poodad

Use a 1/4" Y cable to "jump" the pod go's effects send to effects receive. Place your effect send/receive block after your effects but before your amp block. Turn effects send on and remove the stomp pedal from it so that you don't accidently turn it off.

Connect the Y cable female jack to your guitar amp with a guitar cable.

Connect the pod go's main out to your FoH.

Et Viola! Your signal splits after your effects out to your amp and also continues through your amp and speaker sim blocks to FoH.

NOTE: I've been told you can do this without the Y cable by playing with the effects send/receive settings. But I haven't tried it.

If anyone form Line 6 reads these messages, please note that the current AMP OUT settings needs a third choice: "before amp block"

Line 6 knows that if knowledge of this defect becomes wide-spread some lawyer will whip up a class action lawsuit which will cost them millions of dollars.

Think that wouldn't happen over a falsely advertised input impedance? Sole just got nailed for $3.6M for advertising their treadmills with incorrect horsepower rating. Considering the impedance problem was created by putting a 1nF shunt capacitor in the analog input, it would be impossible for Line 6 to argue the advertised 1Mohm was somehow an honest mistake.

You don't need a BOSS pedal. Any pedal that is not true bypass will work to isolate your guitar signal chain from the relatively low input impedance of the go.

On 5/25/2022 at 12:30 AM, OmegaSlayer said:

Techs are under non disclosure agreement

I suggest that IF someone gets to know the issue, they keep for themselves because they put at risk the exclusivity service of the techs

Capisc'...

But you aren't under non disclosure. Tell us what was involved from your point of view.

On 5/17/2022 at 3:10 PM, voxman55 said:

Re the video:

 

Helix has a variable input impedance selector. Pod Go has a fixed impedance of 1M Ohm.  If he had Helix set to 'Auto' I'd be interested in a comparison using the other impedance setting in Helix.

 

For those less familiar, placing a buffered unit in front of Pod Go will deliver the same highs.  A buffered unit might be eg any Boss stomp pedal - the pedal has to be powered but not stomped 'on' to benefit from the buffer. The other buffered device could be something like the Line 6 G10 Relay wireless system that is a buffered device.  I use the G10 Relay, so do not have this issue, and is why similarly the Pod Go Wireless doesn't have this issue ie it's an issue ONLY when using cables.  

 

However, it is also very much down to the make, length & type of guitar cable you are using because different cables have different impedance, that can make a big difference to your tone.  I tested my Pod Go with a good quality Vox coiled cable and my Piranha cables and the tonal difference with both as compared to via the G10T or placing my Boss CS3 pedal in front of Pod Go, was negligible and nothing like the variation in this video, which is quite extreme.  

 

Now, whilst there has been a lot of posts on forums/boards/youtube vids on this issue, you need to appreciate that putting a buffered unit in front of ANY MFX unit will brighten tone and not until you hear the difference do you think anything is 'wrong'.  now, although Helix offers an impedance selector, a 1M Ohm input impedance is standard in mid-range MFX.  Even the brand new Boss GX100 is 1M Ohm, whereas it's big brother the GT1000 is 2M Ohm.  So this is not a 'fault' with Pod Go, but an additional option in Helix that is 3 x the price.  

 

I have a Vox Tonelab SE, LE and ST - and the same tone brightening occurs when using a buffered device in front of these.  I also have a BBE Sonic Stomp Maximiser, and this makes tone sound brighter/clearer too.  The same issue applies when using a guitar amp if you plug direct into an amp and then compare with a buffered device in front of it.  

So, whilst there is a tonal difference, it's because of the more sophisticated impedance options in Helix, rather than an issue with Pod Go Impedance.  And here's a further thought.  Many of the more expensive wireless devices allow you to change the settings to replicate guitar cable impedance.  Why?  Because a lot of players don't like the brighter tone, and want it to sound similar to their cabled sound.  

 

This whole thing has just got a bit out of proportion.  But whilst it's possible Line 6 might be able to do something in v1.40 firmware, I suspect only a physical mod would 'solve' the issue for those seriously troubled by it - but you never know. 

