kelco

So thats what took 2.20 so long. ;)

http://www.apc.com/shop/us/en/categories/power/audio-video-solutions/av-power-conditioners-with-battery/av-power-conditioners-battery-backups/_/N-1waw8zf

LOVIN' IT, FELLAS

I actually have an arion in my pedal rig - I cant get very close to that now.

EDIT

Typo - dunno how that turned into cant.

I CAN get close to the rig minus the red ecstasy channel from bogner.

What's the latency estimate in logic pro x - preferences / audio

You should have better latency or equal - all you did was change interfaces but with a "better" cable technology.

Now one can argue better- PS/2 has better system latency than USB but it can't send over 500 mbp/s either.

Quantize, quantize everything.

FWIW, This subject broaches what I do for a living.

Feel like it's an area where I've got some knowledge/experience that can be helpful.

 

Full Thunderbolt support on PC is very new... and is subject to strict conditions.  

ie:  If you've got a Thunderbolt-2 port (running Windows), you'll never have full "PCIe via Thunderbolt" (full bandwidth) support.

If all those conditions aren't met, your Thunderbolt audio interface won't work under Windows.  

That's my point.  

 

Was also trying to suggest the logic as to why L-6 chose USB as a more "universal" solution (in this case chosen over TB)... at a slight performance cost (under the best of conditions).

Sure, but if someone wants to part extra money for the privilege and it's trivial to do, then why not?  USB won't be around forever.  Eventually everyone will have to understand a new interface.  I certainly want a dedicated port for my line6 and the TB port sits there on my mac, unused.  

TB3 does make it easier though since it shares USB protocols.  

We'll probably end up getting another Helix at some point but it wont be used as an interface there unless it really makes a particular instrument shine that wouldn't in a dedicated piece.  You never know, though.  Certain things just sound good together.

Windows recently got full "PCIe via Thunderbolt" support.

It's contingent upon several things.

• You have to be running one of the latest generation Z170 or X998 motherboard that provide Thunderbolt-3 via USB-C port
• You have to be running an up-to-date install of Win10
• Your audio interface has to have "PCIe via Thunderbolt" drivers available for Windows
• You need an approved Thunderbolt-3 (USB-C) to Thunderbolt adapter

If you have all these things in place, the audio interface can offer low latency performance on-par with PCIe units.

Right now, MOTU and UA have "PCIe via Thunderbolt" drivers actually available.  Most don't have Windows "PCIe via Thunderbolt" actually available (this will change).

 

FWIW, Ultra low latency audio interface technology isn't Line-6's forte'.

Plus, the best performing USB-2 audio interfaces are pretty close.  

ie: The RME Fireface UFX yields 4.3ms total round-trip latency at a 48-sample ASIO buffer size 44.1k.

USB is also cheaper to implement. 

I can see why L-6 chose (especially when Helix was being designed) to skip Thunderbolt.

If you've already got a top-performing audio interface, the Helix's AES and S/PDIF outputs are fantastic.

You consistently write quite a lot for my paltry one sentence quibs.  Where do you get the energy?

Anyway, yeah mainly it's the "which way does this sucker go" when trying to plug it in and it taking more than the 2 tries.

What it would give you that a USB connection doesn't? Exactly?

To be rid of that blasted connector!

Also I hear the advancements in the technology allow for lower signal latency for audio interfaces.

I would have liked a thunderbolt option- other than that I think the Helix over delivers, if anything.

I've found the Helix is super ground hum prone.  I have to make doubly sure everything is on the same circuit with it.  Which is fine, but a thing.

I think there are some quality problems introduced into the later versions of Logic. I've had 10.3 crash a couple of times too, mostly when creating controller assignments. The bug list on https://www.logicprohelp.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=42&start=35 seems pretty active a well.

I just got my dad to try logic and likes it a lot, out of everything the hardest thing is figuring out midi contoller for us. LOL

We like it a lot, though.  Should have jumped in sooner.

Interesting. Was the unit losing its bios settings then?

No but it fixed a broken ethernet in a different imac so tried the same thing.  It's a 2008 so it was probably going to happen in a few years.  It worked so much better from the 10lb of dust I blew out of it, though.

Ive done this- makes yer butt pucker alright  :P

 

BTW Harbor Freight sells the nicest (and cheapest) little suction cups for this task.

