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fastnloud

come on line 6 give us frequent updates with new fx and amp/cab sims

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Im not bashing anyone. I am however laughing at those who are never satisfied with what they have,  and bought something for what is may become instead of what it is. If we get more goodies for Helix then great. I just don't think Im entitled to anything extra that isn't a bug fix at this point.

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it took years of hard work to deliver your Helix!!!

 

how would it be updating weekly fx's and amps/cabs ???

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Yep ha ha. Seems that one is out of his hands. Maybe he intends on smashing it :)

 

I do agree with the OP however on his opening statement. Id like to see this thing join the Army and be all it can be.

 

In my perfect lil world line 6 would 

 

1) add 5 more amps

2) add 5 more cabs

3) 2 more killer compression options

4) and then really concentrate on making all amps/cabs/and fx sound phenomenal. Especially the cabs. They are the weak point in Helix IMO.

do you really think cabs are the weak point in Helix???

 

I find it extremely useful to make my PODxt amps(non cab/mic) sound far away better than anything in the market!!!

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in my case if I would be expeting new sounds from Helix those would be ORIGINAL models, I would't be more excited to get a high gain with balls and compression like those original "amps" in the PODxt family; I wish line6 develop original killer tones

 

anyway we have a whole universe of possibilities with the Helix set from factory!!!

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why would anyone criticize someone for wanting more content added for a flagship product?  It's a $1500 modeller that is in competition with Kemper and Fractal.  Fractal constantly updates the Axe FX and it's quality.  It's silly to only buy the Helix for what it is now when its competitors offer many updates and that fact that Line 6 said much more is to come.

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Im not bashing anyone. I am however laughing at those who are never satisfied with what they have,  and bought something for what is may become instead of what it is. If we get more goodies for Helix then great. I just don't think Im entitled to anything extra that isn't a bug fix at this point.

Well considering I paid $1500 for it and the fact Line 6 said they are going to expand it makes me feel entitled to it.

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Line 6 fan boys are the strangest group I have ever seen.

Bashing people that ask for new amps and fx?

 

Making people feel outright stupid for asking for the amp or fx that they want?

 

Guess with all the people in here that don't want anything and bash/ insult people that do, my dream of having a Mesa mark 2c on my helix is looking pretty dismal right now.

 

I like my helix but thank god I'm not defending its lack of amp/ cab's/ fx by trolling people that do want more.

 

And W......T.......F? Old boy has a washer and is expecting it to fly out of his house? I'm not even going to ask what he is smoking.

Couldn't agree more. I made a comment about the lack of L6 Link in the Firehawk 1500. I thought it was a shame they left it out because that would have been a nice way to connect my Helix to it. I was then immediately declared an idiot by both all the fanboys and L6 staff. This is not a very nice place to be if you don't say how great everything is about Line 6. I also bought my Helix with the promise that it would be so much more after some time. But maybe it will be with the Helix like it is with Line 6 Stagesource. Take the customers money and run.. ;-)

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Well considering I paid $1500 for it and the fact Line 6 said they are going to expand it makes me feel entitled to it.

 

Exactly! LOL  :lol:

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Its not that the fan-boys would not like "more", its we have reasonable expectations for a relatively new product. Almost every MFX L6 has had has went through the same path. OS support, more FX, more models...etc. "More" will more than likely come after the initial buying surges wane a bit. As was said before, patience, sometimes its worth waiting for something done right rather than something done quick.

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Line 6 has already laid out how the updates are gonna be. First they get the editor out, squash some bugs with user's help, update the editor, squash some more bugs then release the official release version of the editor. After that, then we get the fun stuff. All we need to do is be patient guys, that's it. If you have requests, Ideascale is there so make use of it

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Line 6 has already laid out how the updates are gonna be. First they get the editor out, squash some bugs with user's help, update the editor, squash some more bugs then release the official release version of the editor. After that, then we get the fun stuff. All we need to do is be patient guys, that's it. If you have requests, Ideascale is there so make use of it

And that sounds reasonable.  I just hope it doesn't take forever.  The Helix has been out now for close to a year.  The thing that has dissapointed me the most is the SPDIF audio drop out issue I've (and others) been having with no fix yet.  I do really like the Helix though and am still glad I bought it.

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And that sounds reasonable. I just hope it doesn't take forever. The Helix has been out now for close to a year.

The theatrical unveiling was at winter NAMM last year, as I recall, but it didn't start shipping till October...really only been "in the wild" for 6 months.

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The theatrical unveiling was at winter NAMM last year, as I recall, but it didn't start shipping till October...really only been "in the wild" for 6 months.

 

Summer NAMM, I believe. At Winter NAMM last year, they were showing in a secret room and making people sign NDAs to see it.

