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Vibration Rattle In L2t Speaker Vibration Rattle L2m

vibration rattle obnoxious vibration noise obnoxious rattle vibration rattl l2t l2m annoy prominent loud buzz

Best Answer Line6Tony , 21 April 2014 - 09:09 AM

Hey Line 6
Too much heat on the ongoing issue with your L2t L2m L3t and L3m speakers that you deleted the post where hosts of people were complaining about the obnoxious vibration and ratte in our high end speakers. We are all looking for answers, came to what is supposed to be our way of communicating as a "Line6 community" and you removed it? WOW

As of now you have finally admitted it is a problem
BUT can't say what the fix is
OR when we can expect it

But deleting the post that everyone was following is definitely low.
Even if someone had posted a bad word or two you could delete that post only.

Please... I need to hear the reason for this latest move.

The original thread is back after being accidentally hidden, along with some other threads I'm still trying to find and reinstate. Please PM me if you know the titles of any such threads that disappeared. I'm sorry about any confusion or additional angst caused.

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#1 tudscamp

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 03:13 AM

Hey Line 6
Too much heat on the ongoing issue with your L2t L2m L3t and L3m speakers that you deleted the post where hosts of people were complaining about the obnoxious vibration and ratte in our high end speakers. We are all looking for answers, came to what is supposed to be our way of communicating as a "Line6 community" and you removed it? WOW

As of now you have finally admitted it is a problem
BUT can't say what the fix is
OR when we can expect it

But deleting the post that everyone was following is definitely low.
Even if someone had posted a bad word or two you could delete that post only.

Please... I need to hear the reason for this latest move.
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#2 jamiegravelin

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 05:10 AM

I just purchased two of the L2t Stagesource speakers and discovered the fan rattle.  Please let us know when a fix will be available.


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#3 velok

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 08:45 AM

I need to hear the reason all these posts have been deleted as well, the post I submitted yesterday providing proof that you were alerted to this issue over a year ago has already been deleted.  Line6, please contact me directly. You have my contact info.  This is ridiculous and making you look even worse.


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#4 sdevino

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 11:18 AM

I do not think the earlier posts were deleted intentionally. But we may have to wait until Monday to find out more. In the mean time this is what we posted on Friday:

 

Line 6 is aware that some L2 model speakers are exhibiting a rattling noise in specific cases and applications. We have determined the root cause is the fan. We are aggressively working on a solution that will undergo extensive testing to ensure that:

 

·         the noise problem is addressed

·         the fan performs as expected

·         no new issues are introduced

 

Although we’ve made this a high priority, we can’t commit to a timeframe until we have a qualified solution in house. Once that work is complete, customers who report the problem to Line 6 Customer Service will be given appropriate guidelines for repair. 

 

We will report a solution at the earliest opportunity, and we thank you for your continued patience.

 

What this says is we do know what the problem is and we are actively working on a solution which requires finding, replacing, and testing a new part. I am sure all of you would appreciate this being a thorough and well tested solution. Until the parts arrive and the testing is completed there is no legitimate way we can give you a time line without being misleading.  So for right now it is still TBD which is the only accurate answer we can provide for now.


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#5 tinorios

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 12:55 PM

Say you are a customer with speakers with this rattling problem, you are losing gigs because of this problem and you cannot wait for a final solution which at this time is TBD. What can this customer do, or what will Line 6 do for this category of user, right now?

 

Can the customer return the noisy speakers for a full refund?

 

Is the company capable of testing speakers to determine which ones rattle and which ones don't?

 

Can the company replace the speakers that rattle with speakers that don't rattle right now?

 

Just curious. My speakers don't rattle but it is not clear from all these posts, present and missing ones, what alternatives are available right now.


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#6 silverhead

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 01:18 PM

I expect that right now, since there is no corporate statement other than the above, things are being handled on an individual basis thought the normal support ticket route. Anyone experiencing this issue should open a support ticket. They will receive an individualized answer to your question.
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#7 velok

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 07:16 PM

Cheers to Line6 for restoring this topic as well as the "L3m Has A Rattle Just Like The L2m" on the forum.  It speaks well of you!  I do notice however that many of the posts from this forum are gone.  If this is just a technical glitch, please restore those posts as well.  I applaud your decision to restore these topics to the forum, despite the fact that they detail a Line6 speaker defect.  I think that I probably express the same sentiment as most of the user base when I say, that was the right decision.


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#8 tinorios

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 05:38 AM

I expect that right now, since there is no corporate statement other than the above, things are being handled on an individual basis thought the normal support ticket route. Anyone experiencing this issue should open a support ticket. They will receive an individualized answer to your question.

 

Thank you for your reply. It is now clear to me.

 

I would like to hear from those suffering with speaker rattles how the company resolved your problem, right now, before the final fix. Everything I have read about Line 6 support in this forum has been positive and I would hope that will continue with this particular problem.

 

If enough persons post their experience for how their problem was resolved, we might be able to figure out what the Line 6 policy is regarding this unfortunate issue. Still, a clear corporate statement might have saved a lot of agony on the part of those experiencing this problem. In the deleted thread, one could not an increasing level of desperation that could have been avoided had the company been more forthright. Maybe this experience will be a motivating factor for better performance in the future. 

 

There's no need to let people suffer emotional and financial loss. Basically, that's the point I'm trying to make. I hope I'm clear on it.


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#9 gordwait

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 06:19 AM

I do hope the disappearing posts is a technical glitch in the forum. Terribly bad timing though, has all the "look and feel" of a "Streisand Effect Event"..


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#10 sdevino

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 07:06 AM

Thank you for your reply. It is now clear to me.

 

I would like to hear from those suffering with speaker rattles how the company resolved your problem, right now, before the final fix. Everything I have read about Line 6 support in this forum has been positive and I would hope that will continue with this particular problem.

 

If enough persons post their experience for how their problem was resolved, we might be able to figure out what the Line 6 policy is regarding this unfortunate issue. Still, a clear corporate statement might have saved a lot of agony on the part of those experiencing this problem. In the deleted thread, one could not an increasing level of desperation that could have been avoided had the company been more forthright. Maybe this experience will be a motivating factor for better performance in the future. 

