miguel_lopez

Hi:

just a simple question:

Do you think IR's from other companies such as redwires and ownhammer are better than line6 helix original IR's? thank you!

(I have ML soundlab to use them with my AX8 and I find them FAR BETTER than fractal original cab models...)

Hi:

ok, so I downloaded the HD FULL pack, and as far as I've tried the new models, I noticed they are INDEED tremendously DIFFERENT, but I think in a "better way" because they are more like a "High Definition" version of all those PODxt original tones. However, yes, indeed, there's something you left behind on the PODxt and there are some "new" stuff in the HD versions. Let's say I'm happy with the experiment, so now I'll get back to work with my usual excess of hardware chain to get my "unique" tone.

Rock ON!

They're all a bit different, not necessarily better or worse. HD500 lost some things X3 had, and gained some others. I generally thought the HD500 sounded better on most things than the X3. But there are still some tones on the old POD 2.0 that are worthwhile and hard to reproduce on anything else. That said, I'm happy with Helix and am glad to have less hardware choices.

This

I think I will try those HD packs since I can't find those LINE6 original tones not even in the Helix(not necessarily better or worse). The other day I read a Guitar magazine article (can't remember if it was the deaftones or some other band) they said they recorded their demo with POD 2.0 and when the label record heard it they said it was fine because there was not a way to reproduce it with anything else and had some spice in there they didn't want to get rid of. This is something I experience a lot. Most of the time I write songs with my PODxt and then I use real stuff but sometimes I CAN NOT reproduce the same vibe I did with the PODxt(again... NOT necessarily better or worse; it's that personal print)

Thanx for reading and your kind reply

Miguel

I know it may be the wrong place to ask this question but, I'll give it a chance here

I have all POD family and also Helix, I use them all, including AX8, mixing them all in order to combine elements from each and every processor according to the tone I need... The other day I saw the packs for POD HD and it has original Line6 models I use a lot from the POD xt processors. I am a big fan/user of Acoustic, Aggro, Spinal Puppet and one of my favorite: PURGE!!!. I was wondering if the Metal/Vintage packs for POD HD sounds better than the PODxt amp packs. I use to mix my sound chain as this: PODxt amp models(acoustic, spinal, purge, aggro) ONLY(no cab-mic-room-fx) to the Helix in order to edit all fx eq room scenes etc and finally to the AX8 in order to use the ML SOUND LAB cab packs, as far the best IRs I've used. So, as you can see I need to know if those same original LINE6 amp models will be the same as the PODxt or will they be better in the POD HD(?)... do you think they would be necessary? I really like the high gain spinal, the ultra sterile acoustic and the gritty crunch Purge; tones I Can NOT get from any other processor...

Thank you for reading and help

Miguel

 

Helix is also decidedly NOT the replacement for POD—it's a completely different product in a completely different line. We're not beholden to POD at all, and that means we do whatever is best for Helix and Helix users.

 

Line6 Original Spinal Puppet re-mastered in helix would be my dream come true!!!

thanx for the explanation but I insist...

Really necessary? Depends on who you ask.  ;)  I say no, its not. I have the ability to run the Helix into a Firehawk 1500 FRFR amp and it sounds killer. Thru my Mackie HR824 studio monitors it sounds great too. And I can also run Helix thru my Fryette Power Station 2 and into my 2x12 cab with Cele V30's and its just to die for. So, no IMHO it's NOT necessary.

this!!!