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The waiting game is not that bad.

And it's not like my helix is going to grow legs and walk out due to lack of updates. (Make sure to keep an eye on your dishwasher tho)

 

I kinda think line 6 will do more with the helix. It's the 1st platform line 6 has done that has the potential to go head to head with the big names. So far the helix has the big name brands beat in how easy it is to use. (Matchless amp sounds killer) play with it some till we get new ones.

 

Only thing I see that could hinder the growth of the helix is line 6 reading the forum and seeing all the post of people who don't want extra's and are happy with what they have to the point trolling people who do ask for new things.

 

Gibson is a great company that tries new things too, but the Gibson fanboys shoot down any Lp that doesn't look like a 58, 59, or 1960 lespaul. I see that and the Apple fanboy mentality here in this forum. Apple (line 6) has given us the helix they want us to have and we should be on our knees praying to it every night and we are lucky just to have it.

 

Heck with that. And all the narrow minded fanboys can go straight to purgatory. I Want to see how great the helix can become!!!

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I don't think anyone wants to see them abandon updating Helix, even the fanboys. I just hope they deal with performance-related stuff like USB audio issues some people are having, the patch-change latency, and the occasional strange footswitch/level issues before they worry about adding more amps/effects/cabs.

 

I think, though, to stay competitive at the price-point they've decided on, they're going to have to start giving (yes, for free) those updates in the near future, otherwise a lot of users will dump Helix for Kemper/AFX just because of the perceived value of such frequent updates and additions.

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I don't think anyone wants to see them abandon updating Helix, even the fanboys. I just hope they deal with performance-related stuff like USB audio issues some people are having, the patch-change latency, and the occasional strange footswitch/level issues before they worry about adding more amps/effects/cabs.

 

 

 

This, I agree the bugs, performance should be the high priority. Function over features & choices. (especially since the Helix already has plenty of both)  Some people are having a hard time with the Helix not doing something that they bought it for, and it is not their fault at all.  For instance the Mac El Capitan -spelling-  issue.  Foot switch, and scribble strip bugs.  These things happen on first launching a new high profile product. 

 

Don't get me wrong though, as a soon to be Helix owner I most definitely want more choices/features added.  Do I have some arbitrary time frame for them to adhere to? No, but if they haven't updated/or announced anything in a year and a half, 2 years (as an example) then I would consider them to have abandoned it. 

 

Free, or not... Well they are arguments for both.. Both can be rather fleshed out as well, and both can make some very valid points. 

I am sort of on the fence as a result. 

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I just wouldn't buy any model/effects packs if they choose the paid-content route. I'd rather get nothing new than pay more money at this price point. At $500 (like the HD500X) I had no problem paying $100 for the fully-loaded model pack. At $1500 any new software for this thing should come straight to me for nothing.

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I just wouldn't buy any model/effects packs if they choose the paid-content route. I'd rather get nothing new than pay more money at this price point. At $500 (like the HD500X) I had no problem paying $100 for the fully-loaded model pack. At $1500 any new software for this thing should come straight to me for nothing.

 

Like I said, I understand that argument. Its not without its merit. 

I also understand the counter argument as well. This is all I was saying. 

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I just wouldn't buy any model/effects packs if they choose the paid-content route. I'd rather get nothing new than pay more money at this price point. At $500 (like the HD500X) I had no problem paying $100 for the fully-loaded model pack. At $1500 any new software for this thing should come straight to me for nothing.

 

 I see, and when you buy that new $60,000 Lexus/BMW/whatever, you expect the insurance, dings, cracked glass, oil changes, new tires and tune ups should also be free as well, cause you paid so much? LOL keep dreaming cause when you wake you will be really disappointed in the real world. There was no promise to anyone that the more you spend, the less X add-on or upgrade will cost later. Not from Line-6, or Ford, or Carrier, or any company. Lemme know how that turns out for ya, as we would all like a piece of that fantasy pie.  :lol:

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 I see, and when you buy that new $60,000 Lexus/BMW/whatever, you expect the insurance, dings, cracked glass, oil changes, new tires and tune ups should also be free as well, cause you paid so much? LOL keep dreaming cause when you wake you will be really disappointed in the real world. There was no promise to anyone that the more you spend, the less X add-on or upgrade will cost later. Not from Line-6, or Ford, or Carrier, or any company. Lemme know how that turns out for ya, as we would all like a piece of that fantasy pie.  :lol:

Nope, just like I wouldn't expect Line 6 to take care of hardware issues that come from use after the warranty has expired.This is a terrible analogy.

