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Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-20 17:07:52

I just purchased a Spider Valve 212 MKI new from ebay, I think that the store was on the east coast while I'm on the west coast. While I was playing today at a low volume (volume at 1, maybe 1.5) and after a few minutes the sound would start cutting out and back again. Could this be caused by a bad tube or something, my amp did have to ship across the country so it could have been treated pretty poorly during it's travels.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-20 17:17:58

Also when the sound cuts out, the LED's turn off...



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by mtrash14 on 2010-03-20 17:46:39

First, welcome to the forum.   And I'm glad you are an SV owner.  There is a lot of info here (if you search for it that is) that will help you learn much about your new amp.   Now back to your question.

To make the sound cut out and the LED's turn off the amp must loose power through its Power Transformer.  As long as the power transformer is getting power those LED's and the amp should be working.  For it to loose sound and the LED's at the same time makes me wonder if there isn't something wrong with your receptacle in your home.  Let me explain.

If a tube were to be loose and amp lost sound - then that should have no bearing on weather the DSP is getting power or not so the LED's should still be lit.  If the Power Transformer were bad then it would probably just quit on some such voltage instead of giving intermittent power (again, I'm guessing here) so I can not see that being the problem.

If the power were cut to the power transformer then I can see how the sound and the LED's would go out at the same time.  My best bet here is to check the house receptacle and make certain the amp is getting power all the time.  This can be done by using a simple power strip and plugging in something else like a small lamp.  If the sound cuts out and the lamp goes out at the same time then you would know the power is not getting to the amp.  If the sound cuts out and the lamp is still buring then this problem must be in the amp only.

Again, if the power is getting to the amp and it is still cutting out (and the LED's are going out too), and you bought it off of fleabay, then I'd say you need to take your sales receipt and your amp to an authorized L6 service center near you and have it repaired. And pray the repairs will be covered by your warranty.  I can not for certain tell you your warranty will be good since I do not know more than I do at this point about how-when-where your amp came from and if the person you bought it from is a dealer or not.  I do think that will matter in the end.

Best of luck and do come back and read all you can because I know it will help you!!!!!

Later

M^T



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-20 18:22:28

Thanks for the reply, I will try plugging a lamp or something into the power strip to see what the deal is. The one thing that is strange is that it doesn't do this right away, it takes about 5 minutes of playing before it starts cutting out.

fleabay? Was that a typo? It was purchased from a dealer so I would hope that the warrenty would be good to go.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by mtrash14 on 2010-03-20 18:32:43

dwntwn wrote:

fleabay? Was that a typo?

No typo....

Just some of my own past experiences. 

Good luck man

M^T



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-20 18:57:25

Ok so I tried it on a different outlet in a different room directly into the wall (no power strip) and it does the same thing. One thing that I need to mention is that not all the LED's go out, the main power lamp (big blue one) and the LCD display stay on, it's only the LED's on the amp model selection, channel ABCD, and the effects.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by mtrash14 on 2010-03-21 05:09:29

The big blue light is controlled by the Power Switch and when lit indicates power is now allowed to flow into the power transformer.  All the other lights/LCD/LED's/etc are controlled by the DSP (digital signal processor) board.  Although the DSP board does get its basic power from the Power Transformer all of its functions/lights/etc are fully controlled by and from its board, which is non servicable (at least IMO).

I think you now need to determine if these lights are actually cutting out (loosing power somehow) or this is simply a result of the amp changing channels/models/etc while you are playing.   A fault in the DSP that doesn't effect it's LCD screen makes me believe its not a fault but a result of the amp changing channels/etc.  A faulty tube should not have any effect on the LED's.  With a faulty tube the front of the amp should remain lit as it was before and after loosing sound.

I suggest you try "parking the knobs".  To do this correctly you want to have your tone saved in a preset and be able to select that preset with one of the channel buttons (A,B,C,D).  Turn all the DSP's controlled knobs down to their lowest point then select your preset using a channel button only.  The only knobs that are not controlled by the DSP processor is the master volume and the presence control.  By parking the knobs you should be able to verify if the amp is changing channels/models/etc or has been actually loosing power because of some internal fault with the DSP board (what those leds are connected to).  By setting all the knobs to "0" one direction is stopped (in movement) and hopefully this will help limit movement in the other.

