loydall

Hi - back in the Helix game after a few years out. Couldn't resits the Stomp XL. At the moment I'm using the stomp into my Vox AC30 so not using the amps/cabs. Previously when I was using going straight to frfr/PA I would set the global EQ to cut a little high end off to remove any harshness but I haven't done that going into my amp as it seems to me any overdrive pedal block I use in the stomp should have a "normal" overdrive output and, because I'm going into a real, physical amp and cab, I shouldn't need to touch the global EQ. But - it seems the the stomp still adds more high end than is in the original signal (analog through VS digital through with no blocks) so I still need to add a little high cut on the global EQ to get the output similar to real overdrives or just with the stomp bypassed in analog through.

It's not really an issue as once I take a bit of high end off on global EQ I'm pretty much where I started but it seems the stomp does add something else. I have played around with impedance as well by the way, I know it can be set auto to the first (active) block but if I'm looking for accurate sound through the stomp with less impact on the original sound I find lowering the impedance a touch and also rolling off some high end on the global eq gets me there.

Anyone else have experience with this? 

Cheers.

Thanks - yes, checked all of the above and Input Z isn't set to auto.

It's odd, it can actually change switching between preset (volume ok), analog bypass (volume ok) and then back to preset where the volume drops. Like - the process of switching between preset and analog bypass somehow changes the volume of the preset.

Hi - I'm getting weird inconsistencies when switching analog bypass on and off. I can have a preset (even with all blocks turned off) which seems to be outputting at an ok volume, I switch to analog bypass and then come out of bypass, back to the patch and the volume can drop considerably. 

There doesn't seem to be any consistency to this behaviour either.

I've also noticed that I can have presets I created that seem to be a bit quiet. I go to create a new, empty preset and the volume straight out of that is higher than the already-created preset. Even when I disable all the blocks and the In-Z is the same.

Any idea why this might happen?

Thanks

Yeah - certainly the attenuator option is the way to go long term but short term this is my fix. I actually compared mic-ing up my cab and going straight to PA vs taking the preamp signal through an IR and going to the PA. The mic signal was much brighter so I found an eq block before the IR worked wonders (I tried loads of IRs and none were as bright as the actual mic-ed amp). Neither were a bad sound, just quite different. 

1 hour ago, spaceatl said:

yea, you are on it...if you are mono on your 4CM, then you just need to adapter and make sure you are using the discrete sends in the blocks where you need them.

 

Yes, "stick a direct box" is just a vernacular for the HX FX Sends not balanced and generally you may want that PA send to be balanced...Technically, in this case you would not need a Direct Injection Box (DI Box)...You are not injecting it into anything since this is just an output....In this case, you could use a simple direct box (small) as you don't need thru...

Thanks. That's got it sorted. Independent volume control (or rather consistent volume on the signal going to PA). That's great.

Another question I have is that I'm using 4CM so the preamp signal of my real amp is coming back into the HXStomp, maybe a bit of reverb and then back out to the FX Return/Powerstage of the amp. That part of it is great. When I split the signal off to go to the PA I'm effectively taking the preamp signal splitting it, running that through an IR and then out to a PA. But, that means the signal never goes though a Power Amp stage. (Well, it does, it goes through a PA power amp but not a guitar amp power stage). The difference is like comparing the helix preamps to the helix amps. The amps always sounds a bit brighter/fuller than just the preamps because they model the power stage as well. Is there anything I could do to emulate just a power-amp stage for that preamp signal coming from my amp?

I guess an EQ before the IR would do something similar.

49 minutes ago, spaceatl said:

sure, you could use the FX Send in the stomp and assign an output block...You will likely need an IR block right before it. You will want to pull it off the main chain so the IR is isolated from you main outputs and only the FX Send...Stick a direct box on the FX Send. The volume of the HX FX Send (PA output) will stay fixed and you can use the HX volume control for your amp monitor.

Thanks - yes, I think I was heading in that direction. Only slight issue is that I am using the Left FX channel as part of my 4CM. I would (I think) need an additional Right FX block send later in the chain to do what you're saying (which does make sense). That means I need a cable splitter on the FX Send from the Stomp. I do have one but only a very short one. By "Stick a direct box" on the FX send, do you mean a DI Box? I think I have a crappy old one somewhere which I could stick on my board and then run an XLR cable from there.

