POD HD + DT Series vs Stagesource Series?

[gioal]

Hi for all,

 

I have a POD HD500 and I am changing my brazilian tube amp to any other that sounds better than this one. So I want to know, what is the better choice: DT series or Stagesource series?

 

I play on stage and studio.

 

Thanks for replying

[Tboneous]

Get both. They each do great things that the other one can't

[gioal]

Ok, but if I must choose only one, what's the better choice?

[radatats]

I don't have an L series but I do love my DT.  However, they are both awesome.  What you should consider is the L series will do everything, electric, acoustic, synth tones, backing tracks etc. and do it well.  The DT is great for electric but really kind of limited for acoustic and other types of music.  If you only play electric and just want  a great amp to match up with your 500 the DT is a good choice.  If however, you want to play a mix of different styles you are better off with a FRFR solution like the L series.  My 2 cents anyways...

[Palico]

I don't have an L series but I do love my DT.  However, they are both awesome.  What you should consider is the L series will do everything, electric, acoustic, synth tones, backing tracks etc. and do it well.  The DT is great for electric but really kind of limited for acoustic and other types of music.  If you only play electric and just want  a great amp to match up with your 500 the DT is a good choice.  If however, you want to play a mix of different styles you are better off with a FRFR solution like the L series.  My 2 cents anyways...

 

+1. The DT shine IMO because of the real tubes and switable power amp section that can give you a real Class A or A/B etc... sections. For electric guitar tones it is outstanding. But I agree with radatas if you wanted to use a acoustic tones as much as electric then the FRFR solution would likely suit you better. And you can get some great tube tones with the FRFR solutions too, but I still think they are missing something when I used FRFR solutions.

[Tboneous]

If you can only get one of them then Palico is right. Guitar is supposed to be played through a guitar amp. I know a lot of people swear by their Stage Source. I just haven't been able to get electric guitar to sound convincing through them. I strictly use my L series for acoustic stuff.

[zaphodboy]

I run through an L3m. I can't compare it to a DT as I have never used one but the tones I am getting out of the L3 are awesome AND really easy to dial in. Apart from Fletcher Munson curve issues you can build your tones at high bedroom volume and be reasonably confident that only minor tweakage will be needed at the venue during sound check (maybe rolling off a little bottom end). I have been playing for (eep) 35 years and have never been happier with my sound than I am with this set up. I don't play much high gain stuff but for everything from classic rock to acoustic the L3 rocks.

 

I have heard a lot of posts on the forums about feeling detached from your sound without a 'real' guitar amp but, honestly, I have never experienced this. 

 

If you go down the Stagesource route all I would say is that I wish I had gone for the L2. The L3 is pretty heavy and INSANELY loud. Unless you're playing large venues I reckon the L2 would more than suffice.

[oehman]

I've had a DT-25 for about a year and half. Just bought a highly discounted L2 last week.

The Dt is the nicest sounding amp I've owned - and I owned & played quite a few.

But lately I've been singing in a band that does a mix of classic rock & acoustic stuff. So I'd just gone direct to the mixer and used in ear monitors.

At a show this week, I used the L2 for vocal and guitar monitor. It was really great. Vocals were warm and crisp. Guitar tones were inspiring. At home I ran the L2 in electric guitar mode and was very impressed by how much it felt like a tube amp.

 

My take:

If you are strictly an electric guitar player, I'd say get a DT.

If you sing, play electric & acoustic and want to monitor both, get the L2

[Tboneous]

At home I ran the L2 in electric guitar mode and was very impressed by how much it felt like a tube amp.

Really? I'm gonna try it again but I have always been completely uninspired by the L series for electric guitar work. To me the L series doesn't interact with the pickups like the DT does. 

 

What about it felt like a tube amp so I can focus my feelers when I fire it up in a few minutes?

[hobbes40]

I had been using JTV69/HD500/DT25 for a couple years. Recently moved to HD500/L3T and am really liking it so far. As noted above, it's very loud...I mean...VERY loud. If I didn't need it for bass guitar as well, I'd have gone with the L2T. Having that extra speaker for bass is wonderful and the form factor is great too. It's tall but the 12" square form factor and that it doesn't "look" like a guitar cabinet also go over well with my wife :)

 

Basically, you can use the guitar cab for electric guitar. You can use the L series PA speaker for guitar, bass, acoustic, vocals, keys, PA system, canned music....It's very versatile.

