unlikely."


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#14 edstar1960

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 09:52 AM

Is there no end to the weirdness with these things, lol? I've taken various battery powered items that hadn't been used in years, put in a new battery, turn it on and go...power is power isn't it?

 

Hell, I don't even keep the battery in my JTV, as I'm using the VDI all the time. Maybe I should start. Don't want to go on vacation and come back to a deceased instrument. That's nuts...really seems like one of those problems that just shouldn't exist.

 

Crazy, nuts, banana's!    Never ceases to amaze me what things sometimes fix JTV glitches!    I completely agree - none of the solutions in this thread make sense but clearly they have worked for the OP!      :)          :D


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#15 AdInfinitum

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 09:58 AM

Let's just say I did have a witch doctor perform a voodoo ritual over my JTV to get it to work.  No chickens were sacrificed or harmed though.

 

I've had weird things like that happen on other battery powered guitars like my Parker Fly (for the piezo).  Sometimes the battery just doesn't supply enough current to get the guitar making any sound, then after a few minutes and some cursing, it does work.  It could be a cold solder somewhere in the circuit.  Who the heck knows.  Note - I still had the problem even after taking it in for repair!

 

Line6 does have authorized repair shops now, so you may not have to ship it far.  I actually have an authorized repair place about 2 miles up the road. Good luck.


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#16 Charlie_Watt

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 11:41 AM

There is probably a broken connection in the battery tray.  Capacitors charge up almost instantly when you insert the battery.  It makes no sense that it would take more than a few microseconds - certainly not minutes or hours.  The battery try includes a circuit board that could have a failure.


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#17 snhirsch

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 04:54 PM

Either that or there is something going wrong with the profit-protection mechanism that guards against the use of third-party batteries.


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#18 AdInfinitum

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Posted 09 May 2014 - 06:28 PM

Both of my JTV batteries are authentic Line6 batteries. But you are probably right that there is something wrong with the battery power circuit.
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#19 Sngwrtr

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 12:31 PM

Okay .... my problem with battery turned out to be a "bent pin" in the battery compartment.  Easy fix, but the technician waited three weeks for "response" from Line 6 (never did get one) before he returned his attention to the guitar out of his own initiative and solved the problem.

 

Next time, I'll check the pins to see if any look out of whack and fix myself.


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#20 darwould

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 05:36 PM

We'll I came to this thread with some very strange battery issues. For starters - this is a new Variax with original charger and original line 6 battery. The battery worked fine for about 3 recharges, then on the 4th full charge the guitar lost power after about 1 hour. Nothing, no 4 green lights, no flashing single green light. Press the test button and no lights. I charged the battey and the red charger LED was blinking as though it was fully charged right away. I tested the battery and it read 8.46v - or fully charged. I tried leaving the battery on charge overnight, I also left it in the variax overnight - no sucessess after each of these steps. I then planned to take it in for service. So I left the battery in the charging cradle "not plugged in" and waited a day or so to take it in for service.

 

So now I'm at the service centre and we do a quick test to see if the battery is good. My battery powers up another variax just fine. So now I'm sure it's my guitar right!! ... just for kicks I plug the battery into my guitar... and.... guess what, works fine!

 

You might be thinking that it's a loose wire in the guitar, but I assure you, I had the battery box out, wiggled all connections, and nothing. I plugged the battery in about 50 times when it was not working and all I would get is anywhere from 1 - 3 seconds of 4 green lights, then everything goes dark. And now that it's working - I'm seeing it continue to work regardless of how many times I re-insert the battery. Not looking like a loose wire in my book. 

 

So now, I'm going to watch this closely. It's either 1) that the battery was in the cradle overnight bleeding some current in the battery (not plugged in), or 2) Plugging the battery into the other Variax somehow reset the battery!

 

As one other post mentioned, I certainly think this is due to some convoluted scenario with the "genuine battery detection" circuitry. It could be that the battery gets a static zap or something that confuses the ID chip in there and it needs to be reset, or there is some other handshaking going on that gets permanently confused until the battery gets placed in another guitar. I should also note that sometimes I use a VDI cable with an HD500 which powers the guitar and I leave the bettery in the guitar. Nowhere does it say this is bad or should not be done, but maybe this causes the issue I experienced somehow.

 

I know this sounds wierd, but something strange is definitly going on. Hopefully this helps someone. If this happens again I will post back with more details.


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#21 AdInfinitum

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 05:49 PM

I'm sorry to hear about your issues. I had/have the same issue . . . AGAIN WITH MY Variax. Battery charged, authentic battery, and also new authentic battery. Plug it in, green lights. Play a little, slam the guitar select switch to get it to actually engage, play a strat in position 4, then guitar goes silent except on the mags, which still work. Re--charge the battery. nothing. Leave bateery in overnight, green lights, it works, for a little bit. Same problem. Nothing except mag pickups.

Leave it in again, now it works.

Line6 - how about letting us know what the issue is.
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#22 darwould

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 06:06 PM

Hi - sorry to hear of your issue as well, but at the same time I'm glad I'm not going nuts. I wanted to clarify... by "Leave battery in overnight" do you mean, 1) in the charger charging? 2) in the variax? or 3) in the charger "not" charging and not plugged in?  In my case #1 and #2 did not fix my issue (tried them both), but #3 may have. I say "may have" since I also plugged the battery into another variax first so not sure which one fixed my issue. Since you have 2 batteries I don't expect it to be battery related. Since you did not mention another variax I don't think that did it for me either. So then I assume it's leaving the battery in the unplugged charging cradle overnight that fixes this somehow. 