Hi - I'm using my HX Stomp in the FX Loop of a non master volume amp head. I use the main volume on the helix to act as a volume control for the amp itself (otherwise the amp just runs at full volume). This is fine and it allows me control for bedroom/home use and then gig levels. 

But - I also want to send a signal from the HX Stomp straight to PA (with an IR Patch on it as well) but I don't want the main volume on the HX Stomp to effect that level. If I'm playing a gig I might want to turn up the volume on the HX Stomp a bit just to get a bit more from my amp but I wouldn't want it to impact the level going to the PA/Mixing desk.

Is this possible?

Cheers

54 minutes ago, MGW-Alberta said:

I built a snake for mine and colour coded the connections to make it fool-proof.

 

 

 

 

 

That's exactly what I'm talking about. That's brilliant. Surprised you can't just buy something like that.

1 hour ago, SaschaFranck said:

The guitar cable isn't part of that. Unless you'd like to plug your guitar in on the floor. It's really just 3 cables. Send to amp/FX, return from amp/FX, output to amp return/input. I used to use shrink tubes and made these things myself.

Yeah - that's why I said it would be 3 cables.

Just a thought but.... one of the things I really dislike about 4CM is all those cables. They look messy, get tangled and are a pain to deal with.

Is there such a thing as a cable that contains (it would actually be 3 because 1 of the 4 is the guitar cable itself) a bunch of 1/4 inch ended cables separated enough at the ends to connect to input/fx loop etc... ?

They would need to be colour coded each end (obviously) but effectively a cable with 3 cables inside it.

Obviously you could just tape 3 cables together but that's scruffy.

Just a thought...

Update on my search for the best (for me) amp model to run drives into... I've really got into the Matchstick Ch1. Just as a clean(ish) platform it sounds incredible and, for my tastes, takes pedals better than other amp models I've tried. I'm running my helix into a Pedal Baby and it's probably the best sound I've had from any amp I've owned (and I've owned a few valve amps in my time). Can't believe I've skipped right past the Matchstick Ch1 all this time and not bothered playing with it. Running a Teemah! set very low gain but just boosting things a touch sounds incredible. Then I run my Lightspeed and Protein in the fx loop. For now, this is perfect for me.

3 minutes ago, zappazapper said:

Maybe I'm wrong but I always thought the purpose of an overdrive was to drive the input of an amp, the goal being to maintain the character of the amp while providing more gain than the amp provides, and/or shaping the tone before the amp's gain stage to tweak the saturation. So in that sense, any amp can be a good platform for overdrives. When I got my X3L years ago, it was the first time I had access to a "Tube Screamer"-type overdrive, and I used to spend hours just putting it in front of every amp model on the list, and they all sounded good in their own way. So I would suggest running your pedals, with the same setting you would use on a real amp, through every amp model in the Helix and finding the sound you're after, rather than choosing one based on anecdotal reports of compatibility. 

I think there are 2 approaches . Either run your amps at the edge of breakup and then drive them further with overdrives enhancing the amp's own overdriven characteristics with those of the pedal. Or -  you run your amp very clean and you get the pure sound of the pedal overdrive on its own. Both are valid and I'm not saying one is better than the other. There's definitely a difference between the 2. 

21 hours ago, DunedinDragon said:

I owned an actual HiWatt for years and I really didn't appreciate the Helix model until I paired it with the original Fane speaker IRs from Rewirez and it became the amp I loved for so long.  I still use it extensively on a lot of  70's and 80's classic rock styles and there is no better amp for getting the Joe Walsh signature sound when it's paired with a Minotaur or Teemah.

For some reason I'd always skipped past the helix WhoWatt but after you mentioned it I gave it a go and absolutely love it. Too many good options with the Helix. I think I need to force myself to sit down every weekend with a different amp block and treat it like I just went out and spent £££ on it (as in, give it plenty of time and attention). Just as a clean amp it's got a really great feel to it and does take pedals really well.

Thanks for the suggestion.

