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Showing content with the highest reputation since 11/25/2020 in all areas

  1. 2 points
    What you haven't mentioned is trying any other guitars besides the Variax to see if the problem persists... in two seconds you'll know if the Helix is the problem, or not. Variax guitars are this close to being too complicated to get out of their own way, and notorious for sudden odd behavior, particularly piezo failures, which is especially likely if the problem occurrs (or is most noticeable) on only a couple of strings. Plug in something else and see what happens... I'd bet money that this is a Variax problem, and has nothing to do with the Helix.
  2. 2 points
    Horizon Drive -> Solo Lead OD -> York MES 212 V30 = end of quest for metal tone. ...for now...
  3. 2 points
    Nobody can possibly calculate the odds of your LT choosing to $hit the bed while you're on stage. But the reality is, it's a computer... and sooner or later all computers fail. If you're lucky, it'll happen at home when it doesn't matter, but let me ask you this: have you ever had car trouble in your own driveway when it was nice and convenient? Me neither...most of the time you're on the side of the road somewhere, waiting for a tow truck. Do you need a backup if you gig regularly? Yes. Should that backup already be there in the trunk, every show, just in case? Yes. But nowhere is it written what that backup has to be. If you're content to bring along other gear you already own in case of disaster, so be it... but you have to finish the gig somehow. However, nobody's forcing you to spend money on an identical backup rig. I've had numerous equipment hiccups at shows over the years. The two most memorable moments were a Marshall head that actually started to belch smoke, and a close second was a MIDI footswitch that completely failed... bunch of rack gear, and no patch changes. Didn't have a backup that time, as I was young and stupid. It was not a fun show. Learned my lesson though, and I never did that again. If you do this long enough, gear failures are inevitable. And the more you gig, the closer you get to your own personal Spinal Tap moment. It's like riding motorcycles... it ain't if you're gonna go down, but when. Helix hasn't failed me live yet, and maybe it never will. But it also might die on me the next time out... there's no way to know. If you don't have a Plan B, don't book the show.
  4. 2 points
    Out of curiosity: Got any idea how often you've typed that sentence by now? I for one had to stop counting and thought about slamming it into some kind of clipboard manager...
  5. 2 points
    Cool, thanks guy, looks like it's working now. I was hoping it was just some setting or reset I had to do. Happy T-Day!
  6. 2 points
    Hi ezut, It is not a problem if you all your places are full. You can save them all in different ways, first you can save the whole contents as a bundle, secondly you can save each setlist individually, or finally, you can export each preset one at a time. I will suggest that you simply save one of your Setlist to you computer. Next import the Factory 1 setlist, from the link I gave earlier, to replace the setlist you saved. You will find the Artist Presets are the ones with the names in ALL CAPS in the Factory 1 list. If there is a preset in the Artlists presets that you want to keep, just export that as a single preset which you can load to whichever place you want it to be. If you don’t like any of them or don’t want keep any of them - overwrite them with your setlist that you saved earlier. Once you fill all the places in HX Edit you can save, swap, duplicate, change and remove or replace as many as you wish, whenever you wish by saving them to you computer. It can never really be full. Hope this helps/makes sense. If you are unsure about importing setlists see here from 3:35
  7. 2 points
    To echo DC's reply, it won't do anything bad to the unit itself. Just your ego. This is the first time I've run in to an update issue and I've had the Helix since launch. Well...sort of since launch...I pre-ordered and then waited. Forever. I'm pretty sure Sweetwater looked in to filing for a restraining order from all of us pre-order folks who didn't get their units right away. I made the same mistake, but simply rolled back and did it in order. It took me about a half-hour extra than my normal, more intelligent updating practices. My only excuse is that they said poly and I got excited, then they said Diezel and my IQ dropped thirty points.
  8. 2 points
    No luck with Logic. Thanks anyway for the suggestion. I've opened a ticket with Line 6 and we'll see what happens. Cheers, Keith
  9. 1 point
    Huh? Now I’m really confused. No USB? If you don’t have USB you will not be able to make backup safety copies of your presets, or use HX Edit to load IR files. It’s a real “must have” thing on a computer communicating with Line 6 HX devices. The clue is in the name Universal Serial Bus, its an industry standard. To me this doesn’t make sense.