 

Line 6 stepped into an arena with Helix that puts them pretty much in direct competition with the Fractal/Kemper hardware. Those guys have set the model for frequent fixes, updates, and code optimization as included with the purchase price. I wouldn't even switch modelers if L6 went the paid route, because I use a lot of the cool routing stuff, I just certainly wouldn't pay for anything either.

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Nope, just like I wouldn't expect Line 6 to take care of hardware issues that come from use after the warranty has expired.This is a terrible analogy.

 

 

 

 

And yet you want all future software for nothing? You said...

 

At $1500 any new software for this thing should come straight to me for nothing.

 

 

 

Well thats your choice not to pay, but don't blame that reason because it costs too much for them to charge anything for upgrades after paying the price. Did you pay for Helix, or did you pay for Helix and future unlimited updates for nothing? And then ask yourself how you would like to be "that" developer and have any expectations for a future paycheck...

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I paid $1500 for the full capability of the hardware, which is connected to software that isn't 100% mature at this point, so anything that matures that software and adds to the capability of the hardware, in my opinion, is most definitely included in the purchase price. The "future paycheck" comes from the fact that Line 6 has a diversified product line-up at various price points and that buy increasing the value of the Helix, they will continue to sell units to new or returning buyers, as well as create happy customers who are more likely to do repeat business with the company, or be more willing to pay for and buy additions to lower-cost things like PODFarm, FireHawk, Amplifi, etc.

 

I don't really care if they ever add more amps and effects, there's more than enough in there. As long as they keep optimizing functionality for free, I'll be happy.

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Now yer changing yer tune. You were not talking bug fixes, you said "any" new software. Of course we all want bug fixes. But we all don't deserve every new piece of software for nothing from now on just because we paid the asking price, like you stated. Big difference!

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If line 6 wants to make this unit really top notch they need to offer customers more frequent updates. updating every 3-4 months with new fx and/or amp/cab sims is not doing customers any favors.I would think with yamahas help this unit should surpass anything out there.come on guys make this thing kick lollipop and take names.I would hate to see this unit take a back seat like some other line 6 products in the past have done. I love my Helix but wont wait a year to get fx I think should be added.There are tons of great ideals being submitted so please follow thru for your customers, soon. thanks

i totally agree...helix started to become the state of the art multi-fx in floorboard design...i was really, really electrified, when i saw the first announcement...but now i´ve got to say, it ´s got incredible problems with switching (none of my four! amps are switchable without problems!), i´ve got ground loops in 4cm with any amp, noise level is too high (helix is not state of the art in these concerns, as the fractal fx8 is), and there are - as fastnloud stated - some really important fx missing or not as good as they should be...the harmonizer f.e. is not ok for an fx unit, that wants to be state of the art...

 

so - really sorry to say that, cause i´ve had great expectations, i think fractal is doing a much better job here and i think i´m gonna move back again...;-( 

 

p.s.: the reason why i´m really disappointed is, because i think helix also has got some fx that definitely do sound better than some fractal fx....as the univibe f.e....

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Now yer changing yer tune. You were not talking bug fixes, you said "any" new software. Of course we all want bug fixes. But we all don't deserve every new piece of software for nothing from now on just because we paid the asking price, like you stated. Big difference!

Not really, I do expect it for nothing. I just won't pay for it if that's the chosen route, and in 5-6 years when I want to upgrade again, I'll probably look more seriously at Fractal or Kemper products because of the frequent, free content additions.

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Not really, I do expect it for nothing. 

My point exactly. Thanks for clarifying it.

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What will you do, then?

i´ll sell mine very soon and get back to fractal...just for your info...you asked for it...

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(none of my four! amps are switchable without problems!), i´ve got ground loops in 4cm with any amp, noise level is too high

 

Have you had a chance to speak with CS? They should be able to get you sussed out.

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Have you had a chance to speak with CS? They should be able to get you sussed out.

He's too busy planning his triumphant return to the Fractal forums...;)

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Have you had a chance to speak with CS? They should be able to get you sussed out.

I worked with CS and they were pretty useless when it came to the ground loop hum when using EXT Switching.  It is a major problem but I solved it by using an Ebtech hum eliminator between the Helix and Amp in when using the 4 cable method.  It was unusable with both amps I tried it with (Fender Blues Deville, Orange Rockerverb MKII 100).  The forums are full of people complaining about this obnoxious ground loop problems and CS doesn't seem to know it exists and simple thinks exchanging the unit will help. In reality others on the forum have already stated they had exchanges and the problems persisted. I know this is off topic of updates but I wanted to add my experience with the hum that rudomat called out.  Now, he can go back to Fractal but the AX8 doesn't even offer External switching so that doesn't solve the problem.  I solved the noise issues with the Helix by plugging the unit into a Ebtech HUMX and then when running 4 cable with EXT switching I put the Ebtech Hum Eliminator inline also and it is almost silent.  I love the Helix but the noise with ground loops is really bad and required spending another couple hundred on isolation devices...  