Then "as said above" it must have been an Epi... The point is you can polish that Epi/Yugo/cubic zirconia till it shines and its still a lesser item and not a Gibson. I know how they both feel and play too, cause I own many of both. Do they both have a place in my world? Sure, I love um but you "mostly" get what you pay for is my next point. ;)

I have priceless guitars too, and consider they are the most important part in the whole tone formula; a high grade selected wood quality has no point of comparison

and I can't explain how Gibson fails even in high grade instruments... sometimes the price is NOT right and I've seen(not mine) cases in musicias buying a very expensive Gibby and NOT too impressive for paying 4 or 5 grands

my fenders and Gibbys are great(I play them before buying them); surprisingly what you said, I've polished "custom shop" epis and for a 1000 bucks luthier's job the result has been miraculous, so as many asian guitars I've modified

better than USA Gib? Man! I don't know, 'cuz an Ibanez prestige can Do what USA Gib cannot; they are different kinds

now, as far as I've gone, I think Fractal is better than Line6 in many ways that you must own both to understand this fact

(still PODxt is my favorite lollipop around)

How is that Line6 created POD, then PODxt(vetta stuff), then POD HD, now Helix... what's next??? I have them all, love them all and learned a lot from them

OTOH Ive not ever seen a low end Gibson Les Paul Custom.  ;)

I have

hi:

I think I have to print my opinion in here 'cuz it's lack of objectiveness

comparing these units is out of place

seymour duncan used to have a website with samples of his pickups playing the same guitar, same amp(n' set) same cab, same mic, same guitar player, same riff, same sample rate, same pickup builder

yes, I know it's a different case comparing pickups(real world) from digital divices(unreal world)

I even used to get deeper with my own instruments comparing everything: paint, brand strings(d'addario, dunlop earnie, etc) pickups, pickup calibration, pick up-strings proximity, pot values, different caps, caps values, fender/gibson braided wire, amp settings, mics, mics placements, mics cables, cab settings, instrument cables, pick gauges and materials, etc

playing the same riff to compare a tone this way just makes impossible to pick up your mind, then you'll never know what your choice will be to play-record that catchy tune is in your fingertips

then, I realized each ingredient has its own purpose in the whole formula; so, playing the same riff with same guitar, same strings, same pick, same instrument cable, same amp setting, same cab, same mic, same room, same everything just by changing something as the pick up, just to hear a small difference that's not gonna be that noticeable when the rest of the band play together, I'll never notice if my pick up is alnico 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, or ceramic, or di marzio, or 250k pot or 0.022 cap, or orange drop, or bumble bee...

then I learned the lesson: I took the same guitar and from scratch I took out the best tone possibilities that suited best for all the properties from the instrument itself: tone wood, pick up, string gauge, pot/cap value, wire, finish(lacquer/poly) hardware, etc

I invite every one of you to try both Helix/POD and take the best from each and never try to compare them

HOW I WISH LINE6 CREATES A TONE UNIT WITH NO NAMES, JUST WHAT IT IS SO YOU CAN'T COMPARE IT

Digital_Igloo said that the original Line6 models were the "correction" or "improovements" from classic tones in a more eficient way

IMAGINE A BRIT 80'S HARD ROCK TONE SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO TWEAK ANYTHING instead of "modeling" a jcm800... would't be that cool? or any other guitar tone, instead of an ENGL "model" so you spend hours on edit a useless video to demonstrate if real deal is close enough to the digital era's ultimate processor

this guy from the video is setting the amps to neutral... why not setting the amps separately getting the best from each, then comparing them will be nuthin' but great tones that are gonna be selected by preferences in a matter of taste instead of eficiency

on the other side, I find Fractal Audio better than Line6(have both); but I can't live without either, I need both 'cuz I don't compare the two units as more realistic or closer to the original real world stuff... if that's the case, my favorite high gain tone is the spinal puppet from the old PODxt-V30-421Dynamic set and if I may need a plexi tune I'd pick up original Line6 purge pre amp connected to the ultra high resolution cab model from AX8 and editing effects from the Helix(messy, isn't it?)