 

There's no need to let people suffer emotional and financial loss. Basically, that's the point I'm trying to make. I hope I'm clear on it.

 

I want to try to add perspective to this thread.

  1. Every speaker cabinet from every manufacturer will buzz or rattle under the right sonic conditions. We know this because we had no problem generating buzzes and rattles in every one of our competitors speakers that we have tested, all speaker builders know this all to well. Once you know what combination of sound and power it takes to create the buzz, then you can recreate it over and over again as well as teach others to do the same. 
  2. If you happen to be a user who happens to use any speaker from any manufacturer in a way that causes an undesired rattle, feedback, frequency bump, or if your speaker turns out to be too heavy, too big, too small or in any other way inappropriate for your use then you should contact the retailer you purchased it from or customer service and work with them to resolve things to your satisfaction. 

 

If any speaker you have from Line 6 is not performing to your expectations due to some kind of electrical or mechanical issue then you should contact customer service to address your individual issue. If your speakers are working well for your application then please keep on keeping on.


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#11 tinorios

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 08:11 AM

I want to try to add perspective to this thread.

  1. Every speaker cabinet from every manufacturer will buzz or rattle under the right sonic conditions. We know this because we had no problem generating buzzes and rattles in every one of our competitors speakers that we have tested, all speaker builders know this all to well. Once you know what combination of sound and power it takes to create the buzz, then you can recreate it over and over again as well as teach others to do the same. 
  2. If you happen to be a user who happens to use any speaker from any manufacturer in a way that causes an undesired rattle, feedback, frequency bump, or if your speaker turns out to be too heavy, too big, too small or in any other way inappropriate for your use then you should contact the retailer you purchased it from or customer service and work with them to resolve things to your satisfaction. 

 

If any speaker you have from Line 6 is not performing to your expectations due to some kind of electrical or mechanical issue then you should contact customer service to address your individual issue. If your speakers are working well for your application then please keep on keeping on.

 

Thank you for your clear reply.

 

My Line 6 speakers are working well for my application so I'm going to keep on keeping on!


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#12 Digital-sound

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 09:13 AM

Mine as well. Even with bass running through our L2m stage monitors because no bass cab onstage, we have no issues. And our L3t's as FOH speakers with all instruments and drums, have no issue whatsoever.

I am fully on board with the people that have problems and do expect Line 6 to make good to those people. Just want people who may "google" this in their research before buying to see that it is not all of the speakers. There are probably lots that will never see this problem.
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#13 velok

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 11:10 AM

I want to try to add perspective to this thread.

  1. Every speaker cabinet from every manufacturer will buzz or rattle under the right sonic conditions. We know this because we had no problem generating buzzes and rattles in every one of our competitors speakers that we have tested, all speaker builders know this all to well. Once you know what combination of sound and power it takes to create the buzz, then you can recreate it over and over again as well as teach others to do the same. 
  2. If you happen to be a user who happens to use any speaker from any manufacturer in a way that causes an undesired rattle, feedback, frequency bump, or if your speaker turns out to be too heavy, too big, too small or in any other way inappropriate for your use then you should contact the retailer you purchased it from or customer service and work with them to resolve things to your satisfaction. 

 

If any speaker you have from Line 6 is not performing to your expectations due to some kind of electrical or mechanical issue then you should contact customer service to address your individual issue. If your speakers are working well for your application then please keep on keeping on.

 

"Sdevino",

 

I appreciate the point you are making about there being a way to  make every speaker buzz or rattle with the right amount of power and just the right method in the lab.  That does not explain away or excuse the blatant rattle in Line6 speakers under normal playing conditions.  Most other manufacturer's speakers simply are not this vulnerable to loud rattling and flat out don't produce it under normal usage.  Any of us who have used other manufacturer's speakers with our Line6 system have noticed that you cannot recreate this loud rattle with any other brand of speakers, no matter what you try.  No combination of circumstances seems to create this loud rattle on anything other than Line6 speakers!

 

I don't feel you have added "perspective" to this issue. Instead, once again, it seems as if Line6 is again minimizing and muddying the issue.  Previous tactics to minimize the issue have included the following:

 

  1. The rattle is miminal and inaudible in live performance (not true)
  2. The rattle only occurs with guitar and bass (not true)
  3. The rattle only occurs on a few speakers (not true from what we have seen on the forum;  additionally "sdevino's" own post seems to imply that noise can be reliably recreated on any speaker once you know how to do it. That is indeed the situation we on the forum have noticed with all of the Line6 speakers we have tested.  We are from different geographical locations, clearly this issue is widespread, probably not just a few speakers)
  4. Now I can add "sdevinos" explanation to this list, paraphrased "that every other manufacturer's speakers will exibit this behavior" (not true, other quality speakers do not demonstrate this behavior under "normal" operating conditions despite what you may or may not be able to drive them to do in the lab)

 

You have a production defect in your speakers.  It is obvious, blatant and loud under normal operating conditions!  Other brands of mid to high range quality speakers do not rattle or buzz so audibly under normal usage.  If they did those manufacturer's speakers would have long since been fixed or pushed out of the market place.

 

Most of us on the forum did not require someone to "teach" us how to produce the rattle.  Are you now inferring that the problem is not that there is a rattle but that we have "taught" people to spot it?  That is analogous to saying that the problem is not the assault but the fact that it was reported.  We customers unfortunately stumbled across this issue under normal usage.  There is a good chance that many other users will encounter this sound (many long after their return period has expired) if they add or change instruments they use in the band or use any of a wide number of settings.  We on the forum did not have to provide some arcane method of finding this rattle by playing in a trapezoidally shaped room with a glockenspiel played at clipping levels.  This rattle occurs under normal playing conditions with everyday instruments and settings!

 

I understand Line6 trying to exhaust every prossible way of minimizing, rationalizing, and otherwise blurring the seriousness of this defect.  All of them remain counter-productive.  The right path here is to acknowledge the problem, not state that every other manufactuer's speaker has it.  That is simply not accurate or demonstrable by anything we are encountering out here in the real world, despite the fact that "sdevino" states they can reproduce this defect in a test lab on other speakers. You are right to point out that users should not expect a speaker to be "bullet proof" under all circumstances, we understand that physics, design and cost limitations play a part.  We just expect a speaker that does not rattle LOUDLY under normal operating conditions.