 

edit: it makes a real difference to have the L3T in "electric guitar" mode when using for that purpose. PA mode for bass and acoustic.

[Tboneous]

Maybe that is my issue. I have an L2M. I just tried to use it instead of my DT and it sounds HORRIBLE to my ears. The full models sound fake to me through the L2M but the Pre models sound great going through the DT. Oh well. The acoustics sound good through the L and that's why I got it in the first place. 

[Rewolf48]

Perhaps I should have been in this thread rather than starting a new one on the StageXXX forum.

 

L2T or L3T or M...

 

For those who haven't seen my thread I have JTV 69 + HD500 and a Yamaha Motif, all of which get can used in the same set. Sometimes we go all acoustic and I swap the JTV for a Yamaha APX 'cause the JTV looks wrong - as an Acoustic Band we would have 2 vocals, 2 acoustic guitars, bass and mic on Cajon.  

 

Getting rid of the secondhand plastic case PA speakers and planning on StageSource, but undecided as to which one. DT is out as it probably won't do the acoustic or the keyboard very well.

 

I think I need the T to mix a keyboard or two in - the M has L6 Link and a single input (which I assume I can use at the same time), so that covers HD500 + a single keyboard, and there is also the option of Keyboard into HD500 FX Loop which I currently use, but the T gives that bit more flexibility and ability to EQ. And it is only £70 more.

 

The question is does an L2T cover the low end well enough, or do I need the extra speaker and power of the L3T to cover the low end of the keyboard properly (and perhaps as an extra scenario the whole band including bass player being mixed in via a small mixer for acoustic sets) at the cost of extra money, size and weight?

[oehman]

Maybe just the honeymoon phase of only having the L2 for a week...

 

But I used a patch I created for Santana Smooth and cranked it through the L2 via L6 link. I had it in electric guitar mode.

Notes sustained nicely and had that 'verge of feedback' sustain that is so nice. I don't often get to play with a lot of volume and usually use IEM on stage.

 

But I agree - if I were just playing electric, and didn't use a stage monitor, I'd stick with the DT. It's almost hard to get a bad tone if you use reasonable settings.

[hobbes40]

I have come to love the L3T so much that my DT25 is up for sale. It's gathering dust so off it goes...to help fund a Helix or Fractal AX8 purchase :)

[Rewolf48]

I now have an L2t that I have used in rehearsal and studio, sensible volume in rehearsal room where it just sounded so great compared to my previous speakers, and the patches that I had spent so long getting to sound right just needed the parametric eq removing and some resonance added back in.

 

Had it really loud in the studio when recording the solo as the producer wanted the guitar to be feeding back but with low preamp gain.  Was only 12 o'clock on the speaker and 4pm on the HD master over L6 Link, and the modelled amp volume as neutral, so plenty more input available, but there is no way that I would have any hearing left if I wasn't wearing protective IEMs (don't like the weight of over the ear headphones). I would say that it probably keeps up with a 50W valve amp - certainly the 2x12 combo I used to have.

 

The spread is great - it is louder right in front of it, but it sounds exactly the same anywhere in our rehearsal room (floor monitor position).  As for the low end that I was worried about - the L2t has plenty for standard guitar - it may not quite work for a bass or 7 string but I am sure a L3 would.

 

A DT might sound a bit better, I really don't know, but for my purposes L2t has triggered a bit of GAS; I want another one... just got to sell the old speakers and I will be allowed  :)

[BucF16]

I have both and have gigged with both and I think most people in this thread have it right.

 

If you, for example, play in an Aerosmith or AC/DC tribute band, then a  DT50 is your amp.

 

If you play a little bit of everything, need realistic acoustic sounds, play several different sizes of venues, maybe use stereo effects or amps, then go the FRFR route.

 

One thing I've noticed that's made me move more towards FRFR stuff.   When using a real amp on bigger stages where I need more of my guitar through the monitors and the PA, my guitar through the monitor sounds just like the POD going direct anyway.  Your amp really only sounds better when you are standing right in front of your amp.

[BucF16]

Maybe that is my issue. I have an L2M. I just tried to use it instead of my DT and it sounds HORRIBLE to my ears. The full models sound fake to me through the L2M but the Pre models sound great going through the DT. Oh well. The acoustics sound good through the L and that's why I got it in the first place. 