DON'T forget digital units are not the only divice needed in your tone, that's why all these people is arguing all the time when their divices are NOT enough to determine the tone they are after; trust me, a professional tone comes from a dedicated sound ingeneer than your fingertips and your $1,500-$3,500 piece of gear... NEVER IN THIS LIVE, so as having a nice black face, a fine instrument cable and a priceless guitar won't be enough to sound as SRV: NEVER

we are musicians, not sound engeneers, may be we know a bit of production and necessary gear but we play guitar and write music

it all depends on what you hear better

if it's Fractal, then go there, if it's a real amp-cab-mic-room, go for it, if its's Helix you hear the man

the other day I was mic'ing a cab with the best mic I had and it  was a very expensive one but I didin't like it at all; at the end I used a mic that came in a sound card combo 'cuz it sounded the best way the song required, maybe a 20 bucks mic!!!

So don't get impressed SO easily with expensive toys, and NEVER under-estimate low end divices

That's the idea behind all Line 6 original amp models (like Fatality and Litigator). An idealized, optimized amp model not beholden to the quirks, inconsistencies, and inadequacies of the real thing.

begging for a high gain model as the original Line6 agro, spinal puppet, insane... etc

 

You, my friend, need the Agro! Incredible high-gain tones out of this one with no need for a stomp!

 

Vote for it here:

http://line6.ideascale.com/a/dtd/The-original-Line6-Amp-with-the-biggest-versatility-the-AGRO!/842434-23508

 

 

actually I vote for the spinal puppet but there's absolutely nuthin wrong with the agro

thanx, my friend!

Tried the Archon lead?

"I got blisters on my fingers!"

I'm SO impressed by this amp, thanks for your kind advice

congrats line6! you made it!!! thank you!

Tried the Archon lead?

 

2.10 in my Helix, let's tear down the wall and wake up the neighborhood

I still miss IR's in the update

Maybe a new caps lock key?

Oh Man! sorry, I forgot it =)

Over the last couple of weeks, ive really put together some fantastic high gain sounds with the Helix amps. They are 95% IR based obviously, without question the best high gain tones ive heard from a Helix.. I will post them sometime in the next few weeks along with discussion.  

 

Now without the right IRs, you may not like them as much and Helix cabs arent going to come anywhere close, but if i can approximate the IRs im using, at the very least it will give you a great starting point. These tones are very close to mix ready for my tastes but lets face it, no two people often think alike, not to mention the differences in gear, playing, ect.....

THANK YOU! NOW WE ARE TALKIN'!

 It's a high gain font and much louder than all the others! Stick a tube screamer in front and see how it fattens up!

THERE'S NOTHING MORE I CAN ASK FOR LINE6 THAN AN ORIGINAL LINE6 MODEL WITH NO NEED TO STOMP IN FRONT TO GET A DREAM HIGH GAIN TONE

ANY NEWS OF NEW IR'S IN THE NEXT UPGRADE?

Don't forget the depth parameter in the third page' ;)

ACTUALLY I MADE A LITTLE RESEARCH 'BOUT THAT AMP AND IT'S SOOO INTERESTING, I'M TEMPTED TO GET A REAL ONE

THANX AGAIN FOR YOUR KIND SUPORT AND ENTHUSIASM

Tried the Archon lead?

OK, LET'S GIVE IT A TRY, THANX! =)

NO HIGH GAIN UPGRADE: NOT INTERESTED

Practically though what are you going to do? Fit them on a massive pedalboard? Put one in a rack drawer? Keep them loose and rewire at every gig and rehearsal? It's also going to take up an awkward footprint on stage

I have two PODxt live and still use them in live gigs to make my crossover stuff which took me a long time practice to get them incredibly working together the way I always wanted

nowadays with helix that's possible with a single set up and you have the blender pedal expression

since I feel very different both units it would be back to the old style when I used to carry TWO PODxt Live in my gear to gig every time; so, it's not a big deal, I've been there before

it's a choice I don't understand, it's my opinion of course, because they do the same thing, it could make sense with a fx8 or better a h9, but another amp simulator not.