4 hours ago, SaschaFranck said:

IMO it depends a lot (possibly even the most) on which cab you're running things into, as with clean amps that will be the deciding factor for the overall voicing (well, not only for clean amps) and hence define whether your drives will sound sweet and silky or harsh and biting (or anything inbetween).

Anyway, my personal favourites as clean pedal platforms are the Princess, the Cali IV Rhythm 1, the Cali Texas Ch 1 and sometimes the Placater Clean. I usually set all of them so they allow for a lot of real clean headroom (I often like/need completely clean sounds).

If you can get away with a tad of dirt on the amp, I like the P75 or one of the other Marshall variations (the Line 6 2204 Mod takes pedals pretty well IMO, but you might even have to roll down your guitar volume for a completely clean sound as it doesn't sound too great with drive values <0.8 anymore, at least to my ears). Whenever I don't need completely clean sounds.I prefer one of those as a little bit of dirt on the amp seems to "gel" sounds together a bit better.

Regarding cabs, out of the ones coming with the Helix, I prefer the two 4x12 Greenback models, but the Cali IV or Cali EXT aren't all that bad, either. I also sometimes like the 4x10 Tweed cab. Most of the times I'm using one of my own IRs or one of the RedWirez Big Pack, though (especially live).

In terms of cabs I'm running the HX Stomp into a power amp and then into 2 1x12 orange amps. So no cab patches. 

Thanks for your input.

Hi - I have a couple of overdrive pedals I'll be running into my hx stomp. Any recommendations for an amp block that would act as a good clean platform for overdrives?

Cheers 

12 minutes ago, waymda said:

The only one I've found that looks suitable is the Powerstage 700.

Suggests you have some criteria/requirements - you might want to share those if you want sensible input.

Well - the power stage 700 is probably more than powerful enough for my needs. I'd be looking to hook it up to 2 1x12's. I like running amps/preamps in my helix into the fx return of amps I've had to the point that I rarely use the real amp's preamp stage. I'm looking for stuff that's easy to carry (I have a bad hip) so anything that could sit on my pedalboard would be great but I'm not against a small unit/head that could sit on one of the 1x12s. 

Hi, do any of you have recommendations for a stereo power amp I can run my hx stomp through? The only one I've found that looks suitable is the Powerstage 700. I was thinking of running 2 separate pedalboard power amps for stereo but I think 1 single uint would be easier.

Any suggestions? 

Cheers.

1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

To split the FX Loops you need to use an INSERT cable:

1/4" TRS to dual 1/4" TS.

Use the LEFT (TIP) Send and Return to one amp, RIGHT (RING) Send and Return to the other.

You'd need two S/R Blocks, one in Path A and the other in Path B, with the mixer panned as in the attached demo preset.

 

Dual 4cm.hlx 4.29 kB · 0 downloads

Thanks but that's not the issue. The issue is simply having 2 amps attached to the helix. If we forget about the FX loop for a moment and just take a simple setup with the main output L/R of the helix running into 2 amps (one being FRFR). As soon as one of my amps is turned on (the terror stamp) it introduces a pulsing/flutter into the signal. Some sort of ground/interference issue I would guess.

Update on this one, there's definitely some sort of electric interference going on. I thought I might get hum attaching 2 amps but the fluttering sound was really unexpected. I just tried it again but without the FX loop so - guitar > HX Stomp > Left main out to terror stamp, Right main out to FRFR and I get the same thing.

But - I noticed that even when I switch the FRFR off I still get that issue so there's something going on with the electric circuit.

Is there anything I can do about this?

Hi - I run my HX stomp in 4CM into an orange terror stamp. My aim is to get a second amp (maybe another terror stamp) and run that in 4CM as well, splitting the output of the FX Send and then running 2 chains through stereo effects out to the 2 amps giving me potential for stereo setup and wet/dry set up.

