Jump to content
Dshow

So are we HD500 users second class costumers?

Recommended Posts

I don't know what you're all going on about, but the original poster seems to be concerned that Line 6 feels that we HD500 owners don't dress as well as the owners of the newer models.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IMHO...  Line 6 did not communicate this upgrade very well.   What is bugging me is when I keep hearing/reading from the experts that you should have known the upgrade path.(X before non X users) Really?  What if I don't visit the forums very often?  

 

 

If you aren't in the forums everyday, then you probably weren't running Monkey every 5 minutes checking for the update because 'its the end of the month, where is it!'. 

Nor would you be here saying "why did the X users get it and not me"

 

 

I use EDIT multiple times a week. Usually just to swap patches around, not to create or edit. 

I can't tell you the last time I had Monkey opened -- although, I did accidentally click it open a week or two ago. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

they kept the end-of-march deadline for the x (barely) , makes me pretty confident it wont be long now

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On the subject of 2nd class users if you have a 'Dream Rig', putting all your money in Line 6 gear, then you can't use the Global EQ functionality over L6 Link. I don't remember them advertising THAT before going live!

 

 

Wait, so you mean I won't be able to use the global EQ with my HD500 and DT25 connected via L6 Link?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suspect releasing the 2.6 update for the HD500x first was done for two reasons:

 

Firstly, by dividing the update into 2 batches, the ease the load on both their tech support and download servers. 

 

Secondly, by updating the HD500 last, they might cause a few of their customers who were considering getting the 500x to upgrade because they don't want to wait the couple of weeks between update times.

 

As for me, I sold my HD400 and bought a used HD500 as soon as Line 6 announced the update was coming to the HD500.

 

I am happy to wait the couple of weeks and am looking forward to adding some new amps to my device...especially the Orange one!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yes thats what it means.

 

Wait, so you mean I won't be able to use the global EQ with my HD500 and DT25 connected via L6 Link?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm happy they have added these new models and are providing them to us POD HD users. I'm willing to wait especially if they can smooth out some bugs before they get in the customers hands'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know what you're all going on about, but the original poster seems to be concerned that Line 6 feels that we HD500 owners don't dress as well as the owners of the newer models.

Thanks for clarifying - its interesting where this tread is going from a simple question. There might be some missunderstanding.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suspect releasing the 2.6 update for the HD500x first was done for two reasons:

 

Firstly, by dividing the update into 2 batches, the ease the load on both their tech support and download servers. 

 

Secondly, by updating the HD500 last, they might cause a few of their customers who were considering getting the 500x to upgrade because they don't want to wait the couple of weeks between update times.

 

As for me, I sold my HD400 and bought a used HD500 as soon as Line 6 announced the update was coming to the HD500.

 

I am happy to wait the couple of weeks and am looking forward to adding some new amps to my device...especially the Orange one!

Thanks - that's the kind of answers I was expecting ;-)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks - that's the kind of answers I was expecting ;-)

My pleasure! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suspect releasing the 2.6 update for the HD500x first was done for two reasons:

 

Firstly, by dividing the update into 2 batches, the ease the load on both their tech support and download servers. 

 

Secondly, by updating the HD500 last, they might cause a few of their customers who were considering getting the 500x to upgrade because they don't want to wait the couple of weeks between update times.

 

There's one primary reason for releasing for HD500X and HD Pro X first—their faster 400MHz SHARCs made it easier to optimize existing DSP blocks, and therefore, accommodate the Global EQ without breaking anyone's presets. HD500, HD Pro, and HD (Bean) have a slower 333MHz SHARC, which required a bit more work. Yes, we could've waited for all of them to be ready, but that'd be a lame ploy to blindly appease users of older SKUs for no real practical reason.

 

And again, this is something we've been very transparent about since we first announced 2.6 and the model packs back in January.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Code optimization has effectively zero audible impact. The two SKUs will continue to sound identical to one another.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not entirely sure what you mean. Sounds like you think Line 6 could have made the existing HD Models better in the X-series devices but chose not to. Is that what you are implying?