 

I might add, if Line6 had spent a fraction of the time testing their own speakers that they appear to have spent testing for rattles in other manufacturer's speakers they might have nipped this issue in the bud and spared their customers the problem.

 

You have known about this issue for over a year.  Stop producing and selling these speakers until they are redesigned/fixed!  Redesign them already and swap in new parts on existing speakers and please stop deluding yourselves that this is business as usual and that these speakers have the same problem as everybody else's  They do not!  Even if every other speaker had this issue (they don't) that would not be a good reason not to fix it.

 

Line6 speakers are fantastic sounding speakers in their own right.  These are superb sounding speakers with some unique and wonderful features, but they have a major defect. "Sdevino" please ask yourself if you would assert the opposite of what you stated in your post.  Would you assert that, with the right settings, every other manufacturer's speakers can sound just as good as Line6 speakers?  No you would not!  It would not be true! So why assert the opposite (that every other manufacturer's speakers can be made to produce this rattle and have this same or a similiar defect; it is simply not true under normal usage, which is what counts)?  Line6 speakers would sound better than many others were it not for this critical defect.  Their magnificent potential is abundantly obvious. 

 

The best way to do damage control here is to admit the problem, promise a fix and/or some sort of compensation to current affected users and by all means stop selling fatally flawed speakers to new customers.  Make a promise to your affected users, fix it and move on.  Anything else looks like double-talk, propoganda, rationalization, and denial.  You cannot talk your way out of a physical defect.


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#14 silverhead

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 11:48 AM

Velok, do you have defective speakers? If so, have you opened a support ticket to have the issue resolved?
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#15 velok

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 12:27 PM

To all of my brothers and sisters who have working

 

Velok, do you have defective speakers? If so, have you opened a support ticket to have the issue resolved?

Silverhead,

 

I do have defective speakers, 2 L3Ms.  I also have L3S subs.  I have not used the subs enough to determine if they have an issue but I must admit I am now worried about it after having a total of 6 defective L2M(4 speakers) and L3M(2 speakers) speakers.

 

I have an open ticket with Line6 and they have made what I believe to be a sincere effort to reach out to me. They left a message asking me to call back but we have been unable to connect as of yet.  I still have faith in Line6 customer service and have high expectations we will be able to resolve the issue.  However, my sympathies still lie with all the folks who have been impacted and inconvenienced by this issue and I would like to see Line6 deal with it in a more proactive manner.  I would feel better about the situation if I had not bought my speakers brand new, over a year after Line6 had been alerted to this issue.  That seems to be a long time to continue to sell a product with a known defect without some sort of fix.


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#16 sdevino

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 12:52 PM

As I said contact customer support if you have an issue or concern. I think all question posed since my update on the post above were answered in that post.

 

Thanks


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#17 velok

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 12:52 PM

To all my brothers and sisters on the forum,

 

We who are experiencing this issue with a pronounced rattle and trying to get a resolution appreciate knowing that there are people who are not impacted by it.  We are happy for you if not perhaps indeed a little envious as we peek over the room divider and see your working speakers.

 

With that said, I don't know how constructive it is to repeatedly chime in about how your speakers are working correctly.  We who are impacted by this issue are trying to work with Line6 to get a resolution.  Your repetition of how your speaker "works perfectly" diminishes our voice, precisely when we need to send a unified and loud and clear message to Line6.  Frankly, it feels a little as if I was in a long line of people at the local electronics store all returning the exact same defective TV and there is someone repeatedly running up to the front of the line and yelling "My TV works fine", over and over.  We get it, one post about how well yours is working is informative, it tells us that some people either don't have the rattle, or don't encounter it in THEIR normal usage.  Several posts makes you a bit of a shill for Line6 and does not assist your fellow brothers and sisters in the Line6 community in reaching a satisfactory resolution with Line6.

 

I promise you that you will feel exactly as I do about these repeated posts if you ever have a problem with your Line6 equipment that you are trying to resolve.  You will not appreciate the same person repeatedly posting into the forum that their device works properly when you are trying to resolve a genuine factory defect with Line6.  I do want to express my appreciation for the assistance, observations, suggestions, and other attempts to be helpful that, paradoxically, these same fellow users have made.  Frankly I also understand people's desire to be in Line6's good graces.  I would prefer not to be making these posts.  I do not wish to incur the wrath of Line6.  I intend to use their products for many years to come and have no wish to antagonize them.  I am sure I will need a friendly and helpful customer service rep at some point in the future.  I would like to live in hopes that my consistently glowing reviews would result in them sending me some free merchandise. Ahhh, sigh, however, such is not my current situation.

 

In summation, if you feel you have to post "that yours works fine" into a topic where people are trying to resolve a defect with Line6.  Please do it only once!  Everyone values your constructive input on the issue, please, have at it.  However, you only need to say "yours works fine" once, we get it.

 

Postscript: I wish some of you would provide your perfectly working speakers to Line6 so they examine them for what is different from the defective speakers.


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#18 Digital-sound

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 04:29 PM

I think we only need to hear about defective speakers once. Even once per person. But this thread has gone crazy. If you have been given a number, call it. Put twice the effort into contacting customer support as you do posting here, with the information you were given, and I am sure you will get further than you do in this forum. I think it is very fair to mention that several speakers work fine. I am sure that a lot more than your 6 defective ones. I have 8 that are used often with NO issue. People doing there research on new speakers need to know this as well. As silverhead has pointed out, focus your energy on customer support and you will arrive at a solution. This forum is intended for community support. And I support you in your quest to get it looked after to your satisfaction. It is fine to mention you have a problem with 6 speakers. We get it. Over and over and over again.

Let me say it again, people need to know there are many many good line 6 speakers out there.

