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Relay G30 drop out problem
by insideout on 2010-08-05 09:57:43

I've used my new G30 a couple times now.  Once at band practice and once at home.  Both times I was within 10 feet direct line of sight and experienced dropouts.  Will trying different channels make any difference?  Just wondering if this is a common thing (not much came up with a search).  But for a live gig (like tomorrow night) it's unacceptable.  Any suggestions or advice?



RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by Line6Hugo on 2010-08-06 11:29:37

insideout,

When experiencing interference or dropouts, the different channels are there to switch to in case this happens. So, if there is a problem on channel 1, change to channel 2, 3, etc...

Also, make sure to test in different locations as some locations are more prone to interference than others. It should be expected that some locations may have interference, so the different channels must be tested before thinking that something is wrong with the unit.

Regards,

Line6Hugo



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by insideout on 2010-08-06 14:32:12

Thanks for the reply.  I changed channel and have played about 2 hours here at home without a dropout.  Keeping my fingers crossed for tonights gig.  I did notice on channel 1, one of the 3 signal lights was flashing occasionally.  On channel 2 all 3 lights are constant green so that's a good thing.  I'll just have to remember to check the lights every time I play someplace different and make sure I have all solid green.



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dboomer on 2010-08-06 16:50:03

You can check to see if there is any stray RF by turning on the receiver and looking to see if the strenght lights go red.  By changing channels you can see which has the least interference.  It usually doesnt matter if there is interference because Relay systems don't care anyway ... but it never hurts.  If you are getting any green LEDs on while playing then you are not getting a "dropout"

When you experienced the problem were you using the factory supplied wall wart?

Are you wearing the transmitter on your strap or in your pocket?



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by insideout on 2010-08-07 07:30:57

Well, at this point, I'm not sure why I was getting those dropouts.  Maybe I'm not using the right term to describe it.  While playing, for a fraction of a second it goes dead silent.  I thought that would be considered a dropout. 

But last night we played a 4 hour gig, and the lights stayed solid green on channel 2, and I didn't have a single issue.  Whew!.  For your questions, yes I'm using the supplied wall wart and it's plugged into a Furman rack power conditioner.  The receiver sit's on top of the rack case.  Transmitter is always on guitar strap, not in pocket.



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dboomer on 2010-08-10 09:06:29

A "dropout" is technically when the radio stops ... but it may not be the cause of the audio signal cutting out.

Is your rack case metal by any chance?  The receiver does not like to sit directly over metal ... tends to bounce the incoming RF in strange ways.



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by Hipguitar on 2010-08-15 11:56:03

I just purchased g30 and used for the first time. I experienced audio or signal losses repeatedly, 3x changing channels during show. I finally changed over to cable. Soundcheck was fine. Unfortunately I decided to use the unit for the first time at a concert with 8500 attendance (not good)! So I have the unit placed in pedal board right next to a Vox metal casing FX unit. I wonder if that could be the issue. I was seeing 3 green lights the entire time I was having these dropouts.



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dboomer on 2010-08-15 18:10:57

If you are seeing 3 green LEDs then you do not have a radio dropout ... you have an audio problem and that could be anywhere in the system.  It's most likely because you've changed your pedalboard wiring to accommodate the G30.



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by akd835 on 2011-07-03 08:26:44

I too am experiencing very short dropouts of audio using my G30 but experience zero drops when using a cable.

I am using the supplied power supply and fresh batteries each time.

I wear the transmitter on my guitar strap which puts it on my back.

The reciever is in front of me on my pedal board but I'm using the supplied power adapter not power from the board.

I have tried all the channels without any improvement.

The drops are random and I am unable to re-create them at will but suspect movement while I play could be causing the problem because if I'm a statue it seems to happen less frequently....of course that defeats the purpose of having a wireless system if I can't move.

I wonder if the G50 would overcome these issues, or if I need to relocate the transmitter?

Nothing has improved the situation so far.