 

I don't think it's a question of quality of HD modeling. The X and non-X HD devices use the same modeling. I strongly doubt that the DSP optimization offered an opportunity for Line 6 to improve the overall modeling quality. What it did was provide an opportunity to fit another DSP-using feature (global EQ) into the existing capacity. There was no change in modeling, hence no chance that the non-X models have suddenly lost quality.

 

Looking at DI's use of the phrase 'without breaking anyone's presets', it occurs to me that it might be more of a challenge to implement global EQ in the non-X series without affecting existing presets. Perhaps, then, some existing presets in non-X devices that were very close to the DSP limitation might now exceed it with global EQ turned on. That would surprise me, but I think it's a more realistic interpretation of his comments than the rather cynical interpretation you have offered.

 

Do you really think Line 6 is constantly looking for ways to punish their customers, and that you've uncovered one?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK. I guess I misunderstood. Sorry for any misinterpretation.

 

Still, it sounds like you think that the end result will be a difference in sound quality, and that further optimization could be applied to the X-series that would make them sound better then the non-X series. As Digital_Igloo has stated, the sound quality is and will be the same.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Apparently the OP was right...  unlike us old timers with our plain HD500's, the "X" men really do have first class costumes...   :D

 

x-men-first-class-movie-trailer-video-be

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been reading these forums and contributing for quite a while lately, one thing is apparent, unhappy folks if Line 6 does something, unhappy folks when Line 6 doesn't do something, unhappy folks when Line 6 does something and doesn't meet all your hopes and dreams, unhappy folks no matter what line 6 does. As a City leader once said in a very small town-"b*tch, b*itch, b*itch".  Spend less time doing that, have some blankety blank patience, and practice more!!! Line 6 has been one of the most interesting, groundbreaking experiences I have ever seen outside of Tom Scholz Rockman R and D.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been reading these forums and contributing for quite a while lately, one thing is apparent, unhappy folks if Line 6 does something, unhappy folks when Line 6 doesn't do something, unhappy folks when Line 6 does something and doesn't meet all your hopes and dreams, unhappy folks no matter what line 6 does. As a City leader once said in a very small town-"b*tch, b*itch, b*itch". Spend less time doing that, have some blankety blank patience, and practice more!!! Line 6 has been one of the most interesting, groundbreaking experiences I have ever seen outside of Tom Scholz Rockman R and D.

Ahh...a voice of reason amidst the irritable masses. Quick, change your screen name, lest you be labeled an apologist L6 fanboy, lol.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I already worked out there would be no different in sound quality, from researching the Chip Line 6 decided to use for the DSP, the HD500X has an extra little bit of power in the terms of how much it can do at any one time.

 

so what this could mean for future updates, I am not saying it will, but just so those who don't really understand what the difference means in the HD500 vs the HD500X

 

some features they choose to add may need that little extra bit of power to run the new feature if one is added, this does not mean the HD500 could not use this feature it would probs mean something along the lines of you hit the dsp limit so cant run certain effect or amp combo due to the dsp not being faster enough to process all the data in time like it is now basicly, where as the HD500X has that extra bit of speed that could/may help.

 

or they could add something that would need a min of 400mhz dsp to use it so then hd500 would nt receive it, again not saying line 6 will do this.

 

I must ask will the HD500 have exactly the same global EQ and settings?

 

basicly im just using the Line 6 HD to learn about effects and modelling, so an second hand POD HD500 fits the bill to start.

with very happy with what it can do.

 

what I am hoping for is line 6 at some point will build an dual based DSP unit so they can go more in depth with the effects etc, I would deffo buy an line 6 model, because for price and features ... please please, heres to hoping :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

he's stated it a few times that it will. 

