vinny199

That wouldn't work for me it seems as 10 switches option is not available in footswitch mode) From the manual: When set to "10 switches," FS1 (BANK ) and FS7 (BANK ) are re-purposed as additional Stomp switches. This is only for Stomp footswitch mode; while in Preset , Snapshot, or Looper footswitch modes, BANK and BANK are retained.

OK, sorry about posting this in the wrong place and thanks for the link. @silverhead If I set it this way, how do I then change banks? Can I still do so? Thank you

Love my Helix but there is one thing that really makes me wonder if I can keep using it as my main rig. I'm a singer / guitarist. Sometimes, changing patches while singing / in between lines is a bit tricky, and it is so easy to hit the bank button instead of the first snapshot button. If you do that, you're quickly in noman's land trying to get back to your patch, or worse, finding yourself in another song's patch etc. You have to react very quickly and press the cancel button to save yourself and that's not really easy done if you sing, you have to drop out of the song for a bit while you reset yourself where you need to be. If I only played guitar, this would never happen, but having to sing / perform (which means looking forward as much as possible instead of your feet) and change patches, i messed up a few times already and it is driving me nuts. I'm sure it wouldn't be a big thing to update the firmware to add a feature where you have an option to set the bank selectors to "press and hold" for a couple of seconds before they become active, instead of "as soon as you hit them". I'm not saying this setting should be by default, but it would be extremely useful to some of us as an option. There is plenty of time between songs to hold a button 2 seconds. For me, I'd take this feature over any new ampo, effect, goodies they may bring out., Such a small thing, such a big impact. I hope someone at line 6 takes notice of that suggestion Cheers, Vinny

Thank you. That's a great tip. I'll do that. Thanks, that's also a very good idea. Thanks a lot for offering, I'm on holiday that time though. Thanks again. Thanks for all the replies guys. I think I have made some progress. Still some way away from the sounds I'm after, but a big thing has been using the "mixes" IRs from Owhammer instead of single mic / speaker IRs. The mixes ones combine various mics at various distances, including some room and back cabs mics etc, and immediately gave me a less shrill, more present, more realistic sound. So, that's big progress. I am now leaving Global EQ activated and reducing lows at 100 and highs at 6.5. Even them I still EQ the IRs and have started using a EQ block too as suggested. All this combined does get me closer to decent sounds. At least I now recognise the amps I'm choosing and I don't have this super shrill or super dull tone. I hope I've found the right balance and I will test at the next rehearsal on Tuesday to see if that translate to the PA. I'd still like to collaborate / get some help creating patches, so I'll keep looking for someone to help, however I'm hoping I now have usable sounds as starting points. Thanks guys

That's so kid, thank you very much for offering. It would have been with pleasure, however I am on holiday (vacation as you guys say) first week of August. So, it can't be done, but thanks so much. Yes, I'll try everything again I guess, but still would like to find someone to physically help. I've tried all connections, jacks, XLRs, mono/stereo, direct to preamps, direct to soundcard, to mixing desk in rehearsal room etc, and I definitely plug the guitar in the guitar in input. I know the damn thing works good as I hear lots of amazing tones on youtube etc, I just cannot (yet) work out anything half decent. I think now I will try using darker IRs (like the ribbon mic ones instead of 57's), it may help. Thanks

Hey, thanks a lot for that! Really right now, I cannot even get a simple Twin to sound like a twin... I despair. I'd say just about OK on cleans but cranked up is sounds unrealistic, digital, either harsh or muffled (I can't find a middle ground), the IRs sound super harsh even after severe high cut or eventually dull, nothing "feels right". I am happy enough using it as an effect board, but as soon as I try it as an amp solution, it really doesn't work for me and I tired everything I red: Global EQ on/Off / various settings / With / Without IRs, Eqeuing IRs, Inputs changed to line or mic or every options, guitar pad on/off, guitar impedances options etc. I feel I've been around the bend enough.. Either something is wrong with it, or I am missing something and I'd rather get some hands on help than loose days and days as I'm doing now.. I would normally live use my Telecaster (quite bright and jangly) with a fender like amp (modified blues junior, Mesa rectoverb 25, deluxes, hot rod etc) Of course I use pedals or sometimes cranked amps where I can. So, at least getting to a crancked amp type sound that sounds just good and real would be a massive achievement right now. I have bough a good bunch of Ownhammer IRs etc. Right now, nothing would do it seems... Thanks!

