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DT25 vs DT50, combo vs head/cab, 1 vs 2 speakers etc?
by chrishd400 on 2011-12-04 14:27:54

Hi,

I am thinking of investing in some flavour of DT25 or DT50 to go with my new HD400.  I play in a covers band, usually playing venues that hold 100-200  - and am looking for the versatily that this set up seems to offer.   But which amp?  Combo or head/cab? Add extra cab?   I will try this all out for myself soon, but would value this communities' advice first.

The other discussions here have been very informative ("Is DT25 loud enough";  "DT25 1x12 vs DT50 1x12" and "what's the big difference Dt50 112 vs 212)".   I have a better understanding now of the 25w vs 50w differences in "volume" (minimal, it seems) and the "headroom" that the larger wattage gives (which, if I've understood correctly, means you can go louder with clean tones before they start to distort).

Would be interested to hear more about the difference that additional speakers/cabinets make though.  So, for example, how would a DT25 1x12 combo plus additional 1x12 cab compare with a DT50 1x12 combo, in terms of "loudness" and "headroom"?    (Also, would the combo plus cab option in conjunction with the HD4000 offer the possibility of creating some stereo effects?  This is less of a priority but adds to the picture...)

Thanks in anticipation...



Re: DT25 vs DT50, combo vs head/cab, 1 vs 2 speakers etc?
by ChristophK on 2011-12-05 01:05:44

Welcome to the forum!

I play the DT25 Combo and it surely is loud enough for the stage. When we play classic Rock for around 100 guests, we usually use only our backline (small PA for vocals and kick drum, everything else with it's own amp). When it's a bigger venue we have a decent PA and FOH guy and then I want to have an even lower stage volume because the DT amp goes to the PA via it's DI out. So I don't see any need for 50W as long as you are not going to duel Rammstein.

Whether you use the head or the combo is a matter of flexibility: The combo is small, handy and has an open back cab. The specific cab for the DT25 head is closed back. Of course you can add the additional cab to the combo and I have heard very favourable comments about this open back / closed back combination.

Even if you add additional cabs to a DT head or combo, the amp stays mono. If you want to go stereo, you would need a second DT amp. This is actually supported very cleverly by Line 6: You would just have to chain the second amp with a second L6 link cable and change the settings in the HD for a stereo setup.



Re: DT25 vs DT50, combo vs head/cab, 1 vs 2 speakers etc?
by Nick_Mattocks on 2011-12-05 08:51:37

chrishd400 wrote:

Hi,

I am thinking of investing in some flavour of DT25 or DT50 to go with my new HD400.  I play in a covers band, usually playing venues that hold 100-200  - and am looking for the versatily that this set up seems to offer.   But which amp?  Combo or head/cab? Add extra cab?   I will try this all out for myself soon, but would value this communities' advice first.

The other discussions here have been very informative ("Is DT25 loud enough";  "DT25 1x12 vs DT50 1x12" and "what's the big difference Dt50 112 vs 212)".   I have a better understanding now of the 25w vs 50w differences in "volume" (minimal, it seems) and the "headroom" that the larger wattage gives (which, if I've understood correctly, means you can go louder with clean tones before they start to distort).

Would be interested to hear more about the difference that additional speakers/cabinets make though.  So, for example, how would a DT25 1x12 combo plus additional 1x12 cab compare with a DT50 1x12 combo, in terms of "loudness" and "headroom"?    (Also, would the combo plus cab option in conjunction with the HD4000 offer the possibility of creating some stereo effects?  This is less of a priority but adds to the picture...)

Thanks in anticipation...

Hi

I have a DT-50 212 combo and a DT-25 head + DT-25 1x12 extension cab.

The DT-50 is capable of being very loud and is ideal in my opinion for bigger venues where you are mainly relying on your back-line sound to be heard.  The DT-50 112 combo uses the same exact amp as the 112 combo, but where the 112 combo is fitted with a single 12" Celestion G12H90, the 212 has one G12H90 and a Celestion Vintage 30 in partnership which gives it a different tonal quality to the 112 as well as a greater 'spread' in terms of overall sound.