 

 

I must ask will the HD500 have exactly the same global EQ and settings?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been reading these forums and contributing for quite a while lately, one thing is apparent, unhappy folks if Line 6 does something, unhappy folks when Line 6 doesn't do something, unhappy folks when Line 6 does something and doesn't meet all your hopes and dreams, unhappy folks no matter what line 6 does. As a City leader once said in a very small town-"b*tch, b*itch, b*itch".  Spend less time doing that, have some blankety blank patience, and practice more!!! Line 6 has been one of the most interesting, groundbreaking experiences I have ever seen outside of Tom Scholz Rockman R and D.

 

As you've stated... Line 6 is dammed if they do and dammed if they don't... not a position I would want to be in.

 

The truth of the matter is that for whatever reasons, those of us here have chosen to abandon the traditional guitar playing world (i.e.: analog guitar + analog amp (tube or SS) and decided to enter the mysterious world of 1's and 0s. And in this world, some things get updated while others don't. Some hardware is supported for many years and some.. only a few. It's they way things work and like it or not.. there is nothing we can do about it.

 

So enjoy the ride while you can.. and try to spend as much time making great music with what you've got.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote

 

" he's stated it a few times that it will. "

 

 

ah ok, thanks .. to be honest i'm surprised they still support the HD500, how old is the HD500 now ? I mean when was it first released ?

 

when bought it, the chap I got it off said there will be a new update for the firmware coming out soon, which I was quite impressed to hear, like I said, I thought the HD500 was an old machine, well for the digital world at least, good to see Line 6 products have a long life span, must make ya feel the moneys gone that extra mile, if you bought and still own an HD500 from release day lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the difference between the 500 and 500x was not a "iPhone4 and iPhone 5" 

one of the parts were no longer made, so they needed to 'upgrade' the part. 

 

ultimately, they are the same unit 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2010 :)

 

 

Quote

 

" he's stated it a few times that it will. "

 

 

ah ok, thanks .. to be honest i'm surprised they still support the HD500, how old is the HD500 now ? I mean when was it first released ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's Impressive that we are getting anything at this point really IMHO...as a 500 user

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am happy to be getting the update and the complete bundle.

It was pretty well stated at the get go of this update that the X men would be first followed a couple of weeks later by the plain men..

 

It would be cool if an X man put up a video to show us plain men what we are missing.

I have bought and paid for my update thinking it was available to us but alas I could of used it on the short term market and made a few dollars

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

..."x men" already experienced a bug-fixing-new-2.61-release...

hope us ..."plain ones" will get a bug-proof update :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am fine if they give us no more features (but I won't complain if they do). 

 

I want two support items (but not 'features') to continue until the day I die --- and then another 30 years after that. 

1. Bug fixes. -- but at some point, you would think that all of the bugs will be worked out. 

2. Connectivity. -- When Windows 69 comes out, I want to still be able to connect my Pod to it.    

  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just curious! The statement was made that the only difference in the old 500 and the X is the processor. Would it not be possible to offer a cheap alternative to trade ins or buying the X by charging a small fee and having the processor in your old 500 upgraded to the new? I had my 500 for about 6 weeks before the X hit the market. Boy, was I miffed! The salesman could have told me to wait because the new model was coming out!

Anyway, I wonder what the cost would be to upgrade if possible. It seems a better alternative than keeping the old ones around and eventually not being able to use certain updated functions. I think the ones of us who have the older 500 would be a lot happier just to know we CAN upgrade if we want.

Otherwise, I guess we'll have to create the "VINTAGE" POD market so original PODs will cost collectors thousands of dollars! LOL

I have a POD 2.0! Anybody in for 50 grand! Hee-Hee!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

way cheaper to upgrade by just selling yours on craigslist and buying a 500x off craiglist with the money

*or ebay, reverb, wherever.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's not something where you just pop the old processor out and put in a new one.  From what I can tell, it requires the whole motherboard to be changed.  At that point, it's cheaper to sell it on eBay and buy an X version.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You got it all wrong.

The actual second class customers are currently beta testing the new firmware for us!