Really, I'm looking to get someone to help me hands on at this stage. I have good equipment, including my own studio / recording booth, amps and mics, so I 'm familiar with the sound of amps being recorded with various mics and right now I can't get anywhere near anything familiar, all crancked up amps sound pretty digital and "bad" and I can't commit much more time to it really. I do monitor on Adam speakers and other speaker sets in my studio. I also take the Helix to my band's rehearsal studio and play with the band through the PA, so I have good perspective of both the sound at home at medium levels and in a "live" situation. We have a bunch of dates in September / October both in the UK and Europe and I was hoping to have an amp-less solution this time for this tour. But I'm not getting any luck and with holidays coming soon, I feel it would be just best to have someone help me hands on and pay for the service. Thanks

Hi guys, I'm struggling to get anywhere near the patches I'm trying to build. Nothing fancy, just trying to recreate my regular gig rig (clean / crunch, fuzz) with the Helix. I've been trying for a while now, read so many posts etc. global settings options, IRs and IRs EQ settings etc. I cannot get anywhere near something decent. It's either really harsh, or very digital sounding etc. I just can't get my head around it (I have reasonable experience with amp sims and I've used the Amplifire 12 for a while without much problems for example, but I don't want to start a debate on that) I just give up now. I spent so many days trying, I can't keep at it further. I am looking for someone really good / experienced with the Helix, in London UK / nearby to help me hands on / work with me on this. I'm happy to hire for a day, (providing we can agree a reasonable fee) to work with me and try build my base sounds. If you'd be interested please let me know, Thank you Vinny

Thanks a lot, that's exactly what the problem was. Totally solved. Thanks again Vinny

Hi guys, I have been making a wide range ot presets organised as snapshots and setting instant commands to change the patch on my strymon Big Sky that's hooked up to the helix. The problem I have is that the behaviour of the midi is weird at best. When I change patches and start hitting footswitches, the strymon goes ito a random patch (not the one supposed to be triggered) but then after a while, it starts acting correctly. I also noticed that some presets, if I don't first hit the first snapshot footswitch, the none of the midi signals are properly sent. So if I load a preset and hit a snapshot other than the first one (top left), then the strymon goes into a random patch, but if I hiit that first footswitch, then all snapshots of the presets suddenly start behaving correctly. In short, the behaviour is quite erratic. It works, but not always right away ot you have to hit a specific footswitch first. Is anyone else experiencing this behaviour and is this reliable enough to use live? Thanks

Hi, I'm using the Helix in snapshot mode, all of the time, and either assign the first bottom and top switches to change banks or change presets. Either way, with my clumsy feet, I often hit the "bank button" instead of the first snapshot switch, both top and bottom row, causing a change of patch or preset in the middle of the song. I was wondering if there is a more "fool proof" way of setting these up, how you guys use them and if anyone else is as clumsy as me... In my defence, I sing as well as play so I don't have the luxury to look down at the pedalboard too long when switching.. Advice much appreciated. Thanks, Vinny

OK! Thank you!

Thanks for the reply. OK, so let me make sure I understand this: Let's say I have 4 snapshots for clean sounds on the top row of footwitches, and that I have 4 overdrive types snapshots on the bottom 4 row of footswitches. Now I need to turn down the overall volume of the 4 overdrive snapshots in one go. The method you suggest allows me to do that (not affect the 4 clean snapshots levels, but globally change the volume of the 4 overdrive snapshots?)