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dboomer on 2011-07-03 11:07:28

So if you don't move then there are no drops?  When you hear a drop do the LEDs go off or drop down?

Try setting the guitar stationary on a table and see if the problem goes away.  You may not have  RF dropouts but have a bad cable or jacks on the transmitter or on your guitar.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by Titus115 on 2011-07-18 13:33:04

I had the same issue with a G50.  I took my smartphone out of my pocket and made sure no one else had one near me and the issue seemed to go away.  Smartphones communicate on the same wi-fi 2.4 ghz band.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dbun on 2011-07-21 17:59:24

You shouldn't have to do this though.

The Relay wireless should not be affected by 2.4 ghz activity from other devices. As far as I'm aware, it will just reduce the range of the wireless and shouldn't cause dropouts, unless the interference is severe.

Ensuring that you and others around you don't have a smartphone is not a practical solution for a wireless system. Wireless systems are used so you have freedom to move around. You shouldn't have to worry about whether or not your audience may have smartphones as it will cause your wireless to drop out.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by DanCornett on 2011-07-21 18:31:38

... but phones *can* cause audio interference either before the signal is transmitted or after it is received.  They don't generally cause dropouts, but they certainly can cause noise, crackles, pops, etc.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dbun on 2011-07-21 18:57:17

very true

I keep my phone away from my amp and pedal board at gigs for this reason, but not because I'm concerned it will affect my Relay wireless.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by Titus115 on 2011-07-21 20:54:06

Just "relaying" my experience.  Losing mine soon anyway as I am changing venue ad it belongs to the venue.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dboomer on 2011-07-22 09:41:37

It is "affected"  by other interference. All radios are affected by all other radio transmitters, no matter what the frequency.  Interference can result in loss of overall range.  What doesn't happen with Line 6  is that interference never becomes an audio artifact causing noise or static.

Cell phones do not operate in the 2.4G range (unless you are using a wi-fi connection).  Most operate at 1.8 to 1.9 Ghz (in the USA).  Now if you are operating a phone very close to a Relay receiver AND you are operating an IEM transmitter with it's antennas pointed at a Line 6 receiver (and you are "relatively" close) those signals can mix and sum to 2.4Ghz (1.8 Ghz + 600 MHz = 2.4 GHz).  This is known as "heterodyning" in the radio world.

You can also impact range if you have any unintended  transmitter too close to any receiver ... even if they are not in the same band.  The frequency a radio is tuned to is not a single frequency but should be thought of as the tip of a pyramid.  It will receive signal that is "out of band" IF they are strong enough and close enough.  For example, don't hold your wireless mic and your cell phone in the same hand at the same time .  With a Line 6 wireless it could cause it to mute, with anyone else you could get loud rude noises in the sound system (I'm sure you've all experienced your cell phone getting into your computer speakers).



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by tjgirt on 2011-08-18 09:07:11

I am having the same problem with mine. At first I thought it was operator error "me" but nothing I do seems to fix it. I have tried every channel with no luck. It only happens once maybe twice a show, but that get annoying fast. Do you have any other suggestions. I am using it for my bass guitar and transmits awesome tone, but the "drop outs" are killing me. Its about 2 months old. Should i send it back?



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dbun on 2011-08-18 16:28:28

tjgirt wrote:

Should i send it back?

Yes....send it back for an exchange.

This issue should really be investigated further by Line 6 IMO.

My G30 has the exact same problem too, the audio would cut out for a split second every now and then. Nothing I tried would fix it. It would only do it in one venue though where there is lots of wireless activity going on at the same time (wireless mics, in ear monitors etc).

The new G50 I ordered is 100% fine. No issues at all, however, I've heard of other people having the same audio loss issue with G50 units.

There really is an underlying problem that is causing these audio dropouts, as this issue seems to come up fairly often on these forums. I know that compared to the number of Relay units working worldwide it's not a common issue numbers wise, but the fact that this audio loss issue is mentioned so often on these forums shouldn't be ignored.