The way the DSP works is it will use the stored value(s) instead of the value of the actual pot(s) until that pot is turned.  If, for instance, the amp models knob were to move because of vibration ever so slightly the DSP would automatically adjust all of its settings to correspond to that seemingly user input request.  This could make for some weird tone/volume/etc changes for sure.  I'd also say some LED's may even flash at this point and you might even loose sound for a second.

If you find this trouble is not fixed by parking the knobs then you will need to take your amp to an authorized L6 service center for repairs.  The problem would be inside the amp, and probably within the DSP board itself, and that is not user serviceable in any way.

If the problem should turn out to be with a tube then with the fact there are few (if any) actual tube testers around these days tubes are tested by replacing them with a known good tube.  If a tube is found to be defective it is then replaced.  But again, I can't see how a defective tube cutting in and out the sound will effect the LED's on the front of the amp.   To do that (in my mind) that bad tube would need to be drawing some serious current from the transformer which would probably just blow a fuse on the first instance.  The sound would cut out and never cut back on.  Even then I say the LED's would be uneffected.

Also, if you are using a floorboard you need to discontinue it while testing the amp.  Problems with them can do this also.

Hopefully your amp is covered by L6 warranty so again I suggest you just take the amp to a L6 service center for repairs/checkout.

Good luck

M^T



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-21 07:58:51

Thanks again for the explainations and suggestions.

Another observation is that one the amp goes into the cutting out mode, it will just keep cutting in and out every few seconds even when I'm not playing so I don't think that it is caused from the knobs being moved from vibtrations. I am using the FBV shortboard and I did try unplugging it when the amp started cutting out and it did not help. It looks like I'm going to have to take it to a dealer and have them look at it.

To me the problem seems like it happens only when the gets hot because if I turn it off for a while the problem goes away until I have been playing for 10 minutes or so.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-21 10:58:59

Here is a short video of the amp cutting off and on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsCTnP9PD2s



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by mtrash14 on 2010-03-21 16:02:21

Tks for posting the vid.

I've seen this before and I have always believed its a voltage regulator on the DSP board causing the overheat surge, but that is irrelevant.  A DSP board replacement (IMO) is now necessary and should fix it properly.  Only an authorized L6 service center can get the necessary parts and install them for you (these parts are not available to anyone else from L6, only their authorized repair centers).  So you need to find the nearest L6 service center (dealer/shop) near you and make arrangements with them to bring in your amp for repairs.  This will be an easy fix for them. I guarantee.

Again I sincerely hope your warranty is good because if it is you have 1 year from date of purchase and L6 will fix this for free.

If the warranty is not honored (because you got the amp off fleabay) then it'll be on you.  Sorry, but there is no other fix for this problem other than the service center route.

Best of luck man

M^T



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-21 16:21:09

Thanks, hopefully I don't get screwed by theguitarfactory.com. They place I bought it from is in NY and I'm in CA so it's just as about as far across the county as possible.

I love the sound of the amp, of course before it starts cutting in and out.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by mtrash14 on 2010-03-21 16:28:55

There is a bright side!!!!!

I've always wondered how much a DSP board replacement would cost me if I were to ever need one, so if you wind up paying for this one - let me know how much $$ it cost - then I'll know for sure.

Seriously man,  I hope you the best of luck

M^T



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-21 16:36:30

LOL!!! I'll let you know if and when I find out, hopefully it doesn't cost me a dime.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by mtrash14 on 2010-03-21 16:41:52

+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-22 18:23:40

Well I talked to the place where I bought the amp and it is going to be covered under warranty, they just have to send me the official invoice so that I can take it to my local line 6 dealer.



RE: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by Kneehow on 2010-03-23 11:47:07

Hi,

Just to make sure you're on the right track, definitely get a copy of your new product purchase receipt/invoice: warranty repairs require this (for warranty payment claims).

