PeterHamm

For info of all and especially Line6 I can happily report that the bug wasn't actually a bug at all. I had tried different cables and guitars but a member, HonestOpinion, suggested it could be the speakers. It wasn't actually the speakers but it led to me finding a faulty channel on my mixing desk so the problem wasn't with the Helix at all.

For what it's worth from what I have heard of the unit so far it is very impressive. It has made me sound like a better player overnight which can only be good :)

Thanks for the replies but I thought I should absolve Line6 of any blame (and I must say that I haven't been influenced by Line6 in case anyone was wondering). It was just me failing to check all other possibilities first.

Feels good to find what's really wrong and fix it, though, doesn't it...

I am going for the rack.  I am a studio composer/musician/mixing engineer.  I don't do any LIVE shows, nor do I intend to.

 

I am choosing the rack because:

1.  I have a setup to where I can have it angled up at me for easy access while I am right there at my PC, even with guitar in hand.  It would actually be less convenient with the pedal version.

2.  I have made a decision years ago I will not have my processor on the floor anymore. Mainly for safety reasons. USB disconnect in the middle of recording session often blue screens, or will lock up the program, and you lose what hasn't been saved.

3.  I prefer the look of the rack.  Very sleek looking

4.  The rack is cheaper - I don't intend to get the floor board controller any time soon. 

I am beta testing the rack and agree with most of what you say (although it's all about sound to me, and I couldn't care less about #3... But especially #1. SO much easier to edit when I can reach the rack than on the floor.

But I have to tell you the power of this unit WITH the controller is awesome, and you might want to reconsider #4

And if they only worked!!! Crazy I know, but I really would like it to actually work. I'm so harsh...lol

Have you opened a support ticket? If not, with all due respect, what are you going on about?

...I have been using their stuff for 15 years also (never live because they aren't good enough) and when they are less than $500 it's one thing, no harm no foul, I can just throw it in the junk pile,...

I have a beta rack and control in my posession, stuck on v1.02 right now, with the quirks associated with it, and yet, I used it live today successfully, only a few days after first encountering it. No problems. Sounded great. Worked fine.

jsiegel, if you can't even use their products live, why are you throwing good money (and time) after bad? Just go with something else, man.

Wow... just wow...

This is their forum that they have out here for us to join in. You, jsiegel2015, are really being harsh.

Line 6 doesn't have a long-term vested interest in NOT taking care of problems users, especially early adopters, are experiencing.

I've been using their products for 15 years, they've been outstanding.

Hello fido083

Thanks for your response but I have the latest firmware updated today. The problem isn't when I change patches. I can be playing the same patch from switching the unit on and after a few minutes the volume will just decrease with out me touching anything. It is reasonably consistent the way the fault happens everytime I start to use the Helix. Loud for a few minutes then it goes quieter.

Do you have any external expression pedals assigned to anything?

The advantage of the rack is that you get all the mess of the cables out of the way right underneath your feet (potentially) and if you play a lot of places where there's guys spilling beer in front of the stage and stuff, you might feel safer with just the controller there instead of your whole sound. 

But to me, most gigging musicians are just fine with the floorboard (and save 300 bucks). Functionality of the rack + controller and floorboard is totally and completely identical. All I/O is the same.

Oh, and the rack is still in beta, won't be out till late winter or spring if all goes well from what I think I heard. The floorboard is available (on and off) now.

I find the XLR output of the Helix to be really really strong. We've been running out the 1/4" output to a DI box like I did with HD 500. Sounds fantastic to us so far.

I found the HD 500 to be much better suited to rolling off volume on any guitar, Variax (which I had for a while) and otherwise.

I don't have a Variax currently, but I find the Helix to be way way better at changing the sound naturally when rolling off.

Thanks for the help, I haven't actually got a Helix yet so can't try it out. I've been extremely tempted and the ability to do this might tip me over the edge!

 

The bassist uses active pickups so it sounds like he could go into the AUX IN, then the second guitar could go into one of the FX returns? (or possibly just have them both going into returns).

 

I'll then be using the XLR OUT to go into a mixing desk, this means the 3 guitars will all be on one channel on the desk so I wouldn't be able to balance the volume levels from there. I'm assuming I'd be able to alter the levels of the 3 signal chains from within the Helix?