 

However, having said all this I still would have hoped that Line 6 would have said something to at least confirm Pod Go impedance definitely is 1M Ohm. The fact they haven't even done so does potentially raise a big question mark and could give some credence to (reportedly) 'techs' who say they have tested Pod Go and found the input impedance to be only a third to a half of 1M Ohm.  If that is proved to be the case then it might suggest Line 6 may have cut corners to save a few pennies.  The problem is that if Line 6 refuses to comment, customers and potential customers are left to speculate, and that's not a good thing. 

 

So Line 6, if you are looking in - please confirm what the Pod Go input impedance is.  

 

 

No, the Pod Go's input impedance has been measured independently by a couple of people (at least) including me. It is around 250K Ohms. This is far lower than the 1M Ohm stated by Line 6.

There is no need to drag the Helix into the debate - that is a red herring. One can simply turn off all the blocks on the Go and compare playing directly through the Pod Go verses playing with a buffer buffer pedal in front. The difference is striking.

Someone on the facebook Pod Go group posted a snippet of the Go's schematic clearly showing a 1nF capacitor shunting the input to ground, and a picture showing the location of the offending cap (C126 if memory serves). The post was removed within hours - Line 6 probably threatened legal action.

That cap would definitely cause the low input impedance. And no amount of firmware changes can remove that cap.

I suspect that if Line six does anything at all to address this, they'll simply add a generic high end boost in the signal path in an attempt to mask the problem.

But so far, Line 6 is ignoring the problem. They have not addressed it here even though it was brought to light in February. There's a thread on The Gear Page discussing this issue and the Line 6 employees who regularly participate on TGP have not commented despite being directly asked.

The official response is no response. There's been nothing official here, and the two Line 6 contributors active on The Gear Page have refused to comment.

That's how I do it - with the effects send/receive.

I don't see any reason you couldn't connect the Go's effects send to your effects chain, then come out of the last effects unit into a MFM Y cable. Run one side of the of the Y into your amp. Run the other back into the Go's effects in. Main out goes to mixing board.

Remove the stomp button from your effects send block so you don't inadvertently disable send/receive. 

For the life of me, I can't figure out why the AMP OUT doesn't tap the signal in from of the AMP block by default.

I have also measured the input impedance and found it to be around 205K at 1KHz.

Someone posted a clip of the the Pod Go's schematic on one of the facebook Go groups showing a 1nF cap to ground in the input section, which would explain the low impedance and tone suck. The person also showed pics of the board showing where the offending cap was (C126 if memory serves).

Unfortunately, the post was deleted shortly after it was posted. Of course, it could have been a fake, but it looked legit to me.

Two people on the gear page have opened support tickets because of this issue, The first person says Line 6 "repaired" their unit but they have no way of measuring the input impedance, so they don't know what line 6 did. The other person was told to pound sand.

This can't be fixed with a firmware update. My fear is that Line 6 will band-aid a fix in the form of adding a hidden compensating curve in the output EQ to digitally boost the attenuated high frequencies.

I really wish Line 6 would address this issue.

The default setting for amp out is to include the speaker simulation. Goofy default, but it works for what you need.

Another option would be a splitter cable.

Either way you may need to use a DI box with an isolation transformer to prevent a ground loop.

On 8/17/2021 at 1:13 PM, wpostma said:

You can get some hum and ground loop issues doing this Y cable thing.

The pod go isn't going to contribute to a ground loop because its signal ground is not connected to mains earth ground.

I suppose you could get a ground loop condition from your guitar amp and the powered speaker. In that case, I'd recommend connecting them both to the same outlet to minimize the size of the ground loop. You can also use ground loop busters, or an isolation transformer in one of the signal paths.

Use a 1/4" Y cable to jump the go's effects send to effects receive. Out of that Y connect to your guitar amp. Place the effects send/receive block just before your amp simulation black. Turn effects send on and remove the stomp button from it so that you can't accidently turn it off.

Put all of your effects before the send/receive block.

Now you have signal with no amp/speaker simulation going to your amp, and signal with amp/speaker going to the powered speaker.