I apologize for responding this way, but I don't think your posts are effective anymore. It's like turning down the wrong road and then complaining it isn't getting you to where you want to be. Again, "customer support" is what you want. This is "community support". And believe me, you have it.
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#19 velok

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 07:54 PM

I think we only need to hear about defective speakers once. Even once per person. But this thread has gone crazy. If you have been given a number, call it. Put twice the effort into contacting customer support as you do posting here, with the information you were given, and I am sure you will get further than you do in this forum. I think it is very fair to mention that several speakers work fine. I am sure that a lot more than your 6 defective ones. I have 8 that are used often with NO issue. People doing there research on new speakers need to know this as well. As silverhead has pointed out, focus your energy on customer support and you will arrive at a solution. This forum is intended for community support. And I support you in your quest to get it looked after to your satisfaction. It is fine to mention you have a problem with 6 speakers. We get it. Over and over and over again.

Let me say it again, people need to know there are many many good line 6 speakers out there.

I apologize for responding this way, but I don't think your posts are effective anymore. It's like turning down the wrong road and then complaining it isn't getting you to where you want to be. Again, "customer support" is what you want. This is "community support". And believe me, you have it.

 

Digital-sound,

 

You may only feel that we need to hear about defective speakers once but apparently Line6 needs to hear about them at length because over a year has gone by with no fix and continued denials regarding the severity of the problem as well as continued sales of a product with a known defect.  The effort to work with customer support is underway.  I have reached out to support on several occasions by phone and trouble ticket and I am looking forward to a resolution.  

 

You appear to have become hostile.  Accusing this topic of having become "crazy" is just hyperbole as well as being a most uncharitable description of people trying their level best to solve a problem you are feeling no pain from.  Perhaps there are better topics for you to frequent than this one as you appear to be unaffected by the issue.


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#20 tomtheguitarguy

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 10:27 PM

Line 6 responded to my Support Tickets (well - for only 1 of the 2 I submitted, since I have two L2t's with the rattle).  They asked me for a recording, so I'm going to whip out my video recorder to demonstrate the rattle...


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#21 Digital-sound

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 11:45 PM

I didn't mean to sound hostile velok. I am just saying if you want line 6 to hear you, this forum isn't nearly as effective as a support ticket or phone calls.
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#22 tudscamp

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 02:19 AM

To ALL,
To my knowledge, Line 6 DID NOT repost the topic. It is buried in the archives- unable to be replied to or posted on. It also doesn't show up if you search for those terms. You are reading it because I reposted. This does need to be out in front and as I have stated in the past, resolved immediately.

Tomtheguitarguy - the recording is just a way to push you off. I made them a high end recording weeks ago. Don't waste your time. Tell them to listen to my recording and they will know what your rattle sounds like.

Digital-sound - my parents raised me to never wish bad on anyone. They said that what goes around comes around. Yours will rattle someday too. However, when I mentioned your post on this forum, they said that it was ok to hope your speakers rattle loudly at your next big, important gig......

Cheers
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#23 SiWatts69

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 02:26 AM

I had absolutely no intentions of getting involved with this thread. I am unaffected so it seemed unfair and unneccessary to get involved but...

 

You have a production defect in your speakers. It is obvious, blatant and loud under normal operating conditions! Other brands of mid to high range quality speakers do not rattle or buzz so audibly under normal usage. If they did those manufacturer's speakers would have long since been fixed or pushed out of the market place.


A production defect would show in EVERY speaker, not just a few. The sonic frequencies present within yours and others' setups obviously ARE having an impact on you (I have no reason nor desire to rebut your claim) but to state it as a production defect is, in my humble opinion, a little unfair.

I'd quite sensibly agree that ALL manufacturers speakers will, at some point in the frequency spectrum under certain sonic conditions exhibit similar symptoms. It would be impossible to test or QC for infinite possibilities. wWhat I do agree with is that once such an issue has been discovered that it would be sensible of a manufacturer to take steps to a) own the problem and B) rectify it.

 

Most of us on the forum did not require someone to "teach" us how to produce the rattle. Are you now inferring that the problem is not that there is a rattle but that we have "taught" people to spot it? That is analogous to saying that the problem is not the assault but the fact that it was reported. We customers unfortunately stumbled across this issue under normal usage. There is a good chance that many other users will encounter this sound (many long after their return period has expired) if they add or change instruments they use in the band or use any of a wide number of settings. We on the forum did not have to provide some arcane method of finding this rattle by playing in a trapezoidally shaped room with a glockenspiel played at clipping levels. This rattle occurs under normal playing conditions with everyday instruments and settings!


I didn't read it that way at all. Yes, there will be customers who have experienced the buzz/rattle without *any* attempt to create it but there will also be others who have "found" it simply because they've gone looking for it based upon the conditions people with the problem have described. This is in essense what I believe was said.
 

I understand Line6 trying to exhaust every prossible way of minimizing, rationalizing, and otherwise blurring the seriousness of this defect. All of them remain counter-productive. The right path here is to acknowledge the problem, not state that every other manufactuer's speaker has it. That is simply not accurate or demonstrable by anything we are encountering out here in the real world, despite the fact that "sdevino" states they can reproduce this defect in a test lab on other speakers. You are right to point out that users should not expect a speaker to be "bullet proof" under all circumstances, we understand that physics, design and cost limitations play a part. We just expect a speaker that does not rattle LOUDLY under normal operating conditions.


From an outsiders, unaffected point of view, I don't see anyone from Line6 (or indeed elsewhere) trying to blur the seriousness of your problem. They are counter-productive in your opinion but, by the same token, your ever increasing rants are also appearing counter-productive in my opinion since you are gradually alienating a number of your otherwise supportive fellow users.

 

You have known about this issue for over a year. Stop producing and selling these speakers until they are redesigned/fixed! Redesign them already and swap in new parts on existing speakers and please stop deluding yourselves that this is business as usual and that these speakers have the same problem as everybody else's They do not! Even if every other speaker had this issue (they don't) that would not be a good reason not to fix it.


Again, to claim this is, in my opinion, a little unfair. It implies that you've been able to test every single user's speaker where they've reported a rattle, buzz, vibration etc over the past year and been able to isolate all of them to a single cause. Instead, all I can see is you scouring the forum looking for any mention of "vibration", "buzz" or "rattle" and lumping every one of these reports in to your one size fits all "defect"... not to mention delivering the same rant into those threads.

