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Do You Have The Same Problem With 6th String?


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#81 ice9mike

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 09:17 AM

It's not just the 89F. 59's have had this issue too. I would imagine that there are many more that have the issue but go unnoticed. I continue to believe that the issue is with the software or internal electronics.

 

My 89F has been received by Line 6. I hope to have it back in a couple of weeks and will let you guys know if it is fixed.


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#82 psarkissian

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 10:02 AM

To be fair, "ice9mike" has done a number of mods to his 89F.

Like comparing a navel orange with a Valencia orange.

 

Nice tuning machines,.... 


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#83 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 10:10 AM

To be fair, also, mine is as stock as it can be... Even has the same strings it shipped with.

I have the issue on my JTV-59p
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#84 ice9mike

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 11:57 AM

They are just planet waves auto-trims. Drop in replacement. Nothing fancy. I had them laying around in my parts box. They are much nicer than the Chinese stock tuners. The other mod was just replacing the pickups. I did it without soldering using some small Eurostyle terminals. None of these mods affected the horrible sounding 6th string. It was there from the beginning.

 

Oh yeah, I also had to get it professionally setup and fret leveled because the 7th fret was sticking up high enough to cause ringing on the E, B, and G strings. It plays wonderfully now.

 

My point is I have a lot invested in this guitar in time, money, and effort. I am happy with it except for that 6th string.

 

psarkissian, thanks for looking at my orange (whatever kind it may be).


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#85 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 12:24 PM

recording...

 

Still same sound after guitar was returned

All sounds are Position 1

First is magnetic pickups, then the modelling just playing the Position 1 from ALL the modelling options on the modelling knob ...then back to magnetic pickups at the end.

 

Amp model was an AC-30

 

https://soundcloud.c...-plink-plonk-v2


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#86 psarkissian

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 12:47 PM

Tuning machines are fine, they work great,... it's the other stuff I have to go through.

 

badmelonfarmer,... take it to the nearest Line 6 authorized service center where you are,

they'll know how to deal with it.


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#87 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 01:04 PM

Hi,

I did send it back, they replaced the piezo.... Should I send back again? ... What should I tell them?

Thanks in advance
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#88 psarkissian

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 02:06 PM

I'll pick some brains, see if there's anything else that might cause your anomaly.

Might be more than one thing. I'll look it up. I know these guys, they're pretty thorough.

I'll see what we can see.


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#89 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 02:42 PM

Thanks.

I did see the Line6 repair slip when it was returned to me and it said they "replaced the piezo and soldered to main board"

But as you can hear from the recordings the issue is still there..... Do I need to ask for the ticket to be re-opened? contact the store again?.... Or just wait?
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#90 psarkissian

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 03:19 PM

Opening a ticket will bring visibility here to the support group,...

two heads are better than one, more heads are better than two.

 

Oh,... and the board referred to in the repair is the board on the

bridge that the piezo solders to, as opposed to the main board,

which is a different part number. 


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#91 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 03:29 PM

Thanks for the info re main board .... It was from memory.

I will re-open the support ticket and point at this thread, once I am on a computer... The support ticket system does not seem to render correctly on ipad..... But that is another story. LOL.
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#92 canerakcil

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Posted 21 May 2014 - 03:11 AM

What were they thinking by sending this guitar back to you..they mentioned as it is repaired but i am sure they know they couldn't fix it...they can't say we couldn't find a solution,why?
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#93 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 22 May 2014 - 11:57 AM

Opening a ticket will bring visibility here to the support group,...

two heads are better than one, more heads are better than two.

 

Oh,... and the board referred to in the repair is the board on the

bridge that the piezo solders to, as opposed to the main board,

which is a different part number. 

Thanks - requested ticket re-opened with Line 6 and pointed them at this thread and the recording, also contacted the shop to say the issue still exists.


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#94 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 02:33 AM

Just spoke with Line 6 tech support in UK and they have requested I return it again....I have contacted store to request pickup.

Hopefully they can fix the issue this time.