Hi, So, I bought Helix last year, sold it as I couldn't get on with latency in preset switching mode, but now bought it again as the snapshots do just what I need to do. I've never gigged with a Helix yet, and one thing that worries me is: It's common when I soundcheck, depending on the room, the amp I may plug into etc that I need to adjust the balance between clean levels and distortion levels. Super easy to do with pedals, you just turn the volume of your drive pedal up or down, same thing for Fuzz and you get your clean / distortion level balance as you need for the room in seconds. Now... how do I do this with Helix? Say I turn up at a venue and despite my snapshots having been poerfectly balanced for previous gig / rehearsals (I will use 8 snapshots per bank, no individual effect assigned to footswitches), the FOH engineer tells me "turn your distortions down" (hate when they do that..) How do you do it?? Do I have to adjust each and every snapshots individually? (I'll have quite a few banks for different songs) What's the quick way of tunring all overdrive sounds up or down? Is there a trick? I would love to know. Thanks in advance, Vinny

THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO REPLIED TO MY INITIAL POST. I have now made the decision to sell the Helix, so I won't read further posts on this thread. My listings are here http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Line-6-Helix-/111964842889?hash=item1a119feb89:g:8JYAAOSwGYVXCjU5 https://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/line-6-helix-almost-new/1163916621 It may improve, or it may not. I don't really have the time to wait. I hope it does for those who like me found it impossible to use in a live context in patch switching mode, the only way this could have worked for me. Thanks again, many of you have been very kind with your suggestions and even efforts to optimise my patches. I greatly appreciate. All the best, Vinny

Thank you, that is very, very kind. However, I have now made the decision to sell the Helix. It is on ebay.. Thank you

Thanks for your reply. I'm the one who started this new thread that is causing you to repeat yourself, so, I'll just say a couple more things and hopefully don't feel the need to say much more beyond that. First, I'm really not sure any of your analogies (cars / boats) are of great help, but nevermind. In my thread and subsequent posts I have been asking if improvements could be made to patch switching latency or if that was it. That is all. It took a very, very long time to get to your answer "Can we make preset switching faster? Probably". The systematic answer in this thread and others I've read is a dogmatic "use a one patch fits all" for live or "adapt your playing to the latency". Finally, this is the first I hear that yes, there may be technical solutions your team could look at to make patch switching use workable in a live context for those who need to do this. What is then a massive let down though is to see in another thread that this is not taken seriously and "should be put to vote" in the feature request section. Personally I see this as an improvement needed to a shortcoming rendering the unit useless to a section of customers (plenty have commented they cannot take Helix to gig as they had planned, and I have this same issue). Really there is a fundamental difference between requesting more amp models, effects, global options etc (all very valid things that will please everyone) and addressing an issue that renders the product useless to many. Am I out of order thinking that? Regarding people putting forward "technical solutions" and you having to repeat yourself on that, I understand the frustration. Again, I started this annoying thread but I never at any point put forward how exactly technically you should do this. I don't particularly care how either. All I was interested in knowing is whether there was hope for improvements or not. But yes, I get it. People say "it's easy, just do this" and at your end you go "really?? that's not how it work". Now, I'd like to ask you as question if I may about your suggestion of a "2 tones patch with zero latency". Can you, with the 2 tone patch you suggest guaranty that you will never need to result to "tap dancing" then you need these 2 tones to "evolve" with delays, boosts etc and then get back to a tone without having to "tap out" other engaged effects for example? Because my understanding (and a kind user tried to help me by creating such a patch) is that: First of all I would have to make serious tone compromises to create a generic patch that would cover all the tones I typically use in one song, but even so I would have to switch on / off various components to achieve various sound combinations, some involving some pretty neat tap dancing. is that correct? If so, how is that progress or anything desirable? I've been, with my "normal" pedalboard using a Carl Martin looper for years. I have not had to switch on / off individual effects in a very, very long time. I can switch on / off "patches" that simply. So, are we saying that the Helix is simply not up to that job (unless you are a strict 2 tones guy)? How is that then a solution or work around? As I mentioned earlier, I sing and play guitar. Tap dancing is out of question. Now, why did I purchase the Helix you may wonder? Quite frankly, I never thought the latency would be so bad, and I never heard it mentioned that in a live context you should really use it as a "one patch per song" unit. Really had no idea it would be that backwards (in my opinion). I pre-ordered it based on the neat videos I saw and sales pitch. I never heard this limitation explained. But anyway: I live in London UK, a city where owning a car is more of an aggravation that a helpful thing. Taking my pedalboard + amp to the gig costs a fortune in taxis. (it's ok when we play outside town as we hire a van, but London gigs are so expensive to do in transportation) I naively thought that the Helix would replace my amp and pedalboard. It was the impression I was under. By replacing I mean, just like may pedalbaod with the Carl marting looper, change full single patches on the fly with a single button and go back and forth between tones that way and the added bonus of having the amp(s) included. Basically, I thought I could go to the gigs on public transport That was the basis of my purchase. Maybe I was wrong but it certainly didn't look that way initially. It's only once you get it that you realise you can't realistically use it this way as the latency and fade out / fade in is a killer and should have a 2 tone patch per song, and result to tap dancing to accommodate variations of the sounds. No use to me at all. So, again, all I was asking is if we can hope for improvements or not. You are saying it could be done but it's not really on the agenda right now. Not exactly a happy though, but I hope it will become part of the agenda soon. These kinds of annoying threads will help that I am sure and maybe people should start doing YouTube videos that show other potential users that for live, there are limitations to be aware of before purchase. All said and done, hopefully.