 

Line6 speakers are fantastic sounding speakers in their own right. These are superb sounding speakers with some unique and wonderful features, but they have a major defect. "Sdevino" please ask yourself if you would assert the opposite of what you stated in your post. Would you assert that, with the right settings, every other manufacturer's speakers can sound just as good as Line6 speakers? No you would not! It would not be true! So why assert the opposite (that every other manufacturer's speakers can be made to produce this rattle and have this same or a similiar defect; it is simply not true under normal usage, which is what counts)? Line6 speakers would sound better than many others were it not for this critical defect. Their magnificent potential is abundantly obvious.


Velok, as others have said already, the forum is not the *best* place to get your issue resolved. Use the already established support system and, more importantly, give Line6 chance to respond and take ownership of the problem you are experiencing. Otherwise you increasing look like a troll.

Tomtheguitarguy - the recording is just a way to push you off. I made them a high end recording weeks ago. Don't waste your time. Tell them to listen to my recording and they will know what your rattle sounds like.


Sorry tudscamp, I don't see haw listening to your rattle will inform Line6 of what tomtheguitarguy's rattle sounds like. You are assuming that they are identical. I would *hope* that they are identical, since this would imply a single issue that will be modestly easy to rectify BUT I wouldn't want to *assume* that they are.

Truly, I sympathise with *anyone* who has a problem. I am also honestly happy that I am *currently* unaffected. I'd also *like* to think that Line6 are fully investigating and taking steps to resolve any such issues as quickly as is feasible. BUT I'm not convinced that ranting on a user forum, taking pot shots at people who are trying to offer constructive assistance is at all productive. Getting hot under the collar is not good for your blood pressure.
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#24 ArneLine6

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 06:38 AM

Tudscamp- we did listen to your recording. We are trying to really find out what is going on case by case. A description of one case does not explain another case. If you google "manufacturer x" and "rattle" and try to make sense of what you find it becomes obvious that it is difficult to qualify a problem based on third hand reports.
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#25 tudscamp

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 06:53 AM

I would like to apologize to anyone that may be offended after reading this.  

 

I did not sit by my speakers attempting to find a flaw.  I did however notice an issue.  A rather obnoxious one.  In order to determine what the ugly rattle / vibration that was emanating from my speaker, I needed to figure out when it happened and be able to replicate it long enough to follow it to the source.  That is why we know what causes it.  I, and my band mates have since heard it.  During guitar solo's.  During a-capella songs.  During acoustic guitar parts, and during piano only songs. 

 

This isn't confined to a few speakers.  People have returned speakers for new replacements - 2, 3, 4 even 6 times only to have the same issue.  

 

While I am totally thrilled for those of you who do not have the issue, I see no reason for repeated posts saying that you are OK with your speakers.  Good for you.  The rest of us are not happy with ours and are equally unhappy with the fact that our problem still exists.  Please don't tell me not to complain more than once.

If you lost power in a storm and called the electric company - would you call again if you didn't have power after a week????.... 2 weeks???    4 weeks? Line 6 has not addressed the issue.  My original post goes back 8 or 9 weeks.  I am going to continue to complain until they do, or until they hand me back my full investment.  

 

And for anyone who "doesn't have any intentions of getting involved with this thread" because they are "unaffected" - you are correct - It is unfair and unnecessary to get involved , so next time don't add the "but" at the end of your sentence and stay un-involved!


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#26 sdevino

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 07:13 AM

To ALL,
To my knowledge, Line 6 DID NOT repost the topic. It is buried in the archives- unable to be replied to or posted on. It also doesn't show up if you search for those terms. You are reading it because I reposted. This does need to be out in front and as I have stated in the past, resolved immediately.

Tomtheguitarguy - the recording is just a way to push you off. I made them a high end recording weeks ago. Don't waste your time. Tell them to listen to my recording and they will know what your rattle sounds like.

Digital-sound - my parents raised me to never wish bad on anyone. They said that what goes around comes around. Yours will rattle someday too. However, when I mentioned your post on this forum, they said that it was ok to hope your speakers rattle loudly at your next big, important gig......

Cheers

While the whole thread was not reposted (I do not have admin capability to do that) I did repost the topic. As my Avatar states I am part of Line 6 staff.


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#27 silverhead

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 07:24 AM

 
And for anyone who "doesn't have any intentions of getting involved with this thread" because they are "unaffected" - you are correct - It is unfair and unnecessary to get involved , so next time don't add the "but" at the end of your sentence and stay un-involved!


It appears that you would like to dictate the nature of the comments posted in this thread. Isn't that exactly what you are alleging that Line 6 has done by supposedly deleting an earlier thread? Didn't that make you very upset? Seems you don't like censorship unless you get to be the censor.
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#28 tudscamp

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:04 AM

It appears that you would like to dictate the nature of the comments posted in this thread. Isn't that exactly what you are alleging that Line 6 has done by supposedly deleting an earlier thread? Didn't that make you very upset? Seems you don't like censorship unless you get to be the censor.

As I mentioned - I apologize for anyone who may be offended.  However, my posts involve an unresolved issue and my desire to have it resolved.  I don't need to hear from people (like yourself) who are not offering anything, but seem to have issue with the fact that I have an issue with Line 6.  I am not trying to dictate anything nor do I want anything to be censored.  I do want to hear from people that are having the SAME issue - Which by the way, is what this forum is about. I look forward to knowing that I am not an isolated instance of this problem.  I am going to squeak until I get oiled.  Sorry if that bothers some people.  Start another thread (please) but only speak about how great your speakers are and whatever else your little heart may want to discuss.  


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#29 TheRealZap

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:07 AM

the whole public topic will do little to affect the outcome of the issue anyway...

i recommend that you rant directly and without interference from others in your support ticket.

that way you can control the discussion as you wish....

 

 

 

 

And for anyone who "doesn't have any intentions of getting involved with this thread" because they are "unaffected" - you are correct - It is unfair and unnecessary to get involved , so next time don't add the "but" at the end of your sentence and stay un-involved!


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#30 silverhead

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:09 AM

I do have something constructive to offer - and I have done so. Contact Line 6 via the support ticket system to get your problem resolved. What's not constructive is to repeatedly restate the fact that you have a problem. We get it, we sympathize, and we hope it's soon resolved to your satisfaction.

