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Octo777

Another disappointed 5150 user....

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So much lulz, some great advice and sadly some pig headed arrogance in this post.

 

The thing I loved about the HD500 when it first came out (I was an early adopter and still have and use my original HD500) was that it was easy to get great tones with minimal tweaking. Not zero tweaking, but minimal.

 

That is not what has happened with the PV, for whatever reason.

I am lucky enough to have a decent amount of experience with all manner of 5150, 5150II as well as 6505 and 6505+ amps in real life though sadly I never owned one.

 

I can echo Robbie61's sentiments with all of these amps, that they were all super easy to get magical tones out of the box with no modding and minimal tweaking.

 

The PV Panama does not share these traits with the real world amps.

 

I've only just got my Stagescape PA home after it being out doing a stage production the past few weeks, so I still haven't had time to tweak with my regular set up yet.

 

I will be using some of the great advice from this post to tweak and improve, but I have limited time let alone the desire to spend time polishing the tone of a paid amp which in my opinion, should be sounding magical out of the virtual box......

 

If I don't get something usable over the next few days, I'll be deauthorizing and getting a refund.

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A can of bees, beats a flock of seagulls, any day of the week.

AMEN BROTHER!!!

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I used to hear a lot of bad tone from 5150 amps when I played in original bands. To my ears too many players I saw in the local original music scene used way to much gain and ended up sounding like a can of bees.

 

-Max

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Forgive me if I'd like to see amp models sound a little closer to the way they do when you actually try out an amp. And most "good" amps can be dialed in in just a few seconds in the real world.

 

There's a thread about this sort of thing going on on TGP right now... somebody called out the (critical, I would say) distinction that when you're trying out an amp in the real world you just have the amp and a cab in a room going straight to your ears. With a modeler you're now going through an emulated speaker and emulated microphone into some other set of speakers or your headphones and you're necessarily just not getting the same instant response.

 

An interesting experiment for this would be to see whether running the POD into a DT amp, or otherwise running POD preamp models into a poweramp and cab, makes it easier to quickly dial something in and immediately sound "good" by going back to that sort of amp into cab in the room experience.

 

(If anybody wants to buy me a DT, I'll take one for the team and do this experiment myself ;))

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I used to hear a lot of bad tone from 5150 amps when I played in original bands. To my ears too many players I saw in the local original music scene used way to much gain and ended up sounding like a can of bees.

 

-Max

I don't think it was neccessarily the amount of gain. More than likely it was them turning all the mids down and pegging the highs and lows all the way up (scooped).

Every time I hear an amp sounding thin and harsh...that's usually the culprit.

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I forgot about the dreaded scooped mids. Sounds great in the bedroom by itself and nearly disappears in the mix with a band because you attenuated the frequencies where the guitar lives.

 

Gain is harsh mistress and it is way too easy to go overboard with gain in a modern amp (vintage amps just don't have that amount of gain on tap). I find that I nearly always start with too much gain and usually don't hear it until I hear it recorded.

 

-Max

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There's a thread about this sort of thing going on on TGP right now... somebody called out the (critical, I would say) distinction that when you're trying out an amp in the real world you just have the amp and a cab in a room going straight to your ears. With a modeler you're now going through an emulated speaker and emulated microphone into some other set of speakers or your headphones and you're necessarily just not getting the same instant response.

 

An interesting experiment for this would be to see whether running the POD into a DT amp, or otherwise running POD preamp models into a poweramp and cab, makes it easier to quickly dial something in and immediately sound "good" by going back to that sort of amp into cab in the room experience.

 

(If anybody wants to buy me a DT, I'll take one for the team and do this experiment myself ;))

 

The short answer: YES. Every time I see one of these "I can't a get a good tone" threads, I shake my head and ask myself what the heck these people are doing wrong, because into a power amp and cab I never fail to get amazing tones, and quickly, out my rig. It's been tone bliss for years now. Since I got serious about my rig I've been running the HD this way forever, and have made more than a few converts. Guys who swore black and blue to me they'd "never use that digital sh*t; nothing beats a tube amp" now have pretty much my exact setup now.

right now I'm running it into a FR poweramp into 4x12 cabs, and granted, takes a bit more tweaking to get it sounding good, but really only a bit more. Crank the bias, and bias excursion, along with the PEQ low shelf boosting, and cutting around the 3khz with a narrow band, and viola! Great rock and metal tone!

 

But that said, one day I tried a few amps through the headphone jack into some decent AKG headphones, and didn't find I needed much time to find decent tones there, either. L6 Elektric sounded awesome pretty much stock as did the treadplate. Most of the high gain offerings, and the clean channel offerings sound good to me and imho don't need to be tweaked to within an inch of their lives to sound good.

WTF are people trying to get out these things? Serioulsy, I never understand the "i can't get it to sound good" threads, because it sounds GOOD. It's gotta be something psychological, because I can't phathom turning something on and it just sounding "good" and the POD doesn't.

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I'm curious, were people clamouring for a 1st gen 5150, or just 5150s in general?

 

I think its the 5150 II everyones after, this one appears to be the most popular. My personal favorite too.

Although, there's a large crowd out there that swear by the original 5150 loaded with Sylvania tubes.

Did line 6 ever clarify anywhere which one they modelled, and which tubes it had ? I'm curious now.

