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How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-18 15:55:20

Hi all,

I've downloaded some presets which I like but the volumes are at different levels.

Let’s say patch 1A is too low in volume, when I boost the volume of patch 1A then hit save twice all is fine but when I hit patch 1B the volume is suddenly increased and still louder than 1A.

If I reduce the volume to 1B then hit save and hit 1A the volume is again reduced.

This is so annoying, I am altering the amp volume in the preset, not the master volume on the pedal board.  Even after saving the preset tends to match what level the volume knob is on the pedal board.

I am also using dual amp presets and notice that one amp volume can be saved but the other amp volume reverts to whatever the volume is set on the pedal board.

I'd like to set the volume in the preset, then adjust the output volume using the master volume knob on the pedal board, is this possible?

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by Kupsik on 2013-02-18 23:23:31

If you alter any other parameter (amp treble, amp drive or any effect settings) does it remain same after saving preset and loading it again? If the only problem is amp volume and not master volume, it seems there could be something wrong with amp volume knob - it sends his current value all the time and not only when you touch it and move it. But I would try to reinstall latest firmware at first just to be sure it isn't software related.



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by bjnette on 2013-02-19 00:45:26

Some patches are intended for FX loop and these cut the volume.

Also check the mixer after the amp as some patches are setup differently.

I'd check this first and then ajust the Amp volume after the above is ironed out, that way you preserve the origonal patch tone of the Amp etc.



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by scottyo78 on 2013-02-20 11:30:44

Hmm... that's strange?

What if you save "1B' in Setlist #2 and then also in Setlist #6... does it stay the same volume?

Now try "1A" in both setlists. As stated, it may be something in the preset itself.

Try it using a generic tone (just an amp, with mixer set at center) preset from "CustomTone".

On actually setting the volume level consistency, I use either a Level Meter plugin in my DAW or the dB meter application on my Android phone (many in the Google Play store).



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-25 01:09:02

Apologies I got it wrong, I've had another look and it's not the volume but the Master Volume that isn't saving in the patches.

Also, patch 1B is a clean patch with just FX and no amps.

What I would like to do is reduce the volume of the clean sound (1B) without affecting the tones of the individual FX.

The master volume reduces the overall volume and when I go to 1A it's also reduced, which now to me seems very obvious however I thought it would save in the preset.

On my Zoom pedal once saved there is an overall volume for each effect and you can save this into the preset to match one patch with another, obviously it only works to a certain extent.

Thanks for the replies, for some reason I'm not receiving email notifications of replies. How do I subscribe to threads?

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by Kupsik on 2013-02-25 02:07:56

You can adjust volume using mixer block.

To recieve email notifications, see right column and it's uppest part Actions (you need to be logged in).



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by moondancer on 2013-02-25 03:57:42

Do you mean the outer right knob, named "Master"? This is a global level knob, that you can't save with the patch. Use it for dialing in the right level für your amp oder mixer input.

You should dial in you patch level by the mixer within the patch or by editing the channel volume of the amp model, using the "volume" knob/parameter of the model.

For details you can read the Pod HD High Gain Tone Guide http://de.line6.com/support/thread/71651 were meambobbo posted a very good manual to dial in amps.

HTH

Edgar



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by sloppyfingers on 2013-02-25 08:04:17

I realize not everyone has Gearbox, but if you do a neat lil trick is to plug your pod into gearbox ran flat..No amp or effects on Gearbox...Turn both your Gearbox's output level and "record" level  to a volume that you won't adjust after..I used the record at about two o'clock for setting mine, but it doesn't really matter.

Now using gearboxes VU meter, adjust all your pod patches to the VU.Set all your pod patches to the same level on the VU meter and make sure thery don't clip out on the meter. At this point, you are setting  the pod's individual amp volumes..Your pod's internal mixer shouldn't be touched..It should be set at the same level throughout all the patches if you ask me.

I find that this works great for me!..Now if you don't have Gearbox, I'm sure there are free recording programs out there with a VU meter of some sort.

Maybe there are real ones out there that you can attach to your line between the pod and amp/mixer.I know physical recording mixers have them.

Remember this doesn't address the fact that some tones cut more than others..It just gets you in the ball park as far as volume levels go between patches.



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-25 13:37:47

It's for live applications, I did a gig interstate and had good levels in the studio with a hire amp, not all amps are the same and when I got on stage using the amp I borrowed from the support band the sound guy said my clean sound was too loud.

Unfortunately I couldn't lower the volume (quickly enough) so had to forego the effects and plug straight into the borrowed amp. 

I needed a quick fix, on the Zoom 9050 all I had to do was lower the volume using the master volume knob then save it straight into the patch.

I'll take a look at the mixer output levels when I get home tonight.

Thanks.

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-26 01:04:33

I tried lowering the dB of both Volume A and Volume B in the mixer and it does lower the volume, thanks.

There are FX after the mixer block so I'd like to know if it affects the tone seeing that the signal into the latter FX's is weaker.

I'm currently running it through a practice amp at home on rather low volume so may not be able to pick out subtle differences that could appear when I plug into a valve amp stack in the studio.

Is there a way to reduce the output volume the same way the Master Volume knob does and save it into the patch?

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by moondancer on 2013-02-27 03:56:44

Stephen, I'm really wondering what your doing?

I dial in all of my patches to the desired level. I plug in straight into the main mixing console.