And whether you want to hear from others in this thread is not your call. What my little heart wants to discuss is having a balanced viewpoint in any thread.
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#31 Line6Tony

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 09:09 AM   Best Answer

Hey Line 6
Too much heat on the ongoing issue with your L2t L2m L3t and L3m speakers that you deleted the post where hosts of people were complaining about the obnoxious vibration and ratte in our high end speakers. We are all looking for answers, came to what is supposed to be our way of communicating as a "Line6 community" and you removed it? WOW

As of now you have finally admitted it is a problem
BUT can't say what the fix is
OR when we can expect it

But deleting the post that everyone was following is definitely low.
Even if someone had posted a bad word or two you could delete that post only.

Please... I need to hear the reason for this latest move.

The original thread is back after being accidentally hidden, along with some other threads I'm still trying to find and reinstate. Please PM me if you know the titles of any such threads that disappeared. I'm sorry about any confusion or additional angst caused.


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#32 tomtheguitarguy

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 10:44 AM

I just sent Line 6 a short video of my rattle/buzz.  It's uploading to YouTube and can be seen here:   http://youtu.be/R9zxsbDBHWU  after it finishes processing...

 

The video doesn't really do "justice" to the amount of buzz/rattle given that's it's a cellphone video...


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#33 velok

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 12:38 PM

I had absolutely no intentions of getting involved with this thread. I am unaffected so it seemed unfair and unneccessary to get involved but...

 

A production defect would show in EVERY speaker, not just a few. The sonic frequencies present within yours and others' setups obviously ARE having an impact on you (I have no reason nor desire to rebut your claim) but to state it as a production defect is, in my humble opinion, a little unfair.

I'd quite sensibly agree that ALL manufacturers speakers will, at some point in the frequency spectrum under certain sonic conditions exhibit similar symptoms. It would be impossible to test or QC for infinite possibilities. wWhat I do agree with is that once such an issue has been discovered that it would be sensible of a manufacturer to take steps to a) own the problem and B) rectify it.

 

I didn't read it that way at all. Yes, there will be customers who have experienced the buzz/rattle without *any* attempt to create it but there will also be others who have "found" it simply because they've gone looking for it based upon the conditions people with the problem have described. This is in essense what I believe was said.
 

From an outsiders, unaffected point of view, I don't see anyone from Line6 (or indeed elsewhere) trying to blur the seriousness of your problem. They are counter-productive in your opinion but, by the same token, your ever increasing rants are also appearing counter-productive in my opinion since you are gradually alienating a number of your otherwise supportive fellow users.

 

Again, to claim this is, in my opinion, a little unfair. It implies that you've been able to test every single user's speaker where they've reported a rattle, buzz, vibration etc over the past year and been able to isolate all of them to a single cause. Instead, all I can see is you scouring the forum looking for any mention of "vibration", "buzz" or "rattle" and lumping every one of these reports in to your one size fits all "defect"... not to mention delivering the same rant into those threads.

 

Velok, as others have said already, the forum is not the *best* place to get your issue resolved. Use the already established support system and, more importantly, give Line6 chance to respond and take ownership of the problem you are experiencing. Otherwise you increasing look like a troll.


Sorry tudscamp, I don't see haw listening to your rattle will inform Line6 of what tomtheguitarguy's rattle sounds like. You are assuming that they are identical. I would *hope* that they are identical, since this would imply a single issue that will be modestly easy to rectify BUT I wouldn't want to *assume* that they are.

Truly, I sympathise with *anyone* who has a problem. I am also honestly happy that I am *currently* unaffected. I'd also *like* to think that Line6 are fully investigating and taking steps to resolve any such issues as quickly as is feasible. BUT I'm not convinced that ranting on a user forum, taking pot shots at people who are trying to offer constructive assistance is at all productive. Getting hot under the collar is not good for your blood pressure.

 

 

SiWatts69,

 

Wow, you have jumped in on a topic where you have absolutely no dog in the fight just so you could crap on everyone who is already having a bad day due to a long known Line6 production problem. 

 

To be fair, you do lack some context as most of the people who had posted here about this problem have had their posts deleted.  Line6 is currently making an effort to restore them and did not actually authorize the deletion.  I know because I spoke with them.  Did you know for instance that this is a known production problem by Line6?  There was a (now deleted) post with a Line6 rep simultaneously stating that the rattle is a known production line issue (so much for your comment about it not being one) and that Line6 has been working on a fix.  They did their level best to make it appear that it was not the major issue it is, but they did admit to it.  There are posts regarding this issue going back over a year.

 

Almost every point you made is erroneous, some are almost laughable.  I will not dignify them with an answer or repeat myself as all of these points have been addressed already by people who are unfortunately intimately familiar with the issue and infinitely more qualified than yourself to comment on it.  I had started my posting in this topic by being meticulously courteous while also endeavoring to be firm and not let Line6 off the hook for a long running problem that has cost its users thousands of dollars and unbelievable stress.  I no longer have the patience not to call out these very few fellow users in our community for bad behavior.  I have been a member on these boards for more years than most.  I do not have a history of flaming Line6 nor do I wish to.  THIS IS A LEGITIMATE AND VERY EXPENSIVE PROBLEM FOR THOSE OF US WHO ARE IMPACTED.   I, along with many others have a serious and expensive rattling problem that Line6 has acknowledged both publicly and privately with their production and speaker design.  They have had to be dragged kicking and screaming but they have acknowledged it.  We on this forum are making a sincere effort to work things out with Line6,  warn prospective buyers and express the pain, enormous expense, stress, and inconvenience we have all been subjected to because Line6 has continued to sell speakers they know to be defective.

 

Despite the abuse heaped on us by fellow users who do not seem to fully grasp the magnitude and scope of this issue, several of us have endeavored to provide a warning to prospective buyers of these speakers and simultaneously be vocal enough to encourage Line6 to stop selling defective speakers, fix the issue, and compensate those who have been impacted.  Our efforts have been met from just a very few members of the Line6 community with derision, abuse, and repeated and not so well intentioned proclamations from those who claim they either have not been impacted by this issue or even worse, don't even own these speakers.  Please don't fetishize these boards by being an abusive windbag on issues that don't impact you.  I realize this is just an academic exercize to you, but it is a really bad scene for us.  You are just having some fun commenting critically on an issue that does not directly impact you.  You should know that you are causing real pain and consternation with your comments to those of us who are out a lot of money and time and still have no resolution.  There are plenty of other topics here on the forum that may amuse you and where you may be of great assistance. I encourage you to spend your time on those topics.