Lol, you wouldn't happen to be John Paul Jones, would you?

The only thing I can think of is to use the effects send for the mandolin output. and either the amp out or main out for bass. Your mandolin presets would have the effects send turned on. The bass presets would have it turned off.

The AMP out options do seem to be the wrong things. You'd think there'd be a global option to make the AMP out tap the signal before the amp simulation block. In fact, that should probably be the default.

I guess there are three possibilities:

1. It was overlooked by the programmers. If this were the case, I think it would have been fixed by now.

2. It was an error in the circuit design. If that's the case, it can't be fixed in existing models.

3. This is an intentional misfeature put in place to keep the go from becoming too much of  a threat to the Helix business.

Old laptop bag for me as well. Nicely padded and lots of storage for cables, extra strings, tools, etc.

I find this bizarre as well. 

My solution is to use the effects send/receive block just before the amp block. I enable send/receive and remove the stomp switch (so I can't accidently turn it off) in all my presets

I use a MFM Y cable in the effects send/receive jacks to tap signal off to send to my amp and also send signal back into the go to be processed by the amp and speaker sims to feed to FOH.

Good question. Line 6 makes this needlessly complicated.

By default, the AMP OUT jack is after the speaker sim block. You can change this globally (all presets) in the settings so that AMP OUT is after the amp, but before the cab sim block. This doesn't make sense because a physical amp will have preamp, amp, and speakers. But, that's the way Line 6 engineers decided it should be.

You have multiple solutions:

1. Far and away the best is 4 cable method, but that requires an amp with effects send/receive.

2. Leave the AMP OUT tap spot at default (after speaker) and turn off the amp and speaker sim blocks. If you do this and connect at AMP out, your signal will go through all of the blocks preceding the speaker block, but will not go through any blocks after the speaker sim block. Or, connect to main out and have all the effects in the chain present.

3. Change AMP out tap spot to be post AMP block and disable the amp sim block. Your signal will go through all effects preceding the amp block, but none after the amp block. Or, connect to main and have all blocks in signal path.

4. Sneaky way: buy a MFM Y 1/4" cable. Jump the go's effects out to effects in using the two male connectors. Use the female on the Y cable to connect to the input of the guitar amp. Put the go's effects send/receive block anywhere in the chain you want (most likely before the amp block). Turn effects send/receive on and remove stomp switch so that you can't accidently turn it off.  This way you get two signals: one with no amp/speaker sim to send to the amp, and another signal WITH amp/speaker simulation to send to a FOH mixer or recording system.

Use a stereo Y cable (male/male/female) to connect the pod go's effects out to effects in. In your signal chains, put the effect send/receive before the speaker sim. Or even before the amp sim if you want.

On the female of that Y cable, plug another Y cable in that splits the stereo into two mono signals. Connect each of those to each amp.

By moving the effects send/receive in the chain, you can tap off stereo signal at any point you like.

On 4/14/2021 at 9:58 AM, voxman55 said:

If you switch the FX off, what happens to your volume?  (And shouldn't a compressor best go at the front of the chain?) 

If you turn the effect off, then you go to 0dB, which would correspond to mid pedal. 

I personally like a compressor near the end, and I always leave it on. But if you'd rather, you can use an EQ instead. The output on EQs have the same capability to have their output level connected to EXP2 and to set min and max levels.

I disconnect EXP2 from the volume pedal and connect it to the level control of last device in my chain (usually a compressor or EQ). In the settings for that device, I use the little slider triangles to set the minimum and maximum level to something like -3dB to +3dB. That way the EXP2 pedal gives me 6dB of control over my volume (all the way back, 3dB cut. All the way down, 3dB boost). 

Another way to do this is to put the send/return block in front of the amp and turn the effects send on. Connect the effects send jack to your amp.

This comes in handy if you want to use a real amp AND a PA (or other full range system). Use a 1/4" stereo Y cable (male, female, male) to jump effects out to effects in, and tap off to the guitar amp. This way you send your post effects signal to you amp and also into the amp/speaker simulators to go to the PA.