I have a kemper too, but I don't use it with my helix..they start from different points but with the same goal, amp simulator with effects...so for me use helix and ax8 together is like to open a bottle with 2 corkscrews... ;-)

as far as I've gone, trust me, they are very different, I mean the tone; yes, they do the same, yes, it's like opening a bottle the way you said, but they sound DIFFERENT(the feel DIFFERENT)

I think it could be cool to have the AX8 in a Helix send/return loop for yet more amp models available via snapshot/midi in a single Helix preset.  I'm pretty sure it has amp models that Helix doesn't so it could be a nice compliment.

 

Also, I think AX8 utilizes ultra-res IR's up to 8000 samples, so the same IR's/cabs may sound much better in AX8 with either Fractal amps or Helix amps.  Just using the AX-8 Ultra-res cabs may take the Helix amps to the next level.  Plus, this may give the ability to use convolution reverb IR's and better sounding acoustic model IR's.   Again, I'm guessing you would use a Helix send/return block after a Helix amp model.  Maybe multiple S/R blocks.

 

Fractal Cab Lab and IR mixer would be handy.

 

AX-8 also has a 4 minute mono and 2 minute stereo looper and good control layout.

 

I wonder if there is a way to set the AX8 up to control Helix snapshots via MIDI full time and leave Helix in stomp and/or preset mode.  AX-8 has 8 preset buttons and MIDI capability.  

 

I also love the fact that you can get both of these units for about the cost of a full on Axe FX II and foot controller...sans rack!

 

Personally, I would probably never get through a whole song if I had both of these units and all of those options in front of me.

 

I look forward to Miguel's findings...and hopefully some recordings of Helix amps into Fractal AX-8 Ultra-res cabs :)

Roscoe5 thank you very much for such a great input here!

this is the light at the end of a dark and cold tunnel I wanted to see

I've seen you are after better IR's options, since it's a Helix "weakness", also I've seen you have shared lots of GREAT ideasin older posts, so as in here, to go further and try to develope better tones thru better IR's possibilities. Thank you for that helping hand

I'm jus a humble musician/artist obsessed with the L&R channel tones, I have almost everything in my equipment set in stereo; two of almost the same stuff: 2 same heads of every amp I have, two of every cab I have, two of etc...

Yes, my question is more about getting these units working interactively, but now you mention it, I think it has a bug potential for nice tunes

back to the original purpose, I remember having also two different kind of everything in my gear: randal/boogie, Fender/Matchless, Soldano/Marshall... and the same as cabs: v30/gt75, 100k/black shadow, greenback/G12h... and mics: shure/AKG, Sennheiser/Neuman etc...

nowadays sometimes I think is a little messy if it's out of control, but when you hear both sftuff working together you notice something different from the bunch of artist around

so, having both units will let me work them together in many ways

when I got Helix I was shocked using the high gain stuff from PODxt running thru the many "weak" options of CAB/MICS in the helix, and tones of tone correction with global eq, HIFI effects, reverbs, and many other options Helix offers

yesterday was too late night to keep rocking loud, but I olny tested the first 16 prsets and I noticed it's a VERY different animal/beast from Helix

since I only have a modest car and I've never tried a Lamborgini or a Ferrari, I could say, I suppose(imagine) it's something like that, Man! I don't know what I'm saying, but for sure, L6 and Fractal has NOTHING to do if comparing between them is the purpose

having in left channel such a monster as Helix and on the right channel that tiny sucker AX8 may not result into a bad combination after all

cheerz and thanx for your kind reply and support

so I finally got my pair of dream bitches:

YES! today I went to pick up my Fractal AX8, I'm so excited to have the best of both worlds(perhaps I'm missing Kemper, but not right away; it's too expensive)

Having both, As many of you, I'm asking for suggestions of "pairing them" if it's the case you have tried it

I'm not posting this thread to compare units, that's been so discussed in other forums

both units are the best of the best

I was thinking about using AX8 as an external divice, then matching it thru SPDIF into HELIX as an external "stomp" then edit with endless possibilities in the Helix room

Any other suggestions???

thanx