 

Being picked up on Tuesday


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#95 juicyjones

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 07:53 PM

Seems to me that Line 6 should Lemon this, send him a new one, and take the old one back and do a serious autopsy to find out why it's a freak.


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#96 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 27 May 2014 - 02:40 AM

Variax just been picked up ... I will update as soon as I hear anything back... but last time it was 2-3 weeks.


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#97 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 27 May 2014 - 02:48 AM

@psarkissian - I tried to re-open the ticket but the support system in the US and the UK appears to be totally separate ... they told me to Call Line 6 in the UK and closed the ticket .... so you will not see it in the US.

 

The helpful guy in the UK said to make sure a flag it as a "Second Return" as it would need to be QA'd by a manager. I put a piece of paper in-between the strings so the Tech cannot miss it ... it explained the problem and linked to the threads on the issue as well as the recordings of the issue.... i also mentioned your name as someone who had been helpful in the discussion on the thread.


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#98 psarkissian

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Posted 27 May 2014 - 07:59 AM

Thanks.

The techs there and I are good mates, and they know their stuff. I'm in contact

with them on a regular basis. We trade notes and such. They're pretty good.


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#99 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 27 May 2014 - 08:01 AM

thanks...hopefully they will be able to identify and fix the issue... really hope.

 

The guy on the phone was very helpful and seemed to actually listen and care ...which is great to see in this day and age. Told me exactly what to put in the note and gave me the hint to put it in the strings to make sure the tech sees it. etc

 

He also mentioned, the only one he had heard about having this issue was someone brought one in to show and discuss with a manager and he asked if it was me ... it wasn't...  but at least they know about this type of issue and it is not common ... so lets hope they can make it right ... either by fixing it or replacing it.


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#100 canerakcil

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 12:02 PM

"hopefully they will be able to identify and fix the issue."
Absolutely...
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#101 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 11:46 PM

It's not just the 89F. 59's have had this issue too. I would imagine that there are many more that have the issue but go unnoticed. I continue to believe that the issue is with the software or internal electronics.

 

My 89F has been received by Line 6. I hope to have it back in a couple of weeks and will let you guys know if it is fixed.

 

@Ice9Mike - have you heard anything back from Line6 on this? .... I am still waiting to hear.


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#102 ice9mike

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 06:59 AM

@Ice9Mike - have you heard anything back from Line6 on this? .... I am still waiting to hear.

 

Greetings. I called the Line 6 service center last week to get a status update. They are waiting for parts to fix something in the floyd rose bridge that was broken which was a little surprising to me. It seemed to work just fine. They think it might be contributing to the noise, artifacts, and plinky plinky sound. I have my doubts that this is the problem, but I am happy they are thoroughly going through everything.


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#103 psarkissian

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 07:23 AM

It was the locking nut.

The bridge was okay.

Odd vibrations getting processed with the rest of the audio.


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#104 ice9mike

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 07:29 AM

It was a the locking nut.

The bridge was okay.

Odd vibrations getting processed with the rest of the audio.

Thanks for the clarification. I had no idea the nut could contribute to the processed audio.


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#105 psarkissian

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 07:38 AM

It touches the strings, from the neck through the body,...

whether acoustic, electric or an active circuit guitar like a JTV,

the whole of the guitar resonates and is part of the acoustical

aspect of the signal.

 

Thanks to that Greek fellow Pythagoras we have string instruments.


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#106 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 08:21 AM

Interesting, thanks for the update.

 

Will be interesting to hear your thoughts when you get it back.

 

Guess it will a different issue on my 59p as there is no locking nut.

 

But if it is "Odd vibrations getting processed with the rest of the audio."

 

that's gotta be a nightmare to troubleshoot for the techs ... could be almost anything. ... deffo one for the guy who like a real challenge.


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#107 psarkissian

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 08:45 AM

Being the JTV tech at Line 6, here in the US,...

not as much of a nightmare as you might think.

I like working on JTV's. And I do like a challenge.