 

So much for being confident in this thing. I did like the idea of playing a gig on battery power but now I can't be confident. It's not the end of the world dropping to mag's but I play alot of alternat tuning.... popping out of tune at a gig is a show stopper.... literally.

 

A few more questions - do you ever power your variax with the VDI cable or the line 6 external 1/4 power DI box? If so - do you leave the battery in? Just trying to see if this is a common thing between our issues.

 

When I looked at the back of the battery box (unscrewing it from the variax), there is a small PCB with a chip on it. This must certainly be part of the "genuine battery" check circuitry. Somehow it seems to me that this might be failing. 

 

If it happens again to me I will take it in for service and ask them to replace the battery box in the variax... or at least point them to this thread before they start troubleshooting. 


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#23 Charlie_Watt

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 06:11 PM

If you are getting no green lights, then the battery holder / circuit is not working even if the battery is charged.  There is a circuit in the holder that checks that the battery is genuine.  I suspect that this circuit was not getting the right info.  That I believe is the third connection in the holder.  The charger only uses two connections.  Maybe that third connection was not working for some reason. (crap on it or something)  Sounds like it is solid for now anyway.  Keep an eye on it!


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#24 darwould

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 06:24 PM

Thanks. I also suspected the 3rd connection (spring connection on the bottom of the holder). I cleaned it up making sure the connection was good and also checked electrical continuity to the PCB in the back of the holder. All good but still no green lights. It looks like something else was going on as opposed to bad contacts etc. As you say - it seems ok now and I will keep an eye on it. WIll report back if I learn anything more on this.


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#25 snhirsch

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 03:49 AM

The 3rd connection is for the serial bitstream that IDs gen-u-ine Line6 batteries.  If that's not making solid contact, then no-go. 


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#26 cruisinon2

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 04:56 AM

A few more questions - do you ever power your variax with the VDI cable or the line 6 external 1/4 power DI box? If so - do you leave the battery in? Just trying to see if this is a common thing between our issues.


I use the VDI exclusively, as I don't trust batteries. Never had one...Duracell, Diehard, or otherwise...that didn't decide to crap out at an inopportune moment. Carrying around spares, constantly having to charge them...no thanks. Plus, the VDI allows easier control over the Variax. I'd much rather change models and tunings via the POD, than be fumbling with knobs and dials on stage.
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#27 darwould

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 06:58 AM

Totally agree on the VDI comments for live. For practice however, it's nice to know I can grab my guitar with my "bad monkey" and go direct to the board (it has a "not too bad" speaker sim out). Then I have variax models and tunings with a simple setup (and very portable - no amp, no HD500, etc.). Now with this battery issue I'm not so confident in this setup even for the 3 hours we play every week. 


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#28 psarkissian

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 08:29 AM

- Could be fail of battery box circuit or bent contact pins.

The LED's show full charge?

 

Does a relay click when you plug in thru 1/4-inch jack?

 

Using a TRS cable when using the 1/4-inch jack?

 

Works okay when you use the VDI?


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#29 darwould

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 08:59 AM

- Could be fail of battery box circuit or bent contact pins.

The LED's show full charge?

 

Does a relay click when you plug in thru 1/4-inch jack?

 

Using a TRS cable when using the 1/4-inch jack?

 

Works okay when you use the VDI?

 

Thanks for chiming in psarkissian.

 

I am almost certain it's the battery box circuit. No leds when pushing the test button. All pins and connetions fine to the battery - verified with an ohm meter on the battery box PCB. When the failure occurrs no regulated voltage is being generated from the battery box PCB to the variax modeling PCB (red, black, white, blue wire harness). I can "simulate" this same failure condition by putting tape on the 3rd terminal on the bottom of the battery. It's a failure of the battery box PCB to correctly recognize a genuine line6 battery even though that 3rd connection is making a solid connection to the PCB and the battery is indeed a line 6 original.

 

No relay click either.

 

Works fine with power from 1/4 inch line6 DI box or VDI.

 

But again to be clear - this problem fixes itself (I am currenlty in the working state waiting for another failure). I left the battery in the charger (not charging) overnight and then everything started working the next day. I'm in the EE business so I'm fairly comfortable with troubleshooting these types of issues.

 

I think it could be one of the following:

- problem with the battery box PCB - maybe thermal related that causes it to incorrectly detect the battery

- problem with the battery itsetf - some sort of discharge happening by leaving it overnight in the charder (not-charging) that somehow resets the genuine ID circuit in the battery.

 

It would be good to know from line6 if this seems possible. Another possible scenario is that the genuine battery protection scheme has some sort of timeout. Maybe due to some flaw it incorrectly detects a battery for 3 times for example, then invokes a timeout which disallows any battery - this could explain why the system wakes up again after a day.


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#30 psarkissian

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 10:43 AM

It's either a contact problem or a glitch in the battery box circuitry. I see a few of

these every now and then,.... but then, I've serviced hundreds of JTV's since they came out.

 

Couple reasons for that to occur, sounds like the battery box needs to be replaced.

Take it to an authorized service center, they can replace the battery box, then they

can do other checks to be sure there are no other glitches.

 

And be sure you register the JTV-59 before you take it in for servicing.


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#31 darwould

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 01:52 PM

OK thanks - I was sort of waiting for it to fail again before I take it in but I may just bring it in and point the tech to this thread. I've owned Line6 for many years and everything has been rock solid. I certainly don't see this to be a very common problem either just from my googling of this issue. Hopefully with a battery box replacement it never re-appears.


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