The fact that my G50 works fine and the G30 doesn't means that it's not a location/environment issue, or an issue with my setup. There really is something wrong with the G30 unit I have.

I'm glad that my G50 turned out to be okay as the Relay units are fantastic IMO. They are so easy to use and the receiver is so easy to incorporate onto a pedal board.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by Titus115 on 2011-08-19 08:02:54

IN my experience strong WIFI signals will cause drop outs.  It became somewhat of a joke to me.  I would suddenly get a drop out when someone walked past me.  I would then ask "do you have an Iphone in your pocket?" the answer was always yes.  IF all smartphones are in airplane mode you should see a drastic improvement in your signal.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dbun on 2011-08-19 18:42:06

I dare say that you have a defective unit.

Although my G30 was problematic in certain conditions, it never dropped out due to WiFi interference. I could play in the same room as my access point, laptop and iPhone all connected via WiFi without a single issue.

The same goes for my G50.

The church I play at has Enterprise WiFi access points all around it and there is no issue at all with my Relay units. I also play with my iPhone in my pocket and all the band have iPhones or other smartphones too on stage.

I believe the issue with my G30 is to do with the high powered in-ear monitor packs we use. When they are not in use my G30 is fine. As soon as the singers power on and come on stage I start experience random audio loss.

If the Relay units were susceptible to WiFi interference they would be next to useless. There is WiFi everywhere these days, which would make it very hard to use.

It seems that some Relay units don't hold up as well under 'pressure' compared to other Relay units. I'm not sure what the reason for this is, but there definitely seems to be an issue with certain units causing loss of audio.

Maybe Line 6 should get a hold of some of these units for testing and troubleshooting??



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by tadium54 on 2012-02-11 06:15:08

I recently changed from the supplied cable to a 90 degree connection on both sides, with a total cable length of 1 foot and have had no problems. try changing the connection cable to something like that.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by cactus200968 on 2012-10-02 05:44:48

Use rechargeable battery. Personally I use Duracell 2450mAh and no drop out at full distance. Other battery's may not have the power needed so may drop out. Hope this helps from cactus in oz.



Re: Relay G30 drop out problem
by markcockerill on 2012-12-23 04:07:56

Despite the reviews of some folks having problems with the G30, I bought one last week and used it for the first time on Friday night at a gig. All I can report is that it worked flawlessly and certainly delivered no loss of tone or signal whatsoever. Very impressed with that aspect of the system. I do share concerns over the battery cover which may not last the remainder of my gigging days.



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by edoates on 2013-02-25 16:58:20

I have a similar problem, but it seems more related to guitar pickup output! Two guitars (a Gibson Les Paul and a Gibson Johnny A) have the same behavior; all is going along swimimgly, then I switch to the bridge pick up and hit a double stop or a chord hard. Bang- cutout. I'll bet it's digital clipping based in input signal strength and frequency.

When I use an AKG SR40 and GB40 system, I have to turn the "gain" adjustment to it's lowest position to avoid having the red "overload" light come on too often. Since the Relay G30 has no such attenuator / gain adjustment, there is not way reduce the pickup output other than playing softer or rolling the volume knobs back. Both affect tone unacceptably.

So, Line6Hugo, is digital overload a possibility here?



Re: RE: Relay G30 drop out problem
by dboomer on 2013-02-25 17:39:24

"Digital" clipping is not possible.  There is a hard analog limiter that will not allow the A-D converter to be overdriven.  Of course actually hitting this limiter probably doesn't sound great

There is no pad switch in Line 6 wireless because you are effectively getting both wide open and fully padded operation at the same time.  With our wide dynamic range you do not have to match the input levels to stay out of trouble.  The input can fully handle signals of 6 vac p-p.  I wouldn't expect a pickup to be able to come anywhere near that.  It could be an issue if you were using an onboard active preamp that used a pair of 9v batteries.  Generally speaking an active preamp can output about half of its battery voltage ... but you'd still have to bang the snot out of it.




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