Been reading the 6505 and 6505+ are direct replacements to the 5150 and 5150 II, with new badges. 

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I forgot about the dreaded scooped mids. Sounds great in the bedroom by itself and nearly disappears in the mix with a band because you attenuated the frequencies where the guitar lives.

 

Gain is harsh mistress and it is way too easy to go overboard with gain in a modern amp (vintage amps just don't have that amount of gain on tap). I find that I nearly always start with too much gain and usually don't hear it until I hear it recorded.

 

-Max

 

Weird thing is when I'm playing "live" in a band...I have to have a pretty good amount of gain on my "crunch" sound and lead sound (talking about rock music). But when I sit down in my studio to record...it's a whole other situation. I go for tones with most of that gain dialed right back out again. lol

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 I own a first year 5150 half stack, also a first year Combo. They are nasty, noisy beasts that sound good one way, dimed!  EVH has never recorded with one, he's never even used one live! To this day, he has a head off stage running into a Palmer, into a H&H pwr amp out to 4x12 cabs. Today he is using this set up (using the same H&H's) with a 5150 III. I think the 5150 III would be a more welcomed addition.

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Did line 6 ever clarify anywhere which one they modelled, and which tubes it had ? I'm curious now.

 

...The original 5150 block logo.

 

The real 5150 clip sounds like multiple mics panned hard left/right with a bit of stereo reverb applied.

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I'm still experimenting with the Panama and was just wondering what tips you guys had to cut down on the noise?  I see how a lot of people are either fine with or hate the amp model, but not a lot of suggestions on how to tame the beast.  I just joined up with an 80's metal cover band and other than all the noise, that amp model is perfect!  Some things I've tried is changing the cab model to the Blackback 30 4x12, changing the mic to the 67, and running the noise suppressor at 50~55% with Decay at 0%.  Still get a ton of noise though as soon as I touch the strings.  The amp gain is at 78 (which is PLENTY on this model) and I've got the presence and treble both at 80%.  If I bring them down any more it's too dark for my setup, any thoughts?

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uliqqgaQ4Y

 

5150 content starts at 5:38

 

As ALWAYS, Glenn DeLaune makes Line6 gear sound fantastic!! Super excited to try out those patches, thank you!!! :)

 

from 6:00-6:36, give or take - on FIRE!! sounds really, really good.. Not hearing bees nest or seagull flocks. Just smokin' hot tone and some pretty rippin' thumb picking

 

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An interesting experiment for this would be to see whether running the POD into a DT amp, or otherwise running POD preamp models into a poweramp and cab, makes it easier to quickly dial something in and immediately sound "good" by going back to that sort of amp into cab in the room experience.

 

(If anybody wants to buy me a DT, I'll take one for the team and do this experiment myself ;))

 

Heck yeah! I have been slacking, way too dang busy at work - been meaning to test the new models out with my DT25..I think that is a good point - the sound of the amp, with a mic, in a room - vs the sound of just the amp - big difference.

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I have posted this a few times before. When the 5150 was released the term "can of bees" was used to describe the sound of the amp by many. I think that means that they probably modeled an original.

 

-Max

I have a first year 5150 half stack, I remember playing it for the first time and wondering how EVH came up with this amp. It sounded nothing like him. It took some experimenting with tubes to get it right. The Combo was much smoother sounding.

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I had a 5150 mkI head back in the day (was never a metal guy, was more Smashing Pumpkins kind of thing at the time). I loved that amp, went from Who-esque classic rock to meltdown and cleaned up beautifully with the volume control. Never found it too harsh, too bright, too fizzy. But, like Robbie61, I ran it through a Marshall 4x12. The first time I played one through it's own Peavey cab I got a shock. The bees! The bees! The Marshall cab really seemed to round it out and take the edge off.

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im getting an error code 8220 when trying to return the purchase of the bundle pack

does anyone know what to do ?

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I'm getting this same error trying to return the Vintage model pack (which I just bought Thursday before the promo email came out), so I can re-purchase at the sale price. I've deauthorized everything, and it won't let me return it. Just displays Error 8220, with no clue as to what that message means or what caused the error. No Customer Service during the weekend either, so I opened a service ticket online, which does not do me any good when they are not guaranteeing any action on it for 3 business days and the sale ends on the holiday.

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I just made a Panama patch that rumbles half the house (I make my tones for loud live use).

 

Trumps any other patches I've made.

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I don't trust anyone who "cranks the gain" or "puts the gain all the way" and claims to have gotten a good tone.

This, 100 times over, don't do this. It might sound ok in your bedroom playing by yourself but in a live or recording situation it just doesn't work.

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I bought the Metal Pack for the PODHD.  Tried it out for several days.  Now I'm returning it.  It was good but didn't give me anything that I needed, over what I have now.  I typically use the Angel (ENGL) Pre Amp for damn near everything, except for a few clean tones. 

 

Now the Global EQ is freaking awesome....

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I'm getting the same 8220 error when trying to return my Fully Loaded bundle purchased 5/4. I deauthorized no problem but the error comes up after that and after clicking 'Go!' to continue the return process. Went ahead and paid for a new Fully Loaded Bundle at the discounted price so I won't get told it's too late for that when they address my ticket.

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FWIW, I just got off of the phone with Line 6 customer service. I was told that they changed the return/refund process as of about 2 weeks ago and the only way to request this now is to send an e-mail to storesupportline6.com

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