  10. 1 point
  11. 1 point
    You need to update HX Edit to v3.0. Seems you updated HX Edit to v2.92 after updating your HXS firmware to v3.0. That's the problem - they need to both be at v3.0.
  12. 1 point
    I would invert the colors when the snapshot is selected as well.
  13. 1 point
    Hi guys, @samrichardsam You could download the version 3 Firmware "Flash Memory" to you Mac and use the Updater to perform a Local File Install - just point it at the Firmware file, click "Update" and let it get on with it. See "Choose File" button in your Updater screen shot. Otherwise - read on! @marcofiorini No need to report to Line 6, because so far, everyone that I have pointed to this information has managed to successfully perform and update to version 3 of the Firmware. This is the official Line 6 word on how to fix a failed install which was posted in the Knowledge Base section of these forums. IMPORTANT! In the unlikely event that your update fails, please follow the steps below: Unplug the USB cable from both the back of your Helix and the computer. Turn your Helix/HX device off and on. Reconnect the USB cable to your Helix/HX device and the computer. Download, install, and launch the latest version of Line 6 Updater. In a failure state, the device will not connect to HX Edit. Line 6 Updater for macOS: https://line6.com/software/readeula.html?rid=9831 Line 6 Updater for Windows: https://line6.com/software/readeula.html?rid=9832 Select your device and try updating to the latest firmware again. If the device does not show up in Line 6 Updater after these steps, try a different USB cable and/or USB port. If it still doesn't show up, try a different computer. The full update process is described here. Hope this helps/makes sense
  14. 1 point
  15. 1 point
    No, this is not possible. You have to assign it on each preset. Toe Switch will not work with an HX Effects. All HX Models (including Helix) can operate by "auto on".... eg: When an expression reaching a threshold (eg: 5%) then the effect (eg: wah) automatically turns on. IMO... the closest you can come to this is having the closest switch possible assigned to the Volume On/Off and Wah On/Off. The switch will toggle between them. It's the same principle as a toe switch, but it wouldn't be under the toe of the expression pedal.
  16. 1 point
    Thank you guys so much! After following these steps , my helix finally started going through the process for the update. I had to turn off and on my helix without the usb plugged in. Though I have another question but I’m pretty sure I can find the answer in other posts, but the question is that how come in the updater , it only provided 2.92 instead of 3.0
  17. 1 point
    Based on how audio electronics works.... I suspect the "overheating" concept isn't far off. It's probably one of these 3 thigns: - a cold solder joint - a single component that is out of spec (it can't handle running at the higher temperatures it is supposed to be able to run at) - a component or circuit (power supply?) is generating higher heat inside the unit than is within normal operating parameters, causing other parts of the circuit to have issues as they overheat. That is just circumstantial... I don't know the specific helix workings, but it does have a built in power supply, it does have solder joints, it does have components that could stop working if they were out of spec (just a random bad IC or something could do that, and would have gone unnoticed during manufacturer testing as it runs fine for first hour). The problem with all of that is it would require a receipt and to be within warranty period to get repaired without having to foot the entire cost yourself. I do hope I'm wrong, but I believe that if there was a firmware related issue that actually caused this problem, more people would experience it. The interesting thing is that if it ran perfectly under 2.92 for you or whichever version, I wonder if there is any way shape or form that you could have it reflashed to the older firmware and keep using it, assuming you can't get warranty repair done? Anyhow I know that's not a very positive post :-) And I'm not looking at the unit, nor would I be qualified to do so. But I do know electronics, and any one of my above 3 scenarios could and does happen in electronics once in a while. So, at the very least, it's 3 possible ideas for you to consider suggesting gets looked at. One thing about cold solder joints - if that IS the problem, then hitting the unit (pretty hard, like don't damage it but give it a good rap once or twice on different sides)... that might actually let it contact again and produce sound (make sure you are generating guitar noise at the same time to see if it helps). That wouldn't be a solution, but it would be a pretty solid diagnosis... and could help someone with serious surface mount soldering skills to maybe find the problem component and fix it. Surface mount soldering is WAY beyond my skills.... but there are people who can do that stuff, with the right tools. But that isn't a perfect test, and the other two issues aren't typically going to be solved by physically shaking the unit to regain contact between two parts that have lost electrical conductivity.