I personally never mentioned seamless / no latency. I put forward that hopefully improvements could be made to reduce the latency and make it useable. However, every time I talk about that "a reduction of latency", the general tone of replies is about "no latency being impossible", which I am not suggesting in the first place as such. . I am not sure about what others would be referring to, but personally I am not about to make things worse by deliberately naming competitors products here. However there are products out there that have 2 shark processors used with similar intentions as the Helix and achieving much, much lower latency (and I've certainly not heard the "fade out / fade in thing as yet) making patch switching a realistic prospect in a live context. So again, if possibly others have achieved such low latency, maybe there is hope here too? So, again, only mentioning the possibility of improvements, if this was being given a priority.

I have no idea how, why, what would be best as such. All that is clear to me is that some other units (not even mentioning the unique case of the Digitech) seem to manage this better and have much less latency. So, they are not bending the laws of physics either, they just found a better way to implement this. If others can achieve lower latency, then why not the Helix? Surely, there must be improvements possible if they would treat this as something that must be addressed. Again, I am not saying "a cure", but improvements. Why is that something line 6 would fight back and not embrace, I don't understand.

Well, that is one way to look at it The other (and much more accurate way in my opinion) to look at it is that Line 6 added a second powerful engine but didn't pay attention to the gear box and in effect changes are so slow, the engine power is rendered useless as you simply cannot use patch change mode. The fact that the unit is useless to many of us (live musicians in tight rock bands / fast songs for example) doesn't seem to worry you all that much, and its not exactly like we were given advance warning.. I don't think zero latency is what people have been asking for overall in these latency related forums. What they have been asking for (me the first one) is an improvement on that front ans a serious reduction of this lag. If you guys could find a way to cut it by half or so, it would become realistic to use patch changes in a live situation. In addition, as I mentioned before, the latency in the Helix seem to be a significantly higher than competitive products (not mentioning the Digitech unit) and quite frankly I didn't see much data put forward on latency in your sales pitch. It may be fair enough but frankly smug remarks like that may not be all that appropriate. At least Digitech have been upfront about their product and their choices, that is probably why customers have not been complaining to them.