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#108 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 08:59 AM

LOL Good to know.

 

Will chase mine up next week and report back


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#109 chimp_spanner

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 01:06 PM

Just out of interest can you give any insight into why the 89 fixed bridge was discontinued? My dad has one and it plays great, especially palm muted. I went to buy one and was told they're no longer sold, so I had to get the 69. Only managed to play a couple of chords on it today before I had to leave but fingers crossed there are no "plinking" issues from what I can tell.

I always find it interesting how so many players want fixed bridges while so many companies push trem models. I had a hell of a time finding an Ibanez that had a good combination of pickups and specs *without* a bloody trem haha. Sorry, but OT. Just wondered :) won't lie, I did really want an 89 but the 69 is an incredibly attractive guitar so I'm not exactly bummed.
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#110 psarkissian

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 02:36 PM

OT? Not a problem.

As far as I know, both 89 and 89F are still available. They both show up on our

website, unless they're just not available there where you're at. Have you tried the

guitar shops on Denmark St in London? Macari's, Westside, Rose Morris and London

Pro Audio Centre might be a place to start. Or check Line 6 dealer listings for your area.

 

I have a black 69, Cherry and Tobacco 59's. They're great. I know what you mean

about the fixed bridge thing, the 69 is the only guitar I have (of all my guitars) with

a tremolo on it.

 

When I pick up my black 69, I think of that photo of David Gilmore with his black

NOS Fender Strat, then I go into playing some Floyd tunes.

 

Have had any of the problems mentioned here, but then, I plug in direct to the board

or go through my older aged POD's prior to the HD500 and 500X.

 

 


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#111 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 02:47 PM

When I pick up my black 69, I think of that photo of David Gilmore with his black
NOS Fender Strat, then I go into playing some Floyd tunes.

Good man!

Also not a fan of Trems, although I do have a strat for when I get a floyd inspiration.

I did have a Floyd Rose guitar back in the late 80's .... Hated it and Man changing stings was one of the most stressful experiences... Like Adam Sandler movies.,,, saw one... Made a personal vow.... Never again!!

Re going direct- same here, not used a real amp in years .... Since discovering PODs... Can't seee going back to a real amp. (Although I have moved on from PODs ... But that is a different story)
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#112 chimp_spanner

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 03:28 PM

OT? Not a problem.
As far as I know, both 89 and 89F are still available. They both show up on our
website, unless they're just not available there where you're at. Have you tried the
guitar shops on Denmark St in London? Macari's, Westside, Rose Morris and London
Pro Audio Centre might be a place to start. Or check Line 6 dealer listings for your area.
 
I have a black 69, Cherry and Tobacco 59's. They're great. I know what you mean
about the fixed bridge thing, the 69 is the only guitar I have (of all my guitars) with
a tremolo on it.
 
When I pick up my black 69, I think of that photo of David Gilmore with his black
NOS Fender Strat, then I go into playing some Floyd tunes.
 
Have had any of the problems mentioned here, but then, I plug in direct to the board
or go through my older aged POD's prior to the HD500 and 500X.


Hmm yeah it was Guitar Amp & Keyboard. They did say it was discontinued but like I said, not majorly bummed. The trem on the 69 feels really smooth, but so much less hassle than a Floyd. I have an RGD 2127z and I love it but the zero point trem is too much to be dealing with like...5 minutes before stage with a broken string haha. Only thing I wanna do with the 69 is lower the action. Otherwise feels/looks lovely. And it makes a change to my RG's.
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#113 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 07:55 AM

Update:

 

Just gone an email from GAK.....

 

"Line 6 have sent your guitar back to us as no fault found. They say it is working to spec."

 

:angry:

 

nightmare, I really had hoped they would fix it.

 

i have asked GAK what my options are ... really very disappointed.


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#114 chimp_spanner

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 02:18 PM

Update:

 

Just gone an email from GAK.....

 

"Line 6 have sent your guitar back to us as no fault found. They say it is working to spec."