You should take a copy of that receipt and your amp to the nearest Authorized Line 6 Service Center in your area (not the same thing as a "dealer" as dealers sell our gear, not always fix them): http://line6.com/support/serviceCenters/

Regards,

L6Perry



Re: RE: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-03-23 17:11:59

Thanks, yes the place that I bought my amp from gave me the information on the nearest place to take my amp for the service.



Re: RE: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by boogeman on 2010-04-21 15:26:39

How are you doing ? I am have the same problem with not one but two of these amps and they are not under warranty anymore . So I am trying to find out how much this will cost to fix . Do you have any idea the approximate amount ? The more I look into this problem the more common I am finding this happening . this has to be on Line 6's radar . What are they doing about this ? Thanks for the post I have learned a lot from this post .



Re: RE: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-04-21 20:03:28

Actually I just dropped it off today so I should know in a day or two what is wrong with it. I had to wait 20 days to get an appointment with a certified Line6 service center...



Re: RE: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by boogeman on 2010-04-21 20:23:28

Cool could you keep me posted ? So I can tell the service center where I will take mine what to look for . I would appreciate it . Thanks !!!



Re: RE: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-04-27 18:08:20

I called the service center that is working on my amp and they said that they are going to replace the main board under warranty, when I pick it up I will ask how much it would have cost if I was out of warranty. Hopefully I'll pick it up by the end of the week.



RE: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by AndyParedes on 2010-04-28 08:35:12

Glad to hear that you were able to get your unit to a service center. Please let us know if you run into any other issues.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by dwntwn on 2010-05-04 17:11:20

I just got my amp back, they ended up replacing the main board and they told me that the run between $150.00 and $200.00 and they charge $75 / hr for labor, luckily everything was covered under warranty. Now I have to test it out to make sure that it is fixed.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by evolDiesel on 2010-09-19 11:44:46

Just want to reconfirm...

Problem: Malfunctioning DSP Board

Solution: Replace malfunctioning DSP Board

Cost: $209 (parts and labor)

Who: Authorized Line 6 repair center

Time: About a week



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by evolDiesel on 2010-09-23 16:08:17

Dropping this in the thread...

To clarify further...


The old PCBA
PN#: 35-00-0250-2
Rev: A
Date MFG: Jun 8 2007

...was replaced with the latest PCBA
PN#50-02-9251

I attached an image of the assembly.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by sparrell on 2010-10-06 12:40:17

I've had this problem and my local tech was able to fix it without replacing the DSP. Rather than replace it, he tried a heat sink on the overheating part. It's been about three months and I havn't had the problem since (It used to happen every time I played). It's worth trying out if you're out of warrenty like i was.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by alcoholfueled-vii on 2010-10-14 10:59:59

Sparrell,

Would you mind sharing which part was the overheating part and what type of heat sink was installed?  I'm having the same problem with my amp but it is no longer under warranty.

Thanks



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by LoonyBin-Fizzbin on 2010-10-15 07:11:36

And the conditions for it to overheat?

Minutes?

Hours?

Hot climate?

Full tilt?

And so on.....



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by sparrell on 2010-10-16 07:55:08

The amp started cutting out after about half an hour. Average temperature was about 15degC but it didn't seem to have an effect. It would happen while jamming... so lots of use with little breaking.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by RazorsEdge on 2011-08-06 15:41:56

I have the orginal 212 spider valve and I have the same exact problem happening. The amp is no longer under warranty so I will have to pay to get it fixed. I would think that Line 6 knowing this is a real problem that they would recall these or at least fix them for free. I have not been gigging with this amp I use it for practice and recording. It has never been out of the house. I would expect better than this from Line 6. Oh well live and learn.



Re: Spider Valve 212 MKI power cuts in and out (sound basically turns off and then back on again)
by jonberrier on 2011-10-26 07:32:07

The big problem with most of these amps (including the spider III) is in the DSP board.  They have 2 (or 3) voltage regulators in TO-220 pkg on the board that normally get weak solder joints.  When the regulators heat up the solder gets soft and and the power cuts in and out.  I've fixed several of these amps by simply resoldering the regulators to the board and adding a little extra solder.  Don't by any means try this if you are not comfortable soldering to PC boards or if you amp is under warranty.  




The information above may not be current, and you should direct questions to the current forum or review the manual.