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Hurry Up, Already, Line 6!


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#21 jayson2

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 08:29 AM

Thanks for the info Phil. Hate having to wait for this upgrade but would prefer it's bug free when released. Would have been nice if they kept us more informed especially after the original announcement way back when.

Cheers,

jayson
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#22 ChristianArnold

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 10:16 AM

The project isn't scrapped. I can't share more details than that. But I can assure the HD update will be here, and I think that once people play the new models, they will be very happy with them.

Have you been playing them?! Timeframe? Help us!!!!! lol


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#23 phil_m

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 12:18 PM

Have you been playing them?! Timeframe? Help us!!!!! lol

 

I don't know the timeframe, but it is probably sooner than later... not that helps.

 

But as I said before, I can say in confidence that the HD models will impress people. You can read between the lines as to what that means... :)


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#24 Harold

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 03:52 PM

I think a lot of music companies are going the way of Behringer. Say there is an update coming but may take up to a year

Seems the way this up date is going. I think if your not going to have it in a decent amount of time don't mention it.

Just my thoughts


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#25 Kcharriq

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 06:26 PM

I hope they also fix the harmonic problems with alternate tunings at lower volumes.

It's a pain to have to play at higher volumes to get a good sound with alternate tunings.


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#26 TheRealZap

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 02:58 AM

there is no possible fix.. they'd have to stop your strings from vibrating... this will never happen... sorry.

 

I hope they also fix the harmonic problems with alternate tunings at lower volumes.

It's a pain to have to play at higher volumes to get a good sound with alternate tunings.


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#27 Kcharriq

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 04:07 AM

there is no possible fix.. they'd have to stop your strings from vibrating... this will never happen... sorry.

 

 

If that were the case none of the modeling would work, but it works fine without alt tunings.

 

As an example I should be able to alt tune down 1/2 step, then put a real capo on the first fret to be back to my original tunings.


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#28 silverhead

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 05:06 AM

If that were the case none of the modeling would work, but it works fine without alt tunings.

 

As an example I should be able to alt tune down 1/2 step, then put a real capo on the first fret to be back to my original tunings.

But then your strings would be tuned up a half step, because of the capo, and you would still hear their natural vibrations at low volume. Your modeled, alternately-tuned strings would be heard at standard-tuning pitch through whatever monitor/amp you use and the naturally vibrating strings would be producing the half-step-up pitches that you would hear.


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#29 TheRealZap

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 10:49 AM

If that were the case none of the modeling would work, but it works fine without alt tunings.

not sure how you came to that conclusion... the alt tunings take the individual strings as they are naturally vibrating and pitch shift them to the desired tuning....

if the desired tuning is already the natural vibration it skips the last part....

 

as an example I should be able to alt tune down 1/2 step, then put a real capo on the first fret to be back to my original tunings.

 

no... your strings vibrate as tuned... and the pitch shift does what you ask it....

so there will always be a difference between natural tuning and alt tuning...ALWAYS.

this is perceptible and apparently a big distraction for some users...

but that's just something we as users can either deal with, or not (as in a variax isn't for you)


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#30 clay-man

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 01:13 PM

not sure how you came to that conclusion... the alt tunings take the individual strings as they are naturally vibrating and pitch shift them to the desired tuning....

if the desired tuning is already the natural vibration it skips the last part....

 

 

no... your strings vibrate as tuned... and the pitch shift does what you ask it....

so there will always be a difference between natural tuning and alt tuning...ALWAYS.

this is perceptible and apparently a big distraction for some users...

but that's just something we as users can either deal with, or not (as in a variax isn't for you)

 

This. If you want real alternate tunings "on the fly", there's the Gibson robot tuners, but I personally think with the Variax's pitch shifter being a good quality pitch shifter, it's better than doing physical alt tunings, and there's a few reasons why I think this.

 

1) String tension remains the same at all times

2) It is instant, instead of waiting for robot tuners to tune your guitar

3) Tuning your physical strings like that too much will wear your strings out and will cause them to break faster

4) As the string tension remains the same, tuning down doesn't sound muddy an crappy. You can tune down 1 whole octave and it's still pretty good, a LITTLE bit muddy at 1 whole octave down, but it's still nice.

5) You can tune up 1 whole octave, which is impossible with real tunings since you'll break the strings and possibly warp your neck.

 

Even the V1 Variaxes have pretty high quality pitch shifters. The only downsides you have with any Variax guitars are

 

1) Slight latency, as all pitch shifters need some latency to read the pitch of the strings then tune it accordingly to what you set it to pitch to.

2) Not wearing headphones or not cranking your amp above your real string's volumes will give you an interfering harmony. It's not that bad, just up your volume until you can't hear it. Get a setup that's appropriate for you.


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#31 Kcharriq

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 06:18 PM

The main reason I bought the Variax was to get different modeled guitars.

I can tune it to different alternate tunings manually without getting the harmonics.

