Concise Setup/Scene description?

[Rick_Auricchio]

Is this correct? Took me several readings of the manual, watching the video, reading other posts, and several experiments.

 

A SETUP contains the hardware config of the mixer, for each input and output channel. I/O connector assignment, trim, DSP preset chosen, monitor sends, FX sends, mute/solo, pan, level. (Not all of these apply to outputs.) Also the stage appearance (i.e. curtain etc.)

 

A SCENE contains (for each input and output):  stage icon, monitor sends, FX sends, FX parameters, mute/solo, pan, level, and all the Tweak settings applied to the existing DSP preset.

 

A question: Is all that stuff really saved in the Setup, or is it actually contained in the first default scene that's automatically created when you save a Setup? This would seem to make more sense; at least it does to me.

 

So if one changes a DSP preset to, for example, get a different canned EQ curve, this constitutes a change of DSP preset. So it will be saved in the setup, not in a scene.

 

It took a bit of experimentation to arrive at the above conclusion. I wanted two situations: one with flat EQ on main output, the other set for a boomy room. If I chose the Boomy Room preset for the output, that wasn't saving in the Scene, but it was in the Setup.

 

Then I figured out that if I manually tweaked a flat EQ to match that in the Boomy Room preset---without ever selecting that preset---that saved in the Scene.

 

I realize this stuff has been stated several ways in the past, but it's going to confuse people. I'm not dumb: I've been a career software developer, owned a studio, used digital mixers, and it still was really difficult to get my head around this. Luckily I've been experimenting with the M20d for a few weeks---before ever trying it out with my band!

[SiWatts69]

Here's my "take" on it...

 

A setup is a stage/gig setuip. Channel assignments, eq within channel, DSP etc. I can save a setup and if we return to a venue and were happy with the sound last time we played, I can load that venue's setup (assuming I saved it) and, with the exception of master outputand monitor output levels I have everything as it was. I then set those main output levels (FOH & Monitor) and we're good to go.

 

A scene is something entirely different. A scene is something that occurs within a show. It could be that a particular song needs more reverb on a vocal, or some chorus on a guitar channel, muting an open mic that won't be used, level boost on a particular channel etc. Switching between scenes gives instant recall without affecting anything else and takes no time so can be done as you are progressing through a set.

 

Loading a setup takes roughly 4-5 seconds and will require the master outputs and any monitor outputs to be set again. The setup stores everything as it was at the point of save APART from those output levels.

 

Loading a scene is instantaneous.

 

Scenes belong to a setup, but will only be saved as part of an existing setup if you resave the setup AFTER saving the scene.

 

Personally, I've never bothered with scenes. There's enough going off trying to remember everything else without remembering to load a scene part way through a set and then remembering to reload the original scene after the end of that song!

[Rick_Auricchio]

I agree. I may not bother with scenes either; right now, I have one scene per setup. Besides, with only 32 scenes per setup, you really can't consider a separate scene per song---that's not enough for most gigs. One answer would be to categorize scenes: e.g. ballad, rocker, more reverb here or there, etc. That's way more mental trouble than it's worth when I'm busy playing and singing.

 

At the most, I can see having four scenes with different vocal presets, since all four of us in the band sing lead at times. The first, with me as Lead Vocal and the other mikes with EQ/Comp optimized for backup vocals. Another for my keyboardist, third for guitarist singing lead, fourth for the drummer. This doesn't take much brainpower to flip among the four scenes. (As long as I never screw up!)

 

(I do understand that changing Setups mutes all outputs for a second or two.)

 

For me, understanding the architecture of a system---how things work---is so important. If I can think in the abstract about a system, I can easily understand the operational details. I'm never been comfortable doing something by rote, like "just save the scene and the setup blindly whenever you make a change." Sure, that works, but I don't learn or understand what I'm doing.

[Digital-sound]

I learned something that may be of interest, or that you may want to tear as well. I find my scenes don't save properly unless I also resave the set up as well. If I load a set up (i play in a couple bands and mix sound for a coupe orhers, so my setups consist of different bands) and then load a scene (scenes consist of different venues for each band/setup), and then make changes to the scenes, they don't save properly unless I save the setup as well. So scene change, SAVE, then to the setups page, and SAVE again. Then I have no problems. As well, watch the effects to monitors. If you set everything up, and then power down and back on, and don't relaod the setup or scene you want, you will likely see some effects applied to your monitors.

 

Just some tips that seemed relevant to this discussion. Hopefully all resolved with a new update. Line 6 is aware of these small, and minor bugs. But they really are "bugs", cause they "bug" me!

[Rick_Auricchio]

"So scene change, SAVE, then to the setups page, and SAVE again. Then I have no problems."

 

Yup, I do that by rote. I don't like doing things by rote, but that seemed to be the procedure based on what I'd read elsewhere.

 

"If you set everything up, and then power down and back on, and don't relaod the setup or scene you want, you will likely see some effects applied to your monitors."

 

Another rote thing. I hadn't been doing that while experimenting, but now I'll check it. We may have a chance to swap to the StageScape after Sunday afternoon's gig, just to run a few songs to prove out my settings. But we have a tech-rehearsal set for Friday to do all of this anyway.