While performing live on the stage there is no time for correction, this had to be done in the practice room because depending on the song and the other musicians volume level the patch has to be dialed in.

If you now change the situation, e.g. you want to plug in in an amp instead of a mixer, keep in mind, that what sounds good with direct to mixer, must not sound good pluged in to an amp.

You have preamp modelss, poweramp model, mic and cab model. Therefore it makes sense to use for different inputs different setlists!

Please check also for the global output options of the HD, combo, stack etc.

In a life perfoming manor it is foolish to play on borrowed amps hoping everything works as desired. Just my 2 cents



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-27 14:13:47

I plug in straight into the main mixing console.

There's a difference there straight away, I mic the amp on stage, during practice I just go straight into the amp.

While performing live on the stage there is no time for correction, this had to be done in the practice room because depending on the song and the other musicians volume level the patch has to be dialed in.

Yes, I did that in the rehearsal studio, the difference in volume was still there, it wasn't optimum to my liking but it also wasn't that much of an issue, when I got on stage the sound guy couldn't deal with it and we were in a hurry.  At home the difference in volume isn't so noticeable on a practice amp. I guess on a loud amp you have headroom coming into effect.

In a live perfoming manor it is foolish to play on borrowed amps hoping everything works as desired. Just my 2 cents

I absolutely agree, we flew interstate by plane and it wasn't practical to lug our amps and quads.  Airlines have weight restrictions and charge by the kilo for additional weight. As a band we pool our instruments to make up the weight tally, i.e. our violinist doesn't carry much but with guitars, keyboards, cymbals, snare, kick pedals, merch and our own clothing we were concerened we could still not meet weight requirements as it was.

Just as yourself, I also didn't expect things to be the same, in the studio the night before in a different town I had to hire an amp and got stuck with a combo. On stage I borrowed a stack.

Now that I'm back home I'll try to sort this all out.

Just wondering, if I added in a volume pedal at the end of the FX chain I could then reduce the volume that way without affecting the tone?

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-27 22:08:13

Just to let you know, these patches are ones I downloaded from Customtone.

Are these patches locked?

I changed the volume and 'momentary' appears in brackets while I increase the volume, I then hit save twice and it saves fine at the desired volume.

When I hit my footswitch to use another patch and then hit the footswitch back again to the newly edited patch, the volume hasn't saved for some reason.  It's at the original downloaded volume.

Is there something I'm doing wrong?

2nd method: I went into Amp Edit mode and then used the volume knob again to increase the volume.

Same result after I hit the footswitch.

3rd method: I then changed the volume using the volume knob while in amp edit mode and tried saving it to a different user group and it saved fine in the new location but with the original volume setting.

Any clues as to what is going on?

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by spaceatl on 2013-02-27 22:28:06

ah...you have edit connected...You have to send the patch from edit to keep the buffer in synch with the hardware...or right after saving using the button like you are doing, receive the selected patch...basically when they are out of synch...Another way to do it is after you load up a bank with patches is to disconnect Edit and level the volumes like you are doing...Basically things can get a little wierd while the PC is connected...



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-27 23:40:56

No, I did all the above after I disconnected it from the PC.

I'm even thinking maybe I should edit it on PC then save it to the HD500.

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by moondancer on 2013-02-28 04:09:54

Stephen,

you're right.

Editing on PC = Do everything with the software and save it by software!

Editing on HD = Disconnect from PC and do everything on the HD!

You shouldn't mix. Changes by software will be done within an editing buffer. It looks like that the HD Patch is changed, but ich you choose another memory and than switch back you will switch back to the buffer until you save the patch with the software. It only looks like the changes are saved, but they are not. If you disconnect without saving, everything is like before editing!

I edit my sounds at home with a small mixing console and headphones.

When I plug in in our PA I also found out, that the difference between rhythm and lead sound is noticeable stronger. The volume will not increase proportional! The sound pressure increases according to the amp and cab, that generates the real sound!

Finetuning of different patch levels I do always under live conditions.

(Sorry for my English I'm a bloody German) Edgar



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by spaceatl on 2013-02-28 04:16:38

That's a little strange...Do any of these patches have a volume pedal or is the expression pedal assigned to channel volume or something related to level? Have you calibrated the pedal? If the pedal isn't calibrated, that's another way you can get some strange leveling behavior...

Is your firmware and Edit both currrent version?



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-28 15:26:53

Yes I've updated to the latest editions of firmware.

I am trying to edit after I have downloaded the patch from Customtone and disconnected it from the PC.  The HD500 was switched off, unplugged, moved from one room to another room, plugged back into a wall sockent and then switched on again.

I find that it is unusual that I have to edit a patch on the PC in order to change it on the HD500.  They should design a way to change it on the HD500 without having to go to a PC and do it via HD Edit.

Last week I needed to adjust the volume of a patch live on stage and I was interstate. I can't just go home and edit it on the PC moments before a gig. 

Not happy Line6, this is very inconvenient.

s



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by lef38 on 2013-02-28 21:36:44

It's a bug that happens quite often (to me at least) with downloaded tones .

I reported something similar here: http://line6.com/support/message/321639#321639

It has never been fixed , you have to recreate the patch from scratch, and that is BOTHERING



Re: How do I match volume output between patches?
by StephenSLR on 2013-02-28 22:22:17

Thank you very much, I'm glad I'm not the only one.

I'll start a thread specific to it and see if anyone has an answer.

s




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