 

I think pointing out the downsides is important for people to realize that are playing in home environments. People are sending their guitars back because they think something is wrong.

 

I also have the Gibson Robot, which is very cool, but has it's own set of problems.


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#32 TheRealZap

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 07:28 PM

it is a downside... just not a defect.. can't fight the physics part.

certainly good to be aware of it.

 

The main reason I bought the Variax was to get different modeled guitars.

I can tune it to different alternate tunings manually without getting the harmonics.

 

I think pointing out the downsides is important for people to realize that are playing in home environments. People are sending their guitars back because they think something is wrong.

 

I also have the Gibson Robot, which is very cool, but has it's own set of problems.


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#33 clay-man

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 09:25 PM

I strongly recommend monitoring your guitar sound if you're not going to play your rig loud. 

Variax is either a studio thing or play it loud thing. 

Playing your amp really quiet isn't the best thing to do with it. If you're playing your amp so quiet that you can hear your guitar strings from your guitar over the amp, then you need to turn it up man. It shouldn't be that quiet.


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#34 Rewolf48

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 03:46 AM

Or at least use headphones


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#35 clay-man

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 12:19 PM

Or at least use headphones

 

That's what I[m saying by monitoring your amp.


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#36 LarryLion

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Posted 18 July 2013 - 11:50 AM

I'm hanging onto my JTV-69 SOLELY to try the new models in Ver 2.0.  After that I will decide whether I keep the JTV, or dump it, but right now, I will not use it at a gig.  The JTV-69, imo, contains great simulations, but is out of touch with the reality of gigging, particularly signal levels.  I know Line6 "designed by players for players" or words to that effect in their blurb, but the current JTV's appear to be guitars designed by engineers, with little or no input from gigging musicians.


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Plus lots of Tele's, Gretsches,

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#37 phil_m

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Posted 18 July 2013 - 12:11 PM

The JTV-69, imo, contains great simulations, but is out of touch with the reality of gigging, particularly signal levels.

 

What issues with signal levels you're having? I've used my 69 for probably an of average 3 or 4 shows a month since I got it last August, and I've never had any issues. I also take it nearly every rehearsal. I know there are plenty of other guys gigging with JTVs here as well. Not meaning to argue with you, but I'm genuinely curious as to what issue you're having.


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#38 thorneven

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Posted 18 July 2013 - 07:55 PM

Phil - My biggest issue is that I've had to create an entire new bank of 12 presets (whose volumes are significantly louder than those I use with the magnetic pickups) just for using JTV59 guitar models.  Even with the piezo volumes at max levels, they are not as loud as with the magnetic pickups.  I don't want to lower physically the mag pickups because then I lose that gritty sound I like with the screws as close to the strings as possible.  Sorry to steal the thread, but I agree that gigging with the models has created performance issues I wish I didn't have.


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#39 clay-man

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 01:43 AM

Phil - My biggest issue is that I've had to create an entire new bank of 12 presets (whose volumes are significantly louder than those I use with the magnetic pickups) just for using JTV59 guitar models.  Even with the piezo volumes at max levels, they are not as loud as with the magnetic pickups.  I don't want to lower physically the mag pickups because then I lose that gritty sound I like with the screws as close to the strings as possible.  Sorry to steal the thread, but I agree that gigging with the models has created performance issues I wish I didn't have.

 

If you're altering the mags to be closer to be loader, you will need to adjust your presets accordingly as well.

That grittiness you're getting is possibly signal clipping. You can drive the models to clip as well by boosting the levels in the presets.

 

There's no other way to do this by that. I mean, pretend that each preset is each pickup on your guitar. You don't just raise 1 pickup, but you raise them all.

 

I personally don't like that as I want a pure clean tone out of my guitar. I let any of the distortion come from the amp or effect, not the dry signal itself.


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#40 chuskey

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 04:25 AM

What issues with signal levels you're having? I've used my 69 for probably an of average 3 or 4 shows a month since I got it last August, and I've never had any issues. I also take it nearly every rehearsal. I know there are plenty of other guys gigging with JTVs here as well. Not meaning to argue with you, but I'm genuinely curious as to what issue you're having.

Same here.  I haven't carried another guitar, electric or acoustic, to a gig or band rehearsal since I got my JTV 59.  Not to mention recording sessions.

 

It's not perfect, nothing is, but it works great in a ton of situations and there's not another one instrument that is nearly as versatile.  

 

It's perfectly reasonable to assume that the JTV won't work for everyone out there, but to say that it's not gig worthy just isn't accurate.  

 

Oh how I wish this guitar had been around 10 years ago when I was playing 4 nights a week in a band that capoed nearly every song.  The reality of gigging then was I carried way too many guitars, way too many pedals, and amps and cabs that weighed way too much.  The reality of gigging now is my JTV 59 gig bag on one shoulder and my HD500 bag on the other!  One trip and done :)


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