 

:angry:

 

nightmare, I really had hoped they would fix it.

 

i have asked GAK what my options are ... really very disappointed.

 

Oooft, really sucks man. I'm sure if you were to demonstrate the problem to GAK with recordings they would agree it's not acceptable. If you can find an 89 fixed anywhere I'd highly recommend it. My dad's doesn't exhibit any of these problems. 


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#115 RPascarella

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 06:30 PM

So I've been following this off and on for some time since I have a JTV-89 with the hard tail bridge.  My low E string sounds "plinky" as one poster eloquently described.  I filed a ticket with Line 6 and received this response:

 

Hi,

We have been involved in this thread online for a while. There is no issue with your guitar.
The short answer is piezos sound different than mag pickups because the string rests across the pickup element.
The larger the string the more pressure. 
More pressure = frequency build up.
If you are using a guitar model or amp that already has a lot of build up in the high-mids you are going to hear a "plink" especially at high gain levels. This can be EQ'ed out and is not anything outside of the normal operation of the guitar.
You can hear this same sound on a lot of acoustic/electric guitars that use piezo systems. It's just not as apparent because you are not using high gain effects.

Thanks,
David

 

At first I thought, no way, it sounds to me like a cocked wah on the low E string, maybe bad filtering either in hardware or software.  So the first thing I did to prove this wrong was take an A string I had laying around (0.36" diameter) and put it in place of my low E.  I tuned it first to A, then to E, and sure enough in both tunings the plink disappeared.  So it must be harmonics or vibrations on the fat E string.

 

Next, I took a piece of felt I had and cut a very small strip and placed it over the piezo below the string.  Viola, problem is about 90% gone, definitely subtle enough that no one would notice unless I told them.  In the following recordings, the first section is the magnetic pickups, then the piezos in standard tuning, then the piezos in 1 Down tuning.  So here is a recording before the felt strip:

 

https://www.dropbox....mggx/Before.m4a

 

And the recording after putting in the felt strip:

 

https://www.dropbox....3hijg/After.m4a

 

And here are some photos showing the felt and what it looks like installed:

 

https://www.dropbox....0616_212407.jpg

https://www.dropbox....0616_212510.jpg

 

The felt must be acting as a damper to dampen out the ringing and excessive vibration of the fatter E string.

 

My next task is to dampen the strings at the nut with some Velcro or something.  You can definitely hear the ringing when using the piezos.

 

I hope this helps some of you guys.  It sounds way better to me and just saved me from selling this guitar.  I wanted the Dream Rig, and the crappy sound of the low E string when chugging was definitely not part of that Dream!

 

Randy


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#116 clay-man

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Posted 16 June 2014 - 08:32 PM

So I've been following this off and on for some time since I have a JTV-89 with the hard tail bridge.  My low E string sounds "plinky" as one poster eloquently described.  I filed a ticket with Line 6 and received this response:

 

Hi,

We have been involved in this thread online for a while. There is no issue with your guitar.
The short answer is piezos sound different than mag pickups because the string rests across the pickup element.
The larger the string the more pressure. 
More pressure = frequency build up.
If you are using a guitar model or amp that already has a lot of build up in the high-mids you are going to hear a "plink" especially at high gain levels. This can be EQ'ed out and is not anything outside of the normal operation of the guitar.
You can hear this same sound on a lot of acoustic/electric guitars that use piezo systems. It's just not as apparent because you are not using high gain effects.

Thanks,
David

 

At first I thought, no way, it sounds to me like a cocked wah on the low E string, maybe bad filtering either in hardware or software.  So the first thing I did to prove this wrong was take an A string I had laying around (0.36" diameter) and put it in place of my low E.  I tuned it first to A, then to E, and sure enough in both tunings the plink disappeared.  So it must be harmonics or vibrations on the fat E string.