I wouldn't call the difference in volume between the DT-50 212 and DT-25 head + 1x12 cab minimal exactly but the DT-25 certainly seems to punch above its weight

At home where I have neighbours, the DT-50 is a bit of a beast to try and control so I sometimes use it with a Marshall SE100 Speaker Emulator/Attenuator that I've had for years to tame its output by up to 18dB

I bought the DT-25 head and cab earlier this year to a) save my back a little wear and tear ; b) because the DT-25 is a little more manageable in terms of overall output volume both at home and in smaller venues, and c) because i may get a second rig to do the stereo thing at some point.  

The DT-25 is pretty loud for a little amp and 1x12 and in most instances it will work well enough, but may need a little assistance from the PA or a second rig IMO

I have a Marshall 4x12 here which the DT-25 powers very nicely and the four 12" speakers do give a 'bigger' sound than the 1x12 cab.

Two DT-25 amps (combo or head) will work well in a stereo configuration.

If you always use a full PA system, then volume isn't so much of an issue as you really only need the DT-25 for your own on-stage monitoring purposes.

Nick



Re: DT25 vs DT50, combo vs head/cab, 1 vs 2 speakers etc?
by chrishd400 on 2011-12-05 13:43:14

Thank you both for your informed replies.  Definitely will explore the DT25 as first option in view of your advice.   Also mindful of the fact that our rehearsal space is up two flights of stairs, so back wear and tear is definitely a factor for me!  

(If it's not too vulgar to talk about money here too, I've noticed that the DT50 prices in the UK seem to be 30% higher than the offer prices in US online stores, whereas DT25 are more or less the same, so are a much more affordable option.  I wonder if those discounts will follow to the UK though for DT50?).



Re: DT25 vs DT50, combo vs head/cab, 1 vs 2 speakers etc?
by bigden25 on 2011-12-16 14:16:49

What speaker output do you use to connect the DT25 to the 4x12 cab?



Re: DT25 vs DT50, combo vs head/cab, 1 vs 2 speakers etc?
by Nick_Mattocks on 2011-12-17 01:53:21

Well my 4 x 12 cab is fitted with four 8 Ohm speakers wired as two pairs in series and then the two pairs in parallel to give 8 Ohms load, so I use the 8 Ohm output socket on the back of the amp.  It doesn't matter how many speakers you cab actually holds.  All the amp needs to see is a speaker impedance load matched to one of the output sockets on the back, so if you have a 16 Ohm 4x12 cab you would simply connect it to the 16 Ohm output socket on the amp.

Nick



Re: DT25 vs DT50, combo vs head/cab, 1 vs 2 speakers etc?
by adamhartley on 2013-04-12 17:12:31

Good discussion! I see this is answered, but wanted to add my point of view for others....  I've used a DT25 with HD500 for over a year now gigging similiar sized audiences and larger to those mentioned in the first post/question, and have never had to worry about having enough headroom with the 25. In fact, even with the HD's preamp volume levels down around 35 to 40%, I could usually only set DT25's master volume to around 9 to 10 o'clock to be plenty loud enough with a hard hitting drummer, and usually sending via amp's DI to FOH system.  The problem with this, however, is I wasn't really driving the head hard enough for it's valves to work 'sweetly'. 

I sorted this issue by muting path B. I'm not even sure how the HD's mixer path A and path B work in relation to a single DT head, but it made no difference to my single pre amp models and fx patches'  tones other than volume dropping allowing me to wind the DT's master volume up to about half way ( or more, depending on venue ). As expected, the amp really started to sing and sustain much better, really coming to life and sounding less digital than before when the amp was lower  volume. I could never imagine needing the 50 watt model, but I imagine it would have some tonal differences as NIck suggested.

I've used both a single 12 speaker cab, and a 2 x12 Marshall 1936 model. The 2x12 and DT 25 is a winner, especially if it's your only source of monitoring your playing onstage, which at pub / club venues up to 500 people, it probably is.  I've been gigging for over 15 years, and owned a lot of different gear along the way, and have to say, this amp is as satisfying as anything I've ever used before ( including some far more expensive big name amps ). The big advantage over anything else I've tried, is it's simplicity in set up with the L6 link as oppossed to 4 cable methods when running different effects. 

Rock on!




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