  18. 1 point
    LOL. As much time as we have all spent typing this message out over five years worth of updates we would have been better served getting an open source team together and rewriting the update process or a wrapper for users that takes care of HX Edit and the firmware.
  19. 1 point
    Agree with you about new bugs, give them time to be sussed out after a new firmware release and maybe his entreaty to Line6 should not have lumped new and old bugs together, and #3 which is more of a feature request. Not sure if everyone is seeing the same bugs this fellow is but to be fair the majority of the bugs he listed existed prior to the 3.0 release, at least on his device, and it is natural to be disappointed to see them persist after a new firmware release. Never a good thing when the same bugs remain after multiple firmware releases. With that said this does seem more like a topic to celebrate the new release but that might just be the way I see it. There are probably other topics and definitely the ticketing system that provide a better opportunity to address outstanding bugs.
  20. 1 point
    Yes, always at different times. I now installed HX Edit on another WIN10 PC and it runs okay on that machine. Seems this will by my workaround to move all my HX edit software to that machine while DAW and other recording / music related software will remain on my dedicated music laptop. There is so much stuff on there like from fishman, TC electronics, Steinberg. maybe the conflict is somewhere very deep in my system. Thanks for your support guys! It is a little sacrifice to replug the USB to another computer once I like to edit or backup, given the pro side of having a princess and a poly-pitch now.
  21. 1 point
  22. 1 point
    You have a lot of options for how to make a preset for use with your amp. 1) Straight ahead - This is a simple preset, similar to using a traditional pedal board, using Pre effects (OD, etc) into a Helix Amp to Post FX (delay, reverb) out the 1/4" (set to LINE in Global Settings>Ins/Outs) into the MVS FX Loop return. In this configuration you're using only the MVS SS power amp and speaker. Depending on where in the circuit Marshall put the Master Volume, it may or may not control the MVS volume, so start with the Helix Output volume low so as not to blow your ears out, then see how the MVS Master interacts. 2) Same as 1 but using a Preamp instead of the full amp model. I find that the Preamps sound more raw and trebly than the full amp, so if the full amp sounds muddy, try the preamp. 3) Same as 1 but adding a Helix Cab or IR. In this configuration the Cab/IR is essentially a type of EQ, changing the way the Marshall cab sounds. As brue58ski said, sometimes it works, sometimes not. Try it with both the full Helix amp and Preamp. 4) 4cm - this is the most complex and option rich configuration, Using an FX Loop Block L between Pre FX and the Helix amp, before Post FX, you take the Guitar into Helix Input, a TS cable from the Helix SEND (TS is the LEFT send on the Stomp, set SEND/RETURN L to INST and set RETURN TYPE to RETURN in Global Settings>Ins/Outs) into the Marshall Input, the MVS FX send to the Stomp L/Mono return, then take the 1/4" L/Mono Out (SEND/RETURN L set to INST because you want that level into the MVS Input and the Send/Return can't be set separately***) into the MVS FX Return. This configuration allows you to use the Helix amp OR the MVS Preamp OR neither (see 1), and you can put a Cab/IR in the Post FX segment assigned to a FS or Snapshot to try the preset with and without the Cab/IR. ***NOTE on the S/R settings - It's possible to use both L and R sends, one set to INST going to the MVS INPUT, the other set to LINE going to the MVS RETURN, but that results in TWO AD/DA conversions, which adds Latency, which affects FEEL, which is not desirable, and uses two S/R Blocks out of your 8. The ROI is not worth it IMO. Some folks will say always do this that or the other, but one of the nice things about the digital wonderland is that there are NO RULES! Whatever sounds good TO YOU is right! IOW, there's no one-size-fits-all solution. Have fun experimenting!
  23. 1 point
    Thanks. I'll try this.
  24. 1 point
    For toggling several blocks at once you may likely want to use the built in switches in the Stomp instead, and then use the MIDI controller for anything else.
  25. 1 point
    Members 8 20 posts Registered Products:1 Report post Hi, attached is a XLS spreadsheet listing the updated models. You can sort the models etc. any way you want. Let me know if there are any errors or omissions. Enjoy Bboy19 Helix 3.0.0 Amp Cabs Effects List xls.xls
  26. 1 point
    OK, thanks! As far as backing up, I didn't have anything saved so no loss there.