Well, thank you very much for that. Very kind. The 2 patches I gave you are my "lightest" ones: base clean sound, base rhythm overdrive sound. It goes more complex from then on with delay, tremolo, phasers, fuzz etc . Still for me the latency between these 2 "light" patches is hard to make use. But anyway, I understand what you mean with the single patch you did, it is great. It will never fit my needs though, its that simple. Because I I said I just mentioned I then progress through the songs to various other options that will never fit this one fits all patch. I understand the logic of it, it just will not work for me. I also sing and really don't want any option that involves having to tap more than one thing at at time, which will have to happen. Even with my old pedalboard I had a carl martin looper and was able to swtich between "patches" and never individual pedals. So, this is how I need to do it. It's that simple. But thanks again It looks like I just need to accept it is what it is.

Here are 2 patches I use for example. One is my base clean sound and the IR used are some of the Ownhammer Fender cabs (1048) and the other one is my base distortion sound and uses 2 Ownhammer marshall IRs (1048 also) https://www.dropbox.com/s/b0th0jxogvhz2f2/patches.zip?dl=0 So, thanks in advance if you see anyway of making the switch between these better...

I will certainly try that, but what exactly do you mean? You need to have the delay on all the time then in all your patches?, and you are saying that in that case, the delay would ring between patch changes and cover the "uncomfortable silence" Helix does? That sounds like a good idea, however it still won't make you tight with the band as such.. If I need the distortion patch to kick in on the first beat of the first bar of the chorus, the delay may well cover the silence but still the distortion patch will come in late, no? No worries, apology accepted, and yes, it is a nice guitar! And thanks a lot for offering to look at the presets. I will send 2 as soon as I get a chance. thanks. Equally, I wish manufacturers would be clearer about limitations of their products. That would also have been fair..If I had known it was not ideally suited to use in patch mode in live situation I would have not purchased it. I had 30 days return, but as the Helix finally arrived to the UK and my purchase was finalised I had to travel for work, and now I'm using it, the 30days period expired. I don't dislike the product at all. With good IRs it sounds really great. I really like it. It is just that if you build real great patches that suit your songs you can't use them live... unless you compromise with a one patch fits all situation, which was not the plan. As I said, it is hard to really get a sense of the lag / latency in a shop / home enviroment. To really hear what it does / how it affect you you need to play at loud gig volumes and hear it back throguh a PA. In that case, the gap between your loud "playing sound" and the silence that follows (with a fade out / fade in) becomes a shock to the system and there is nowhere to hide. Your guitar just disappear from the mix. . That is where you really hear it. At home, at low volumes, you don't get a full sense of it. I certainly didn't until I took it to the rehearsal studio.

Thanks. Seems to be the general consensus. You can only realistically use the helix live using 1 patch per song. I can't help but feel this is an incredible let down and if more light had been made of this in their product description I would not have purchased it. It is now too late for me to return it to the shop sadly. Thanks again I could not agree more You have to miss at least the first beat of a bar, often more if it is a fast song, if you hit your patch change on the beat. Hopeless.. It looks like the only option is as you describe, a heavily compromised "do it all" single patch. I cannot see that working for me and I made some nice patches for cleans, distortion, fuzz and lead all using different amps, 2 cab IRs per amp and a bunch of effects for each option too. I'll never fit that in one patch. But anyway, as you said, let's hope they improve it. In my opinion it is not even fit for release in its actual state for people who want to use it changing patches in a live context. Thanks

I get your point. I understand all this. What really got me is the actual length of the lag and how it handles it with a fade in / fade out. That, I have not experienced before with any other unit (Some guy will no doubt accuse me of being a competitor troll again I guess..) It is a very big lag and the volumes dips and rise, when playing loud through a PA is extremely apparent. (not so much when you play at bedroom levels) It makes you sound like you are not tight with the band. That is what I was going on about. Latency / lag in digital units? Yes, understood. THAT BIG a gap (which many users have pointed out - Glenn Delaune was mentioning 250ms) is so noticeable to the hear that it is a problem to me and those who need to operate patch switching through their songs. Again, this will only become very apparent to those who use patch swtiching live and LOUD. At home, at quiet levels, you may wonder whatb all the fuzz is about. But at loud live levels, the huge drop / fade in / fade out is impossible to disguise. I hope Line 6 can at least half the lag. hopefully... Thanks