Oh the irony.  I tried endlessly to make the pre-models sound good through the DT and have switched back to the full models.  Not to mention the huge volume differences between the pre's.

 

I had issues with the L2's at first but I think I've really got it figured out.  Cab resonance for hi gain stuff really needs to be dialed back if not set at zero.  Also a slight cut somewhere in the 3k's can help depending on the patch.

 

I've also used a K12 as an FRFR and that sounds a little bit more natural to me BUT since I use L3's as my PA mains I'm just fooling myself, since the direct signal goes back to an L3 for FOH.  So, I tweak with my POD hooked up to the PA and listen to the mains.

[Tboneous]

Oh the irony.  I tried endlessly to make the pre-models sound good through the DT and have switched back to the full models.  Not to mention the huge volume differences between the pre's.

 

I had issues with the L2's at first but I think I've really got it figured out.  Cab resonance for hi gain stuff really needs to be dialed back if not set at zero.  Also a slight cut somewhere in the 3k's can help depending on the patch.

 

I've also used a K12 as an FRFR and that sounds a little bit more natural to me BUT since I use L3's as my PA mains I'm just fooling myself, since the direct signal goes back to an L3 for FOH.  So, I tweak with my POD hooked up to the PA and listen to the mains.

That's great that you've got it dialed in. Are you able to save your L series settings? That is my new problem. I can't get the speaker to save to the acoustic setting..

 

I never had volume issues with the Pre's and the DT after I learned how to use it. 

 

Are you mostly a Hi gain player?

[BucF16]

Not metal hi gain but more like classic rock or prog gain levels.  Really all over the place.

 

I've had no problems saving my speaker modes...except that I frequently save them wrong because I can't see the back of the speaker!  They really need to include that in HD edit.

 

I'm pretty sure your speaker mode eq curves ARE NOT passed through, so there's a little bit of self defeating logic here if you are playing through a FOH PA in a bigger room.  (---need to double check that though--)  So those speaker modes are only effective when playing smaller rooms with no PA.

 

How do you get your sound to the PA from the L2?

[Tboneous]

 

How do you get your sound to the PA from the L2?

I mic it. I am having no luck at all with saving my L2M settings. When I try to save the acoustic mode, on recall of the patch, the acoustic mod indicator light will light of a split second and then immediately change to reference /PA. I've been asking for help on this one for a while with no joy.

 

Glad your able to make it work.

[zaphodboy]

I mic it. I am having no luck at all with saving my L2M settings. When I try to save the acoustic mode, on recall of the patch, the acoustic mod indicator light will light of a split second and then immediately change to reference /PA. I've been asking for help on this one for a while with no joy.

 

Glad your able to make it work.

I struggled with getting the Stagesource modes to save 'per patch'. I found if you try to save it through HD Edit it doesn't always save but if you save it by hitting save on the POD itself it usually does. It is a bit temperamental though!

 

Hope that helps.

[Tboneous]

I struggled with getting the Stagesource modes to save 'per patch'. I found if you try to save it through HD Edit it doesn't always save but if you save it by hitting save on the POD itself it usually does. It is a bit temperamental though!

 

Hope that helps.

Thanx. I've tried everything. I can't get the L to save anything no matter how I try to save it. It's a bummer. Why advertise this feature and then give no support on how to actually make it work?

[Rewolf48]

You have upgraded the HD firmware haven't you?  StageSource integration requires a minimum firmware level

[Tboneous]

You have upgraded the HD firmware haven't you?  StageSource integration requires a minimum firmware level

Sure thing! The speaker will go to the setting i am attempting to save. It just won't stay on that setting for more than 1/2 sec before switching back to Reference/PA.

 

Can't Figure it out and unfortunately, the Line 6 team is of little help. Actually, they haven't responded at all to my requests for help.

[Rewolf48]

I've only used studio/reference and floor monitor (to the HD500 these are the same), but I am sure others were successfully doing this.  I might give it a go over the weekend

[shredjsx]

I went from a Marshall JVM410h and 1960a cab to

HD500x and the L3t and could not be happier!!!!!

I get the scream, warmth, tone and I can run my stereo acoustic electric into my HD and the acoustic side into the L3t, plus running a Mic and my IPad for music and backing tracks...