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Set up for 4CM


sergengts
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Hi all new Line 6 user,trying to get my head round the Helix,I've pretty much been a pedal guy,this unit is daunting to say the least.Im trying to understand the placement of the send/return blocks for the 4CM

Correct me if I'm wrong

I would have all my drive type blocks then insert a send block after it,put my modulation and time based effects followed by the return block

So let's say for simplicity's sake 3 effects pre and 5 post

 

Thanks

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I think if you put a send block, followed by some modulation and time based effects, and then a return block, you will be completely skipping those effects when the send block is activated.

 

You should take a look at the 4-cable method preset located in TEMPLATES.  I was using that a lot this weekend and it's really well thought out.

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This is how I've done it - there's more than one way! Starting with a new patch use your top line in the display for pre and set the output (circle at the end of the line) to one of the sends. Next on the line below set the input (left circle) to the return that matches your send and then this is your post line and make sure the output (circle at the end of this line) is set to the main output.

 

So then (sorry if you already know this - it may help others)...

Cable 1: From your guitar to the guitar input on the Helix.

Cable 2: Your send from the Helix (you nominated 1/2 or 3/4 for the first line, so put the cable in 1 or 3) goes to the guitar input of your amp.

Cable 3: From the effects loop send of your amp put that in to return 1 or 3 on the Helix.

Cable 4: From the output (left/mono) of the Helix in to the effects loop return of your amp.

 

This saves using two blocks for send/return and is a nice way to reference everything when in the heat of a gig :)

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This is how I've done it - there's more than one way! Starting with a new patch use your top line in the display for pre and set the output (circle at the end of the line) to one of the sends. Next on the line below set the input (left circle) to the return that matches your send and then this is your post line and make sure the output (circle at the end of this line) is set to the main output.

 

So then (sorry if you already know this - it may help others)...

Cable 1: From your guitar to the guitar input on the Helix.

Cable 2: Your send from the Helix (you nominated 1/2 or 3/4 for the first line, so put the cable in 1 or 3) goes to the guitar input of your amp.

Cable 3: From the effects loop send of your amp put that in to return 1 or 3 on the Helix.

Cable 4: From the output (left/mono) of the Helix in to the effects loop return of your amp.

 

This saves using two blocks for send/return and is a nice way to reference everything when in the heat of a gig :)

Sorry I'm a complete noob,I'm currently wired up as per your description,I'm still not understanding,whether or not I need a send/return block,and if so where. Still not grasping how to have pre and post effects.maybe a diagram would help me understand,I think I'm further confused,when you say I won't need a send/ return block

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The send/return block is where your input (from send on helix) and loop out (to return on helix) of your amp goes.  The block becomes the preamp section of your favorite tube amp.

This is so confusing,saw the vid posted above,he has a send/ preamp/return /block

I'm running thru an amp,and want to use its preamp section.Is the configuration still as per the video? Not understanding the presence of a preamp block.No in depth explanation on the 4CM anywhere

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I really don't understand the TEMPLATE 4CM however. There is only one SEND/RETURN block.

 

I'll try to explain preset TEMPLATES 02A 4-Cable Method

 

Selecting the effects send/return footswitch routes your signal from Helix through the front of your amp and turns off the Helix preamp.  This way you're using your entire amp.  The signal comes back into Helix at the same send/return block so that it can use the post fx located on path 1B.  The output for this preset goes to the effects return of your amp to take advantage of your power amp.

 

Guitar -> Minotaur -> Helix fx send -> front of your amp -> your amp's preamp -> your amp's fx send -> Helix fx return -> volume pedal -> Simple Delay -> Room Reverb -> Helix 1/4" out -> your amp's fx return -> your amp's power amp -> whatever cabinet you have your amp connected to.

 

Selecting the effects send/return footswitch again turns off the effects loop and turns on the preamp in Helix.  This way you're only using the power amp section of your amplifier.