  27. 1 point
    And I don’t understand why you think that matters. After exporting one of your current setlists you can import it again later to the same setlist location and your device will be restored to its previous state, exactly as it is now. Each export and import operation takes a couple of mouse clicks. That lets you temporarily experiment with the new Factory setlists. You can save/export any individual presets that you like and then import them later (after importing your original setlist) to any preset location you want. You will lose nothing you don’t want to lose and gain any new artist presets that you like. I am giving you meaningful answers to your questions and I don’t think you’re stupid. But I do think you have so far misunderstood what I and others have been suggesting.
  28. 1 point
    This is not my experience... not even close. The Helix has been the most "set it and forget it" piece of gear I've owned. It sounds the same every time I turn it on, the most consistently great tones I've had in my 40+ years of tours/gigs. If a user doesn't know how to get certain sounds, I can see them getting frustrated with option overload but how is that the fault of a modeler? For those of us that know what we are after and how to get it... it's a piece of cake!
  29. 1 point
  30. 1 point
    Hi, First thing, have you reset the Globals from the backup you made prior to updating the firmware to v.3.00? If not launch HX Edit and select restore from backup from the file list, you can then choose to reset only the Globals. This will restore your global settings to what they were in the firmware you were running prior to updating your Helix. Hope this helps/makes sense.
  31. 1 point
    Oh, if you are on Windows, make sure to either reboot before using the updater or kill the HX Edit task in task manager, otherwise the updater likely won't work at all or not properly.
  32. 1 point
    My guess is that Line 6 don’t administer these pages themselves. it’s hosted by https://invisioncommunity.com Helix Native forum still has a sticky post, from DI, for the release notes of v.1.50 Native back in January 2018. No housekeeping in here.
  33. 1 point
    It appears fairly obvious to me that English is not your first language, and therefore some of your concept may be a little too complex to get across clearly. I am not trying to be offensive, your English is better than anything I could do in another language. Possibly I don’t have a full understanding of your idea which seems to be very important to you. Although, having said that, I find it odd that you would mention other high end modellers that have the tools you are talking about”. If that is the case why do you choose a piece of equipment that does not feature those things you feel are so important? All I can say is that I hope you can understand when I say “you are trying to re-invent the wheel”. Stay safe out there.
  34. 1 point
    Update the HW directly from HX Edit. just click the little gear thingy in the lower left corner.
  35. 1 point
    Yep, that was basically what I was getting at. If he was only going for a 'swell effect' from the EPX pedals assign them to control the Mix and Feedback simultaneously. Now it makes more sense. Phew! Now it makes more sense. If only I had known how you were using the line mixer. You now have 3 votes on IdeaScale.
  36. 1 point
    You need to follow the instructions as per Line 6's v3.0 release notes to be able to get the artists setlists as they didnt want to overwrite everyones setlists and make everyone mad. Its not "on" by default.. you need to save your own setlists, then make your Helix go back to default mode to install them, and then you add back in your own saved setlists to open slots. See instructions below (taken from their release notes): " Artist Presets IMPORTANT! Because we never want to overwrite your own presets, upgrading to 3.0 does NOT automatically make these presets visible; you will need to manually restore them. Restoring factory setlists and presets will completely overwrite your own, so make sure they're backed up first! TIP: With Helix Floor/Rack/LT/Native, if you want to keep both your presets and the latest factory presets, back up your custom presets as setlists and after the procedure below, drag your setlists onto unused setlist locations. Make sure you've backed up your presets and turn off Helix/HX. Perform the following procedure: Helix Floor/LT: While holding footswitches 7 and 8 (two leftmost switches on the bottom row), turn on Helix Floor/LT. Wait for "Will restore..." to appear and let go Helix Rack/Control: While holding knobs 3 and 4 (two middle knobs below the screen), turn on Helix Rack. Wait for "Will restore..." to appear and let go Helix Native: Click the gear icon in the lower left corner, click the Presets/IRs tab, and click "Restore Factory Setlists" Helix 3.0 includes factory presets created by the following artists: Helix Floor, Helix Rack/Control, Helix LT, Helix Native [FACTORY 1 setlist] 13B-14C—Fish (Christina Aguilera) 14D—Jeff Waters (Annihilator) 