;)

Hey Paul, no one was forcing anyone to buy the pack(s), they were willing to

Buy and try, as it were for themselves. I think we all know by now nothing is gonna fly

100% trouble free right out go the gates.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A watched pot never boils kiddies. You 500 users are not second class customers...geez, a little patience goes a long way.

Human nature being what it is line 6 will never satisfy 100% of its customers.

 

Yes, I have the 500x, no, I have not bought the new amps yet. I don't even know if I will!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

2nd class? no.... more impatient? yep ;)

 

I am just glad they "will" be here! So cheers to Line 6 *woot*!!!

 

-B

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's not something where you just pop the old processor out and put in a new one.  From what I can tell, it requires the whole motherboard to be changed.  At that point, it's cheaper to sell it on eBay and buy an X version.

 

just to add to that...

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do you really think Line 6 is constantly looking for ways to punish their customers, and that you've uncovered one?

 

Well...

 

 

Yes, we could've waited for all of them to be ready, but that'd be a lame ploy to blindly appease users of older SKUs for no real practical reason.

 

If one were in the argumentative mood (which I'm not really, but the L6 forums are usually full of people who are ;)) you might put those two together and argue that L6 is punishing customers for not upgrading to the X series...

 

</troll>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think he is talking about us. Do you guys make costumes? (check the spelling in the title).

 

-Max

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If one were in the argumentative mood (which I'm not really, but the L6 forums are usually full of people who are ;)) you might put those two together and argue that L6 is punishing customers for not upgrading to the X series...

 

I might agree if there were any other reason for staggering releases other than development time and testing. There's not. We'd LOVE to have had them all ready at the same time.

 

Yes, we could've sat on HD500X and HD Pro X until the other three were done. We didn't, because we said we wouldn't since January.

 

Regardless, 2.6 and model packs for the other three aren't too far out now.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To be fair, the day Line6 announced the 500X is the day they introduced a sense of substandardness to the HD500 owners out there, intentionally or not.  It's that way with everything (it seems) these days.  You buy the latest and greatest HD television only to find out (often by the time you get it hooked up!) they have released another upgraded whiz-bang model a the same cost.  You can't help but feel cheated at some level because you spent the same money as the guy getting a better (more capable) model.  So I totally understand where the OP is coming from here and I've felt the same way, although I don't hold it against Line6 as this is a fairly normal business practice these days.

 

As for the bugs, then I'd say the same differences that caused the delay would make bugs in the X line irrelevant to the HD500 series by virtue of DSP architectural differences personally.

the flaw to your argument though is that line 6 released the 500x not because it was "new and better" but because the old dsp chips int he 500 were no longer available so literally, they couldn't make anymore.. the 500X  exists because of that. The 500x was/is exactly like the 500 except for the newer dsp which allows a little more to be added in the chain.. the newer switches, etc are just dressing.. things they figured they would address since 500 users had complained about them...there is no real "Cheating" of the customers going on at all

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just curious! The statement was made that the only difference in the old 500 and the X is the processor. Would it not be possible to offer a cheap alternative to trade ins or buying the X by charging a small fee and having the processor in your old 500 upgraded to the new? I had my 500 for about 6 weeks before the X hit the market. Boy, was I miffed! The salesman could have told me to wait because the new model was coming out!

Anyway, I wonder what the cost would be to upgrade if possible. It seems a better alternative than keeping the old ones around and eventually not being able to use certain updated functions. I think the ones of us who have the older 500 would be a lot happier just to know we CAN upgrade if we want.

Otherwise, I guess we'll have to create the "VINTAGE" POD market so original PODs will cost collectors thousands of dollars! LOL

I have a POD 2.0! Anybody in for 50 grand! Hee-Hee!

that would assume the old and new chips were electrically the same and that they used the exact same instruction set for programming. I would say both of those things are negative. IF the instruction set on the chip was the same, then firmware would essentially work on both since they wouldn't have had to change any other IC's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×