Wait, are you doing one guitar and a bass or two guitars and a bass.

If two, that'll be a challenge, because only the guitar input is really suitable for an electric guitar. You'll need a preamp or something.

Yes, with a preamp on one or something you CAN do 3 instruments (or even 4!) with the Helix. Only you know if you want to.

In version 1.04.1 or 1.04.2 there was a new global option introduced called 'Tap Tempo Pitch' under the MIDI/Tempo category. The two options are Transparent and Authentic. One of those should be what you want, probably Transparent.

Awesome. That'll fix it for me. I have to wait for that upgrade, though. cool! asked and answered!

I really think you'll have to test it yourself. It could depend on which amp/cabs you use, and even which model of FX.

 

If one of your guitars is a Variax that can be connected via VDI, and if another guitar has active pickups then the physical inputs setup is no problem. Otherwise, if you have three standard pickup non-Variax guitars two of your physical inputs will not be well matched unless you use the Return inputs. The Aux input is meant for active pickups, and the Mic input is meant for - well, a mic. You may need to use a dummy plug in the Send part of the Send/Return pair.

This is a good point. For instance, I found that for my two-voice guitar rig (which is basically ALWAYS an acoustic and electric guitar signal at the same time) my passive piezos from my electrics do NOT work in the aux in the way they did in the aux input on the HD 500. My active electronic equipped Crowdster Plus is fine, but my PowerBridge-equipped guitars are unusable plugged into the aux input.

I suspected when I read about the unit before it got here that this would be the case. So my work-around is to use a DI into the mike input, which might work well for the bass. I have DIs comin' out my ears, so this is no problem.

If the bass has active electronics, it might not be an issue, as that aux input is setup for an active signal, so try it first.

That said, I think that setup would be a pain in the neck. My setup has the same instrument with two outputs, but two guys with two instruments fighting through the same unit? That could be a pain (although obviously you can split the whole chain to separate outputs).

Let us know if you do it how it goes! And, don't use one path for the electric and one for the bass. Split the top path (1a) so that one input is bass and totally separate, and then you can cascade the second path in the top chain (1b) into path 2 for the electric. Separate the amp (put it in path 1b) from the cab (in 2a) and you can do any effects you can imagine on the electric I'll bet, even using some of the processor power for the bass.

So far, Orange (although it behaves very differently from the one in the Vintage Model Pack in the HD 500), Deluxe, Bassman, Dr. Z, and, WAY more than in the HD 500, the /13. That amp cleans up much nicer in the Helix (actually, everything does).

One dynamic I've noticed... as I've gone in the past 15 years from POD to 2.0 to Vox ToneLab SE (that was a seriously nice unit) to XT to X3 to HD and now to Helix... every generation removes more of the "guitar gap" from the usability of the amps.

What do I mean by that? In the original POD, I had 3 guitars, each one only worked well with one amp, and sounded so-so with the others.

In XT/X3 it improved. In the HD, it got to the point where I could find a number of amps that worked well with each guitar and there was SOME overlap.

But...

In Helix, I'm finding that the amps I like best sound great with any of my guitars. Which is more like the real world.

So instead of saying "I like the Bassman, but only with my Tele" or whatever... I'm finding that I like the amps I like with all my guitars... and... I am finding that one patch works with all the guitars. THAT is new for me.

I'm sure that there are a LOT of things that they are dealing with, from feature requests to "bug fixes" and I would bet you real money that they are not even close to ignoring this.

But for them to tell you what they are going to do about it, or what can be done about it, or even if it's a physical vs. software problem... before their engineers have totally evaluated it... I'd give them a little time to figure out what can be done about it.

Remember, you are all early adopters. They have a vested interest in you liking their product and company I think.

Maybe this has already been asked and answered, and maybe it's because I'm on v 1.02something (can't upgrade past that yet), but when you tap tempo while a delay is happening, it behaves EXACTLY like a real pedal, warbling the pitch like you turned the knob.

That is cool.

But I desperately want to turn it off and have it behave like the HD 500. I often have to re-establish tempos during songs and don't want that warble.

Does that count as a feature request or a bug report? Feels like a bug to me.

ghprestige. How did it sound going through the 1/4"->D.I. route. reason I ask is that I find the 1/4" output to be virtually the same (maybe even a tad more present) than the XLR anyway.