15A, 15B—Richie Castellano (Blue Öyster Cult) 15C—Robbie Calvo 15D—Ryan "Fluff" Bruce (Dragged Under) 16A-16D—Felix Martin 17A—Mario Quintaro (Spotlights) 17B, 17C—Bumblefoot (Sons of Apollo) 17D, 18A—Billy Sheehan (Sons of Apollo, Winery Dogs) 18B—Andy Abad (Jennifer Lopez) 18C-19B—Misha Mansoor (Periphery) 19C—Duke Erikson (Garbage) 19D—Steve Marker (Garbage) 20A—Eric Avery (Garbage) 20B—Bill Kelliher (Mastodon) 20C—John Browne (Monuments) 20D—Olly Steele (Monuments) 21A—Jon Button (The Who) 21B—Trev Lukather (Levara) 21C—Steve Howe (Yes) 21D—Dustin Kensrue (Thrice) 22A—Pete Thorn 22B—Rhett Shull 22C—Jade Puget (A.F.I.) 22D, 23A—Jeff Schroeder (The Smashing Pumpkins) 23B—Graham Coxon (Blur) 23C, 23D—Chris Buck 24A—Lewis Allen (Sam Smith) 24B-25A—Rabea Massaad 25B—Soren Andersen 25C—Devin Townsend 25D—Nathan Navarro Vernon Reid 27B—Philip Bynoe 27C, 27D—Markus Reuter HX Effects 12A-12D—Julien Baker 13A—Sarah "Noveller" Lipstate 13B, 13C—Steve Stevens "
  37. 1 point
    It could just prompt you to update HX Edit first before doing the firmware update...right? Yes, yes it could, but it doesn't. Sorry to make your life miserable :)
  38. 1 point
    The edit program is a 1st step in the update process. Then Line 6 should mandated or automatically or message the needed update to the HX Edit before you can upgrade your hardware. This would be a very simple validation check by Line 6. Just a suggestion to the Line 6 team. To be honest I did the hardware upgrade 1st not realizing the hx edit wasn't going be updated also. I did the HX Edit 2nd. Thanks for the reminder post Phil.
  39. 1 point
    Here's a specific example of a company who had an incompatibility with Big Sur early in the beta... Dropbox. Dropbox would simply crash when you opened it. Instead of telling their customers not to upgrade their OS, they fixed the incompatibility, released an app update and everything was resolved. That is how it works. OS updates break app compatibility all the time... the companies update their software. Line6 and other audio companies that make software simply as an afterthought so that they can sell their hardware as "works with Windows and Mac" don't put much resources into keeping things up to date. Also... I haven't insulted you at all.
  40. 1 point
    Ok... so, neither Microsoft or Apple or any operating system developer is testing the many thousands of individual pieces of software that are out there on their OS updates. To think that they could or would do that is absurd. The way it works, in general, is they release betas to the developers before it hits the public, and software developers, like Line6 have an opportunity to get their software ready to be compatible with the new OS. Some developers take advantage of this, and some, like Line6 do not. There are certainly and frequently problems with all sorts of new OS versions, but that is not what we are talking about when we have a discussion about third party software compatibility. You are not talking about the same thing.
  41. 1 point
    Hi guys, I hope you realise that posting in this thread is not really enough - your ideas will probably be overlooked in here - the proper place for feature requests/suggestions is Ideascale, but please make sure that others haven’t already asked for the same thing, because it will split the vote. Then you just have to hope that other users vote it up. Link: https://line6.ideascale.com Hope this helps/makes sense
  42. 1 point
    I own two PC212+ and use a Helix to chain them with L6 Link. When doing so, one PowerCab gets the Left side and one PowerCab gets the Right side of the stereo image. The output block on the Helix has access to control the PowerCab speaker mode, as well as the model selection. This can be set globally, or per patch. You can also control the speaker model on each the left vs the right separately. I'm not sure if you use two cabs whether you can set one cab to flat and one to speaker model. Based on my recollection of the options in the UI, I think the answer is probably no. However, since you can set the settings per patch (and probably even snapshots), you should be able to switch from speaker to FRFR and back as needed.
  43. 1 point
    I recreated the Freqout good enough to get me through a couple songs I needed that edge/into feedback kind of sound without having to bring it to a gig. Its on CustomTone. https://line6.com/customtone/tone/4237762/ . Operates a little bit differently by using the expression pedal but the instructions are in the patch notes and is the "Natural High" setting on the FreqOut. You may have to change outputs. Its set up as a gig patch using Input 2 for a bass path irrelevant to the Guitar Patch on input 1 so ignore that. I tried to use Autoswell on a momentary to bring in the path but that effect is overall frustrating and was better on the Exp pedal. Even with the FreqOut, I like the Exp pedal over a momentary anyway. If there was available LFO assignments like on the Digitech GNX ( maybe even RP) stuff, the path could be automated for a momentary better.