 

Next, I took a piece of felt I had and cut a very small strip and placed it over the piezo below the string.  Viola, problem is about 90% gone, definitely subtle enough that no one would notice unless I told them.  In the following recordings, the first section is the magnetic pickups, then the piezos in standard tuning, then the piezos in 1 Down tuning.  So here is a recording before the felt strip:

 

https://www.dropbox....mggx/Before.m4a

 

And the recording after putting in the felt strip:

 

https://www.dropbox....3hijg/After.m4a

 

And here are some photos showing the felt and what it looks like installed:

 

https://www.dropbox....0616_212407.jpg

https://www.dropbox....0616_212510.jpg

 

The felt must be acting as a damper to dampen out the ringing and excessive vibration of the fatter E string.

 

My next task is to dampen the strings at the nut with some Velcro or something.  You can definitely hear the ringing when using the piezos.

 

I hope this helps some of you guys.  It sounds way better to me and just saved me from selling this guitar.  I wanted the Dream Rig, and the crappy sound of the low E string when chugging was definitely not part of that Dream!

 

Randy

 

This is a very helpful post, but I must say that I think Line 6 is wrong to say that there's nothing wrong with the guitar. Obviously the piezos are faulty, oversensitive. The least they could do is replace the faulty piezo element.

 

Not everyone has the plinking problem and it's not because of the way they set up their amp. I can set up my amp settings anyway I want and there's no plinking going on at all for me.


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For a minute there, I lost myself.

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#117 chimp_spanner

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 07:00 AM

Yeah, new 69 user here and I can say that while some models are a little more sensitive to muting + high gain than others, I'm getting great results with Firebird and Tele with Widerange humbucker so there's nothing inherently wrong with the design of the guitar that means it can't do palm muting. Does seem to be a guitar-to-guitar thing and I count myself and my dad as lucky to both have good units. I hope you get this resolved dude. I'm absolutely blown away by the Variax but it's for that exact reason that it sucks so much when it doesn't work out.


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#118 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 07:04 AM

Yeah, new 69 user here and I can say that while some models are a little more sensitive to muting + high gain than others, I'm getting great results with Firebird and Tele with Widerange humbucker so there's nothing inherently wrong with the design of the guitar that means it can't do palm muting. Does seem to be a guitar-to-guitar thing and I count myself and my dad as lucky to both have good units. I hope you get this resolved dude. I'm absolutely blown away by the Variax but it's for that exact reason that it sucks so much when it doesn't work out.

 

Cool, glad you got a good one ... thats great.

 

Still waiting on a reply from GAK on what my options are.

 

I guess they are looking into it.


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#119 psarkissian

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 08:42 AM

I service JTV's all day at Line 6 in California, haven't come across this issue yet myself.

And I've serviced hundreds of them. Two things here I see that are different,....

 

1) I mostly finger pick, not flat-pick when I play these.

 

2) I usually don't play through an HD500 or HD500X.

 

To isolate the issue down to the guitar, have to play just the guitar. Play with finger and with flat-pick.

Use a variety of stiff and flexi flat-picks, those also affect such things as pluck transients.

 

Each effect in a 500 or 500X has gain and some form of EQ or filtering,.... got to keep track of that

or it gets out of hand quickly if you have a number of them cascaded together in a chain. Happens

to me all the time when I tests this stuff. Sometimes it's just a matter of dialing something down on

the effects board.

 

And if you're in "Spank" model,... it's Modeled after a 1959 Strat, not some 1990's re-issue. All the

Gulf Coast Blues players covet that 6th string sound. It's part of that vintage '59 Strat thing they all

love. The guy who wrote the firmware tells me that, that '59 Strat was one sweet vintage blues guitar.

 

I'm more of a Gibson, Gretsch, Rickenbacker kind of guy myself. But I go to the Spank when I want

to do some David Gilmore or Joe Walsh riffs.


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#120 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 08:50 AM

Interesting.

To add to that, I played it through an Axe-FX II on various models and also on a Spider Jam... Just to make sure it was not just on the Axe-FX II... I got the same results on both devices.

I finger pick as well, and a pick does make it worse... Although it is still there when I use my fingernail too.
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