 

I do not understand why rabid fanboys have to jump into topics that are basically intended as dialogs between impacted customers and Line6 and show their undying loyalty to Line6 at the expense of everyone who is trying to work out a known issue with Line6. Your posts are divisive and trade on every affected user's pain in a vain effort to raise yourself up in the eyes of the Line6 reps.  Btw, after talking to the reps I believe there is a good chance that most of the reps are hip to this sort of pandering, so save your breath and save us the aggravation.  At the very time when you should be supporting your fellow users you are undermining them.  This is not a good practice in any forum and should be avoided, pointed out, and condemned when it occurs.  So now, I am pointing it out in no uncertain terms.  Are you happy now you have made your best effort to "kill the messengers"?

 

Btw, here is an update.  A high level exec at Line6 has contacted me, they appear to be agressively pursuing a fix and are well aware that their handling of this issue could have been more elegant.  I found their representative to be courteous, well informed, and I believe well intentioned.  They still have not made any concrete promises or reparations but I honestly believe that they may have a fix soon and will make an effort to deliver it free of charge to ANYONE who has been impacted.   That of course remains to be seen.  I would entreat all of my fellow Line6 forum members not to attack us on this topic as we "work through the process".  We may have moments of anger or frustration or venting that you simply may not empathize with as you have been spared this issue. This issue has been dragging on for quite a while and neither Line6 nor the affected user base is happy about it.  You may one day find yourself in a similiar position with an unresolved product problem through no fault of your own.  Believe me when I say you will not appreciate your fellow forum members jumping into your topic and being unfairly critical or denying that there is an issue simply because they don't have it, can't hear it, or don't use the system in a way that evokes it.  Your behavior is particularly confounding in this case where Line6 has slowly admitted, at least on this forum, there is a real issue.


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#34 TheRealZap

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 01:43 PM

there is nothing wrong with others adding perspective to the thread... obviously its a big deal to you, and i think we get it... but it's also clear from other posts that the issue does not affect 100% of speakers sold.

and that's perhaps an important distinction for some.. .and having posters come in and add that to the mix is not forbidden... by anyone... you or line6.

lighten up... you've clearly been heard if you have execs calling you....

you really need to direct your focus towards the support team and anyone else at line6 that has provided you with contact information....

this is a community discussion forum... and the community is free to discuss... they are not simply free to agree with you or go away... as you seem to suggest.


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#35 velok

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 02:38 PM

there is nothing wrong with others adding perspective to the thread... obviously its a big deal to you, and i think we get it... but it's also clear from other posts that the issue does not affect 100% of speakers sold.

and that's perhaps an important distinction for some.. .and having posters come in and add that to the mix is not forbidden... by anyone... you or line6.

lighten up... you've clearly been heard if you have execs calling you....

you really need to direct your focus towards the support team and anyone else at line6 that has provided you with contact information....

this is a community discussion forum... and the community is free to discuss... they are not simply free to agree with you or go away... as you seem to suggest.

 

TheRealZap,

 

Firstly I don't believe I have ever claimed that this issue impacts 100% of LIne6 speakers.  I have been careful to note that there is no way for me to know how extensive and far reaching this problem is.  Simply that it is much more widespread, louder, and more serious than the posts downplaying it have led some to believe.  With that said, Line6 does admit the problem is with the fan and it may or may not indeed turn out to be a problem in most if not all of their speakers depending on how often that part was used and what its problem rate turns out to be. Only time will tell, there is no way for me to accurately assess the extent of the problem.  Only Line6 (maybe?) knows for sure.

 

I am in no way trying to censor anyone, even if they are not "adding perspective" to the thread as you so euphemistically characterize their posts.  I fully endorse everyone's right to be on this topic, even if they choose to take pot shots at those of us who are down for the count.  This does not mean that I must refrain from making them aware that sitting back in the peanut gallery and sniping as if this is some kind of sport while other people are actually dealing with a really expensive and stressful problem has an extremely negative impact and causes real pain for real people.  Pain that I know is difficult to percieve sometimes when you are posting into cyberspace.  There is nothing wrong with encouraging them to spend time on topics where they do not cause others pain and potentially hinder legitimate efforts to get a problem resolved.  By your definition, are you not attempting to censor me right now?  The next time it could be their issue. 

 

As a "Line6 Expert" you should be encouraging the highest level of camaraderie and behavior on this forum.  This is an extremely sensitive topic.  To my knowledge Line6 has never produced as expensive a suite of products as this before.  This issue is unprecedented in scale and impact, it is not a minor issue involving a sticking switch on someone's foot pedal.  How are you helping to get this issue resolved?  You carry a lot of weight, and have made thousands of posts. Instead of trying to modify my behavior, why not use your prestige and credibility to help with a resolution for a worthy cause, one both the user base and Line6 desperately wish to solve quickly and put behind us!  We look to you and others with your experience to help make this difficult time a bit easier.  I agree with you, censorship is a terrible thing.

 

If the attacks upon the more vocal of us in this forum would stop for long enough, I would like to stop posting for now and give Line6 a bit more time to resolve this.  From what they are telling me the long wait for a fix may be close to a resolution.  I would remind everyone that we are not adversaries but fellow musicians and soundmen and fans of Line6 equipment who share the same concerns and can potentially suffer the same fallout from a defective product.  What goes around, comes around!


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#36 TheRealZap

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 02:47 PM

I am trying to encourage, people to get along nicely... the point of my posting at all was to say that not every post should be taken so personally.

I do alot more on these forums than are visible to the general public... including pursuing resolution for issues such as these with those who work for Line6.