  44. 1 point
    Powercab x12+ has three modes Flat Mode - has three voicings that select the final post-processing EQ and crossover settings for the speaker system. XLR out is the same as the Powercab input (for all voicings) FRFR - Uses the high-frequency compression driver with a flattened frequency-response EQ for full-range operation. The tweeter is on, XLR out is the same as the Powercab input. Use when cab or IR models are provided before the Powercab input.Good for acoustic instruments. LF Raw - Uses only the woofer with no EQ applied, allowing Powercab to be utilized like a typical 12" guitar speaker. Tweeter is off. Use with no IR or cab processing at the input. LF Flat - Uses only the woofer with a flattened frequency response EQ. This voicing is used as the normalized basis for the Speaker models. Essentially each Speaker model is an EQ added to LF Flat that reproduces the sound of the modeled speaker. Tweeter is off. Use this for a different guitar speaker sound. Speaker - each speaker model adds EQ to to the to the LF Flat basis to reproduce the sound of the speaker model. XLR output is a cab model that matches the speaker model, and includes a mic model. Tweeter is always off. This is probably the mode that leverages the unique features of Powercab the most to provide the amp in the room sound. It is actually a guitar speaker in the room with no mic model. Use with no IR or cab processing at the input. IR - uses IRs on the Flat/FRFR voicing for additional speaker selections. XLR output includes the IR processing. The tweeter is always on. Use with no IR or cab processing at the input.
  45. 1 point
    Jeepers, Line 6. Would you freakin' just fix legacy Workbench for your users?
  46. 1 point
    So today I had an occasion to compare the sound and feel of both Helix and Axe2 head to head. The general rule was - the same IR for both. After minor tweaking there was literally no difference for me. Both for the recorded sound and how the thing felt when played. Of course the main goal was to make as similar sound as possible but similar feel was quite surprising. Here is a tip: sag and bias parameters DO A LOT.
  47. 1 point
    I'm getting the same error message code 8312 when trying to import new presets designed for the Helix v2.50, I then updated my Helix to v2.54 and it still is not loading. The error refers to a missing model which should be included in the updates. Anyone know what else I can do. Life should not be this difficult. Thanks for any suggestions.
  48. 1 point
    I recently started using the Sennheiser wireless headphones. I use the Helix as a playback device for my laptop PC via USB so I can also hear and play along with any click, loop, or demo tracks for the songs in our set list for a respective event. Since I also run my guitars into the Helix via a Relay 50 wireless, I'm completely untethered, enabling me to stand and practice while the Helix and related expression pedals are is on the floor so I can also rehearse any foot control work for a respective song. The USB connection also enables me to be connected to the Helix editor to make changes to the preset for a particular song (e.g., snapshots, controller assignments, parameter tweaks, etc.). The best part is being able to play without disturbing my family. The worst part is being so engrossed in playing that your first indication that someone wants to ask you a question is when your feel an unexpected tap on your shoulder and jump 10' into the air in initial response.
  49. 1 point
    well a spring reverb on an old tube amp was mono so it makes sense to have mono available
  50. -1 points
    The fact that YOUR mac is working fine isn't any indicator at all that the Big Sur release isn't without some significant problems. In the world of operating systems it's up to the manufacturer to thoroughly test their OS to determine if it works with third party software or what it's limitations are as well as what the base requirements are for the Mac to be able to run it correctly and efficiently. This is done during the different phases of bench testing, unit testing, performance testing, integration testing, capacity testing and so forth...LONG before it's released as a BETA to the public. It's very clear from all the press and responses on the internet there are significant issues with this release. If manufacturers are alerted about things that will no longer be supported on the OS, they can fix it. If they don't do thorough enough testing to even determine such things that falls into Apples domain to fix. Product testing, especially when it comes to core software such as operating systems, is not something that doesn't have multiple decades of history and procedures about how to do it right, so there's really no excuse for not doing it correctly if you care about your installed base of users.
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