I haven't yet purchased the second amp but I thought, just out of interest, I'd try hooking the Right output of the Stomp directly to a FRFR speaker I have, just to get an idea of stereo sound etc. But - when I attached the speaker to the right output of the HX Stomp it just created a fluttering sort of sound in both the terror stamp/cab and also the FRFR. At first I thought it might be the FRFR as there was no guitar sound at all coming out of it, just the fluttering sound so I tried another FRFR and got the same issue. After a bit of messing around I found that if I switched the terror stamp off the FRFR stopped fluttering and the sound of the guitar came through nice and clear.

This wasn't just a slight hum but a proper pulsing created by adding the FRFR to the right output of the HX Stomp.

Now I'm concerned this issue will be the same if I buy a second amp.

Is it a realistic expectation to be able to run 2 amps out of HX Stomp both in 4CM? I would have thought it was given there is a right/left fx loop and output from the Stomp.

Any thoughts what the fluttering was? Like I say, there was no guitar sound from the FRFR (right output) when the terror stamp was turned on, just the fluttering sound. But, when I turned off the terror stamp, the fluttering stopped and the FRFR produced the guitar sound, nice and clear.

20 hours ago, codamedia said:

 

I'm glad you found something that works for you... I just don't have the desire to put a limit a product (Helix) that has endless options when used in "full range". 

I know it's been discussed to death many times over but I've tried FRFR many times/systems and it just doesn't sit with me. Maybe at home it's ok but at practice/live you can't beat your own cabinet. It's a totally different playing experience interacting with a real cabinet. 

Anyway - the helix amps/preamps sound great through the Terror Stamp.

I've just added the Orange Terror Stamp to my board. Seriously impressed with this thing. Both as a standalone amp and as a power-amp solution for my HX Stomp. I'm not a fan of going straight to PA/FRFR so the amp to cab set up is something I've settled with for a few years now - using the preamps/amps of the HX Stomp as well as the preamp of the actual amp.

I've heard some people say the terror stamp isn't loud enough to gig with but I just don't see how (unless my band happens to be much quieter than other bands?). This thing is seriously loud. The only time I think people might struggle is getting very clean cleans using the Stamp as a "normal" amp, going through its preamp. But - using one of the helix preamps and going straight to FX return on the Stamp gives loud, clear cleans.

However - just in case I did want to go hyper-loud I have a plan. I'm going to buy a second Terror Stamp, sell my 2x12 and buy 2 1x12 cabs then run a stereo setup all powered by 2 Terror Stamps on my board. That will be incredibly loud plus I'll be able to use all the stereo helix effects etc.

Anyone else using the Stamp? I used to have the orange pedal baby which I love but (for some reason) felt I was missing a real valve growl from my set up (even though I know the helix amps are exceptional). The Stamp gives me both - a valve preamp and a clean power-stage for my helix.

The best thing is they go for £120 so my dual setup will cost me £240 which is still cheap.

(I do appreciate there are probably pedal amps out there that already do stereo out but with 2 Terror Stamps I can eq them both independently with different gain settings for some really interesting sounds). 

2 hours ago, brue58ski said:

Have you tried throwing  in the Acoustic Sim? I run it parallel with my Variax and it can help.

Well no but only because I'm running an acoustic (electro acoustic) into my PA (via my helix). I found the acoustic sim on top of an acoustic was too much. I assumed the Acoustic Sim was more for attempting to make electric guitars sound like acoustic, not improving the sound of an acoustic using piezo pickups.

But - I just tried it and while it didn't work when running entirely through the acoustic sim, I liked the top end/crisp it gave my guitar in conjunction with an IR. So I ran the acoustic sim on the split/b path but dialled in down to about 20% so all it did was enhance the acoustic/IR signal on the other path.

Worked really well actually.

I just recorded this. Excuse the random playing but hopefully should give an idea of sound. Hopefully this link will work. Any tips on improving this? This is with a 3 Sigma audio Martin acoustic IR plus a bit of compression and an EQ. 

The guitar straight into the PA on its own sounds ok but it still has that piezo sound to it (that I would describe as plastic). 

The "quack" sound is from when I apply the IR. (Any of the IRs I'm using, that is). The IR adds clarity (which I like) and gets rid of the piezo sound (which is a good thing) but introduces a "quack" sort of sound/frequency that I'm not so keen on.

I think your point about blending the IR in quite low is a good one. I'll give that go.

Cheers