 

Guitar -> Minotaur -> Helix preamp -> volume pedal -> Simple Delay -> Room Reverb -> Helix 1/4" out -> your amp's fx return -> your amp's power amp -> whatever cab you're connected to.

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  • 1 year later...

Should the 1/4 Out (Cable 4) be INSTRUMENT LEVEL or LINE LEVEL ?

This will depend on the Input Sensitivity of your Guitar Amp's FX Loop. Try Helix's Settings both ways. You won't damage your guitar amp. It will just be louder or lower. Go with the setting that is closer to when you are using your amp directly.
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  • 3 months later...

Gear Head and the rest of the responders.....Thank you so much for your great explanation of this setting. I got here through a quick Google search of the Helix 4 cable method and you've answered basically the same question for me as the original poster had. 

 

Now....if I want to use this cable method all of the time, is there a way to set that up in Global so that it ALWAYS puts my user presets in the 4 cable method, or do I have to add the send/receive block every time I make a preset? 

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This will depend on the Input Sensitivity of your Guitar Amp's FX Loop. Try Helix's Settings both ways. You won't damage your guitar amp. It will just be louder or lower. Go with the setting that is closer to when you are using your amp directly.

According to the Quick Start guide I should be setting it to Instrument, but using the 4 cable method it sounds much louder (better?) in Line. I'll play around a bit and maybe there is a benefit to Instrument, but initially it sounded like Line was the way to go. 

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  • 4 weeks later...

I don't know why it took me so long to get around to rigging up my Helix with my tube amp! And yeah; the four cable method template messed up slightly at first, but then after I looked at the super serial template I sorted out what I needed to do. I ended up using the Helix 3/4 to do the final 'send' to the amp's fx return, instead of using the Helix  1/4" out. I suppose if I was doing two amps to get stereo the 1/4" mains would make more sense. I ended up routing a direct out from my amp back to the Helix to go through path 2B, so I make 1A > 1B > 2A all serial, with the Helix fx loop 1/2 in the middle somewhere, not sure path it's on, I think in the middle of 1B. You can split those up however you like, and in whichever way you are best likely to use having redundant or extra fx blocks that you can toggle on and off using snapshots when there are not enough footswitches to assign every effect to an individual on/off state.

 

I typically have a compressor, noise gate, barely noticeable reverb and delay, eq, timmy, etc. 'always on' or on/off based on snapshot only; then add additional drive, boost, delay and verb to individual foot switches. Ten switches mode is great! Just got there last night actually..

 

Instrument level I think for all the send and returns. And I love being able to change the amp channel with snapshots! Hard to beat amp gain; though the Helix overdrives sound really good when you dial them in for your rig.

 

I might experiment with putting some delay and reverb pedals in the remaining fx loops; have a Strymon Blue Sky and SA Nemesis that might be intriguing..

 

I also like that the master volume doesn'y have anything to do with the signal that way; just set up volume pedal blocks where needed. 

 

I imagine you could get very deep using 'transparent' IR's to place after the preamp before the poweramp to color your actual amp tone using an IR.

I messed about using EQ, high and low cut, and the global EQ; you can seriously dial in your rig with this thing. It's impressive. I've had it for quite some time, only ever did the FRFR / direct, etc.

 

Eye opener to say the least! Can't wait to go home and jam on it tonight

 

cheers!

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I really don't understand the TEMPLATE 4CM however. There is only one SEND/RETURN block.

 

they are using the left (mono) main 1/4" out of the Helix as the final send (cable #4) to the amp's fx loop return, however you could also do Helix send 3 instead of the main 1/4" out

(which removes the Helix master volume control from the equation)

 

cable #1 guitar to Helix

cable #2 Helix fx loop send 1 (1/2) to Amp's main input

cable #3 Amp fx loop send to Helix fx loop return 2 (1/2)

cable #4 Helix 1/4" left (mono) out OR Helix send 3 (3/4) -to- amp's fx loop return

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