Well just wait until you have to change the cmos battery.  I did it this week, actually.

https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/iMac+Intel+21.5-Inch+EMC+2308+PRAM+Battery+Replacement/1970

And logic pro X just crashed while doing a basic thing.  So do you blame 2 diametric opposite software companies or do you blame the host they're running on?

I just wanna say chatting with you guys got me thinking and I decided to try another DAW software program.  

Maybe me and Avid don't mix.

I've had a pretty good 24 hour experience with logic pro x.  Will Helix Native work with this?

Hey, not exploding is a very desirable feature... :)

 

When I was young, my parents had a Lincoln Town Car with all the electronic controls in the steering wheel (it was the early 90s, so that was still a big deal), and I'll never forget pulling into our driveway just as the steering started smoking...

That's probably as annoying as message boards jumbling letters around after you've hit post already!

Just like with people, I've had both good and bad experiences with computers...

 

Personally, I have Windows 10 on my DAW computer (an ASUS ROG laptop, fwiw), and I can't say I've had any real problems that I can think of (other than I wish I had a bigger SSD on it).

 

I've had plenty of issues with software, though... Don't get me started on the joys of dealing with Autodesk. :angry:

I also have an ROG, and it has never blue-screened on me.  That is like saying hey, my Cadillac has never spontaneously exploded so it's very good.

Yup! But it is easier in my experience to mess up a windows machine than mac by far.

 

If you truly know what u are doing you can do great things with either!

Why don't you go into console.app or windows event viewer and stop trying to convince people that you have a good experience with computers.

Your computers crash every second.

Sure, I wonder since on die gpu's are getting better, if the latency can be made up for.

And yes, getting protools to run is like getting 2 trained cats to balance on each other.

I'm saying why not train one cat instead of 2.

Well it would be insanely cool of them to try making helix plugin run over CUDA or something.

A few people have tried reverbs and they work very well they just don't sound great.  They understood the concept just not the musical nature.  It's a perfect reverb.

edit: it had been years since I looked- looks like theres already cuda based plugins.

https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/topic/790669/dogotal-sound-processing-with-cuda-cores-/

But admit it, pathological liars are WAY more entertaining than people who only say nice things and tell the truth all the time... there's that...

 

The fact is it almost doesn't matter, because in the serious audio world, clients expect Pro Tools, so you have no choice.

Until they see something better.  All you have to do is A/B it and let them make their decision.  Like A/B between the pod and helix.

I'm just saying - it would make sense for an audio company to try this.  Will it happen?  Probably not, like most good things - the pure idea will be corrupted into a circus much like what happened over at Oculus and it'll turn into a fight about money.

 

 

Similar experience, although it's been a few years since I did a lot of work with building or managing Windows systems now (I managed a whole fleet of computers, some in-house and some rental, in the late 90s and until 2005). The registry in Windows is pure evil, but so is using the Terminal on Mac OS. 

 

 

 

 

Interesting idea, but don't you think the economies of scale would mean that most likely it wouldn't necessarily be that much better. With Mac OS and Windows 10 you have OSes that are being created for millions and millions (billions?) of installed systems around the world.

 

The number of people buying a whole brand new kind of system in 2017 would be few enough that they'd either be prohibitively expensive or there wouldn't be enough money in it to make it better than what's out there now... or of course both.

 

Btw, the Helix, with its many bug-fixes and updates, is evidence of this (even though I adore it). That said, all indications are that it will be a solidly mature product very very soon. (It already works nearly perfect for me, though.)

 

Weird, the helix has been absolutely flawless and Computer-based systems have been absolute trash to me.

And yes those OS's are designed for billions as general purpose units.  And how many people trash Internet Explorer and Safari?

One person said something, but that guy is a pathological liar so I disregarded his input.

Arnt you afraid of getting the red ring of death?  ;)

Oh no, because I don't think Avid would be stupid enough to run away from Microsoft and Apple to end up right at Microsoft again.  LOL

Now there's no escaping the taint of human imperfection, but we don't need to cake on corruption to the experience too.

Ahhhh now I see. A "console" user.... ahhahahahahaha...

Kinda like what the helix is.

All I'm saying is if someone like sony partnered with Avid to make a "console" like system that was dedicated to protools the experience would only get better.

I'm saying it is time to raise the bar.

Every studio I've ever been to has had multiple crashes on OSX while I was there.

It's not just me and I don't know why the narrative here is so aggressive with making it that way.

I thought I'd merely address the elephant in the room.  These dog-turd operating systems.