The experts in many ways work as a filter for Line6 to help them better manage their resources internally (my perspective, not an official stance of Line6)

Anyway... many of us are aware of your issue and have discussed things with those that can help you...

they are diligently looking for a permanent and effective fix for speakers already produced and for future production.

unfortunately this takes some time... no point in slapping a band aid on it, they want a real, effective, and final fix.

this will make the ultimate resolution to your issue far more worthwhile... but will require patience unfortunately.

 

there is no one in this thread or on the forums in general that wants anything less than for your speakers to be fixed... keep that in mind.

some may have been slow to acknowledge the validity of your issue, because they do not have the issue....

now that it's officially acknowledged, i think we can forgive any misunderstandings and allow Line6 to pursue a resolution.

 

 

TheRealZap,

 

I am in no way trying to censor anyone, even if they are not "adding perspective" to the thread as you so euphemistically characterize their posts.  I fully endorse everyone's right to be on this topic, even if they choose to take pot shots at those of us who are down for the count.  This does not meant that I must refrain from making them aware that sitting back in the peanut gallery and sniping as if this is some kind of sport while other people are actually dealing with a really expensive and stressful problem has an extremely negative impact and causes real pain for real people.  Pain that I know is difficult to percieve sometimes when you are posting into cyberspace.  There is nothing wrong with encouraging them to spend time on topics where they do not cause other's pain and potentially hinder legitimate efforts to get a problem resolved.  By your definition, are you not attempting to censor me right now?  The next time it could be their issue. 

 

As a "Line6 Expert" you should be encouraging the highest level of camraderie and behavior on this forum.  This is an extremely sensitive topic.  To my knowledge Line6 has never produced as expensive a suite of products as this before.  This issue is unprecedented in scale and impact, it is not a minor issue involving a sticking switch on someone's foot pedal.  How are you helping to get this issue resolved?  You carry a lot of weight, and have made thousands of posts, instead of trying to modify my behavior, why not use your prestige and credibility to help with a resolution for a worthy cause, one both the user base and Line6 desparately wish to solve quickly and put behind us!  We look to you and others with your experience to help make this difficult time a bit easier.  I agree with you, censorship is a terrible thing.

 

If the attacks upon the more vocal of us in this forum would stop for long enough, I would like to stop posting for now and give Line6 a bit more time to resolve this.  From what they are telling me the long wait for a fix may be close to a resolution.  I would remind everyone that we are not adversaries but fellow musicians and soundmen and fans of Line6 equipment who share the same concerns and can potentially suffer the same fallout from a defective product.  What goes around, comes around!


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#37 Digital-sound

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:42 PM

Tudscamp - I have not wished bad on anyone, and in my other posts on this issue in another thread, I have stated my support towards finding a solution to the problem. Read the original thread. I was only stating in this thread that is is not an effective way to initiate an effective dialogue between line 6 and velok. The community support forum is for just that. Community support. We try to help each other with issues that we may have. It is a place to ask who else may have a similar problem. And then, a "customer" with a problem, would go to "customer support".

That is all I have said. And I wish no bad on others either. Even if my parents say it is ok! Can't be bothered. Easier and a better feeling to wish everyone well. Regardless what happens to me. I am a believer in karma. Ever since I started using digital gear, I think about a possible problem every gig. And wish those problems on no one, and feel for them when they happen.
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#38 SiWatts69

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 03:38 AM

It is almost impossible to not respond... Perhaps if everybody read entire posts rather than apparently honing in on individual sentences taken out of context then we'd all be able to get along better.

I have seen nobody deny that the problem you are experiencing exists in your speakers.
I have seen nobody suggest anything other than support for those that are experiencing the same or similar issue.
I have seen nobody wish you (and others affected by the same or similar) anything other than a speedy resolution from Line6.

Personally, I express and hold the opinion that your methodology is not the best way forward and may be counter-productive and that you are making assertions about *your* problem being identical to every other report of a rattle, buzz or vibration that anybody over the past 12 months or so might have experienced. That's my opinion, I'm entitled to it and I'm entitled to express it.

I get that you've got a problem. I get that it is causing you severe angst. I don't get why you feel the need to turn on anybody who expresses any opinion that doesn't perfectly align with yours.

Accusing any of us of being "rabid fanboys" is, to paraphrase your own comment, laughable. Likewise to suggest that we're all just out to brown-nose for freebies or get into the Line6 reps' favours. Perhaps that's how your mind works. I, however, simply enjoy spreading the word about how good I believe the system to be, how good it has been in usage, warts and all, and assisting fellow users with my experiences and practises in using it in combination with a whole host of gear from other suppliers.

So, just to re-iterate in-case these points have been lost in the post...
I don't deny you have a problem.
I give you my full support in gaining a speedy resolution to that problem from Line6
I give you my full sympathy for having been subjected to what is clearly having a deep impact on you.
I am relieved that, at this moment in time, I am unaffected by the same or similar problem to you and I cross my fingers that I remain so.

That's all. I don't need to enter into a willy waving competition (my dad's bigger than your dad so I win anyway ;-) )
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#39 cruisinon2

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 03:00 PM

l. I don't need to enter into a willy waving competition.


I'm writing that one down...lol
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#40 tudscamp

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 07:16 AM

Well, it has been a while since I posted.  UPDATE - The repairs made to my L2 seem to work.  BAD NEWS - The L3S is doing the same thing.  WORSE NEWS (get this) Line 6 is "Unaware of any issue with the Sub"  

I am SICK over this.

How the F*!# do you have a problem with the L2T/M, come to find out that it also happens with the L3T/M, and NOT BENCH TEST THE L3SUB.  Maybe I am the one with the problem understanding.  Would LOVE TO HEAR an explanation.  

Oh, and let me beat you to the punch - Here is a link to a .WAV file of the ratlle, in case you think it is my imagination.  

 

Guess I will have to wait a few months more for an actual admission from Line 6 that there is a problem, followed by a few more months turn around for a "FIX" to be found, followed by a 6 week turn around on the actual repair.....  

Oooh, Happy Anniversary to me....  By then the system will be a year old and NEVER BEEN USED....  YAY!!!!  NO WARRANTY LEFT for its maiden voyage.......


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Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: vibration rattle obnoxious, vibration noise, obnoxious rattle, vibration, rattl, l2t l2m, annoy, prominent, loud buzz

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