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Sedanz

Going direct to foh and to amp?

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Hi. Just got a helix and wanted to see if anyone has used a dual amp path sending one full amp and cab sim to the foh mix and sending the other one (which is the same amp model) without a cab sim to a power amp and a 412 cab for stage volume when needed? Sometimes it's nice to use a cab for stage volume vs a frfr speaker?

 

Anyone try this?

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I haven't tried that yet with Helix, but that's what I do with my KPA, sending one signal to a 1960a cab with IR off, and the stereo outs with IR on to my DAW.

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Hi. Just got a helix and wanted to see if anyone has used a dual amp path sending one full amp and cab sim to the foh mix and sending the other one (which is the same amp model) without a cab sim to a power amp and a 412 cab for stage volume when needed? Sometimes it's nice to use a cab for stage volume vs a frfr speaker?

 

Anyone try this?

I use it in the similar way. I use only one amp and split it to two outputs. one output with cabsim to foh, the other without to the fryette powerstation amp with external 212 cab. I'm using an Engl cab and therefore I use also an Engl IR cab response. I made an A/B comparison using sennheiser 906 microphone with the engl cab and the IR-response and for me the IR-cab output is very natural sounding. 

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Exactly how I run

Just have my split after the looper before the cab

I then run into the fx loop ins of a couple of amps

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I recently played a gig using the following setup. It worked quite well but I would be interested if anyone has any opinions on perhaps a better way to do things. I ran the L6 Link output from the Helix to an L2m speaker which I used as my "FRFR" monitor on stage. I then gave the soundman an XLR feed from the analog Line Thru (All Inputs) output on the back of the L2m. The reason I used the analog out on the back of the L2m speaker was that I did not have to change any of the routing on my existing presets on the Helix. The soundman gave me my guitar back in the stage monitors as well as obviously feeding it to the FOH. I imagine having the L2m behind me and also having the vocal monitors in front of me, both outputting my guitar sound, probably resulted in some phase cancellation but it still sounded pretty good and worked fairly well. I am wondering if I would have been better off just using my L2m for monitoring my guitar and not additionally having guitar in my vocal monitor? I have been using just vocal monitors for my guitar sound in the past but thought I would try using an L2m behind me as I could not predict how good the soundman or monitoring situation would be at the gig.

 

I would love to see L6 provide more control over the "Multi" setting for the output. Ideally I would have liked to have run my electric out through the L6 Link and the XLR output, my acoustic out though the 1/4 output. My presets are set up ordinarily for sending the electric out to the XLR and the acoustic to the 1/4 outputs, direct to the mixer and out through the PA. The issue I encountered was that in order to also send out via the digital L6 Link, I had to set the output for my electric to Multi (I usually just have it set to XLR), this meant the output was also going to the 1/4 output. I ordinarily reserve the 1/4 output for the acoustic's separate feed to the mixer. Due to the Multi setting this now meant that my electric was also going out the 1/4 input reserved for the acoustic. I could have altered this by using a send block in all my presets but it would have so much easier to just globally assign the Multi output to only go to the L6 Link and XLR outputs without having it also go to the 1/4 output.

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I only use FRFR amps, so electric, acoustic and mandolin can go through the same multi output. I currently send the XLR outs into a stereo PA input for FOH. In some cases where the venue is small, I don't have any stage amp at all. In that case, my guitar and vocal come through my monitor, a JBL EON610 fed from an Aux output from the PA. That way everyone else can mix whatever part of my guitar they need in their own monitors.

 

For larger venues, I like to have an amp behind me. I currently have a Hafler Transnova p3000 power amp into a pair of 10" coaxial Eminence speakers in a Tremolux cabinet. I this case I don't include any of my guitar in the EON610 monitor as I find it distracting to have both, and I have nice stereo from that Hafler and cabinet.

 

However, I really like the sound of Helix through an EON610. And they are light, powerful, small and look reasonably good. I'm thinking about getting another to run behind me. I this case I would still run the Helix XLR outs to the PA for FOA, but use the Helix 1/4" outputs to the second channel on the EON610 monitor (along with my vocal from the PA aux out), and other the EON610 behind me. Since these are the same amp and speaker, the phase distortion will only be based on the distance between the speakers, and that shouldn't be too bad. I would adjust my monitor mix so that there's no guitar coming from the PA into my monitor, just vocal. Using a digital mixer makes it easy to save these different configurations in scenes. 

 

Ok, having thought that through, I'm even more tempted to get another EON610.

 

Anyway, its great that Helix has all these routing options. But now I find my mic input isn't work, so it looks like its going to have to go back to Line6 again.

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As per above, I have a patch set up like this:

 

A bunch of effects with the output set at 1/4"; that goes to my real-life amp.

 

After all the effects, I split off and send a modeled amp to the XLR outputs and then to my PA.

 

That allows me to bypass the modeled amp when using the REAL amp.

 

My question:  where would I put a looper in this scenario?  I'm having a brain freeze and can't figure it out.

 

Thanks in advance.

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Ok, having thought that through, I'm even more tempted to get another EON610.

 

Indeed. The JBL EON610s ROCK!! Love the two that I have.

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Can someone please show me an example of what your signal path looks like running 4cm.

One path without IR for the amp.

another with the IR for FOH??? Id be forever in your debt. Seriously 

can it not be done on the hx fx?

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Its a lot of work imo.   But I do this for a cover band I play in. 

I run all the pre "amp" effects on path 1 before the pre-amp that feeds my "amps FX return"  through the 1/4 out.

I split the the feed right before the pre amp (but after the pre FX )and send the signal down to Path 2 into another similar AMP+cab model that goes to XLR outs and my IEM mix.

you have to tweak both to taste due to the nature of running that pre into a power amp and one set of real speakers vs that amp + cab on path 2, plus you have to mirror any time based effects after the amp blocks on both paths. 

Its a lot of work and you have to use your ears and not rely on the HX edit and numbers. 

There is probably better ways to do it, but that's what I came up without even looking. 

I may research to see if I can streamline what I have going on.  But probably not after all the damn work I did for 50 songs so far. 

 

 

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I use a FRFR monitor connected to the FOH.
On the one hand I want to hear the guitar sound as it is sent to the audience, on the other hand my vocals are also on it. ( otherwise hitting the notes could  becomes relatively difficult.:-) )
I don't want an extra monitor box for vocals.
The other band members do the same. (The mixer allows 6 monitor mixes)

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