Why the Global eq doesn't work with USB output? there is a logic reason behind this limitation?

When I use a Leslie block do i have to swtich off the cab simulation of the amp? (Because the sound become muffled when i switch on a Leslie block).

Will  you add an auto volume swell and an auto panner effects?

I think all fuzzes are all too much extreme sounding  (in my opinion) they sound always to the max, less regulation.

On Leslies, it's up to you. Some like the effect with the cab sim and some without. This is one reason why I don't plan to ever make a patch that doesn't have the guitar amp and cab separate. I want that flexibility. (and without a cab, the leslie sounds GLORIOUS)

As far as the fuzzes, remember fuzz pedals are tricky. The models probably are, too. For instance, most fuzz guys do NOT put a buffer before their fuzz, because the fuzz's impedance is setup to go to the guitar. have you set the Guitar In Impedance (in global settings) to "Auto"? That might help (assuming the fuzz is first in the chain, where it must be to work the way I think you want it).

...So ya I expect them to lay low, act like it's intentional, maybe fix really angry customers units at some point, but mainly address it with an engineering change in future models...

It will be interesting to see what they do. Keep in mind that it may be as new an issue to them as it is to you. They may be having meetings right now (well not right now, because it's 6:00 in the morning in California) about this.

And yes, it's an amazing unit. The sound improvement is noticeable, the flexibility improvement, for me, is revolutionary. I would need 3 or 4 HD 500s to do what I'm doing with this unit now that I couldn't do before.

"Design flaw?" "Damage control?" I think that's overstating. There are loads of products that don't play nice with phantom power and there are loads of products whose original documentation has to be revised.

My initial tests have indicated that the 1/4" output through a decent direct box is identical, or even a tiny bit more "present" sounding (I DEFINITELY found this --more-- with HD 500), than the XLR... but you have a point.

Then again, I've seen loads of gear that needs special stuff to get it to go to outputs you want, and most of that is pretty pro gear.

It really stuck out to me when I was reading the rack manual, and to be safe, I felt I would avoid using that output just in case. My board lets me turn it off per channel, but I don't want to risk damage for sure.

I think Whirlwind or somebody makes a 1:1 XLR isolator that removes phantom power.

Sorry Peter, I can't find where the manual says it. Can you tell where in the manual it's mentioned?

It is not in your manual as I see it now. It IS, however in the manual for the Rack version.

I wonder if it wasn't discovered to be such an issue right away before the manual for the floorboard was printed, or if it's only an issue with the rack version and your problem still needs to be addressed. I'm guessing the former.

I am actually using a DI on the output because it's simpler for me to avoid feeding phantom to this unit (as I apparently have to). I always liked the sound of the 1/4" outputs on the HD 500 BETTER through a DI box than the XLRs. 

I will compare them at some point, but so far, using the DI sounds so great I am not that concerned. Don't know if that helps YOU though...

So I'm guessing you left it constantly "on"?

Yeah, but eventually I figured that when I didn't have it there, I didn't know it was gone and probably just adjusted to compensate.

I left it at its lowest setting and had the original release, not one of the updates, and I adored it.

Should have called it a "more tone" knob.

Where did you put it in the Hd500x chain?

A lot of guys like it right at the end in the loop, or even out the 1/4" output. But I liked it first. I thought it was more subtle there. Tempted to get another one actually...

There is a need for the editor to me.

 

I don't want to lie on the floor or stoop to edit. Putting the helix on a stand means no foot use age .

 

And the biggy I have sight problems and can zoom away to my hearts content on my large iMac monitor and use my feet to stomp etc.

 

But still ... No helix arrived for my order in the uk so it's all pretty much academic. Might look at the ax8 hmmm

yeah, I hear ya. I edited tones a while yesterday and my back is killin' me...

I have seen others posting not to turn the master volume up all the way as well. When I want the cleanest tone possible on a real amp I often do turn the master up all the way and then adjust the Drive or Pre up until I get sufficient volume. Is there a reason not to use this strategy on the Helix?

It seems in theory that this would work, but many amps (and models) actually don't operate at their cleanest that way. I discovered that about the models in the HD 500 and now it seems to be true so far in Helix as well.