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How about the ground lift switch at the back of Helix, does it not help with eliminating ground loops when using helix for 4cm?

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Wow, much entitlement here it seems...ok, my turn:

 

I think Line 6 should give me a Helix for free, just because... After all,  I'm entitled. ;)

 

 

 

 

 

 

:P  The above is sarcasm, just in case...

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:P The above is sarcasm, just in case...

Though eerily similar to other sentiments expressed herein...

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I worked with CS and they were pretty useless when it came to the ground loop hum when using EXT Switching.  It is a major problem but I solved it by using an Ebtech hum eliminator between the Helix and Amp in when using the 4 cable method.  It was unusable with both amps I tried it with (Fender Blues Deville, Orange Rockerverb MKII 100).  The forums are full of people complaining about this obnoxious ground loop problems and CS doesn't seem to know it exists and simple thinks exchanging the unit will help. In reality others on the forum have already stated they had exchanges and the problems persisted. I know this is off topic of updates but I wanted to add my experience with the hum that rudomat called out.  Now, he can go back to Fractal but the AX8 doesn't even offer External switching so that doesn't solve the problem.  I solved the noise issues with the Helix by plugging the unit into a Ebtech HUMX and then when running 4 cable with EXT switching I put the Ebtech Hum Eliminator inline also and it is almost silent.  I love the Helix but the noise with ground loops is really bad and required spending another couple hundred on isolation devices...  

 

Well blaming the Helix for ground loops when using the 4CM and the amp switching is kind of like blaming your car for sliding on an icy road. It is possible that certain things can be done to a car that make it less likely to slide, but sometimes even if everything is done right, you'll still slide. When I used the Helix in the 4CM with my Egnater Renegade, it was quiet, even with the am switching, but ground loops are simply a fact of life when hooking up equipment. Having multiple connections going back and forth from the same two pieces of equipment is actually kind of a recipe for how to get a ground loop. Even with the Fractal FX8, which has "humbuster" jacks, I've seen a few people having issues with ground loops with certain amps and setups.

 

How about the ground lift switch at the back of Helix, does it not help with eliminating ground loops when using helix for 4cm?

 

No, the ground lift switch only affects the XLR outputs.

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Having multiple connections going back and forth from the same two pieces of equipment is actually kind of a recipe for how to get a ground loop.

 

Words of wisdom, out of the audio engineering 101 ;)

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No, the ground lift switch only affects the XLR outputs.

 

I see. Good to know, thanks for the info

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Well blaming the Helix for ground loops when using the 4CM and the amp switching is kind of like blaming your car for sliding on an icy road. It is possible that certain things can be done to a car that make it less likely to slide, but sometimes even if everything is done right, you'll still slide. When I used the Helix in the 4CM with my Egnater Renegade, it was quiet, even with the am switching, but ground loops are simply a fact of life when hooking up equipment. Having multiple connections going back and forth from the same two pieces of equipment is actually kind of a recipe for how to get a ground loop. Even with the Fractal FX8, which has "humbuster" jacks, I've seen a few people having issues with ground loops with certain amps and setups.

 

 

No, the ground lift switch only affects the XLR outputs.

Phil, you missed my point.  I wasn't blaming Line 6 but stating support wasn't useful in addressing the issue.  I had to go through the forums and find other users that had fixed the issue and do the same.  Support should say that the hum is an issue that will happen and you can fix it by using an inline hum eliminator.  Their answer was to send the unit back for a replacement item.  The replacement item was not a fix.   This is a direct quote from support, "I was talking with the product owner and neither of us have seen a hum like you're describing. I'd like to have UPS pick up this unit and we'll get it here to take a look at. Thanks for your patience."  So, my issue was with support not knowing what a ground loop was and how to address it.  I will say that when using all my analog pedals both in front of the amp and in the FX loop with a pedal switcher (Joyo PXL8) to control channel and reverb there was zero ground loop hum with the same amps in the same room  on the same outlets.  That said.. again it was supports response that was bad not the fact I had to use a ground loop isolation unit. Like I mentioned I love my Helix and I'm not here to bash on it.  :)

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i´ll sell mine very soon and get back to fractal...just for your info...you asked for it...

 

lol... have   to   resist .... 

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I'm thinking about the "Touch To Edit" feature and am wondering about something. When I touch a footswitch I can hear a slight hum coming through the headphones. I wonder if this is somehow related. I have a feeling that there's a relationship to the way touch is detected and grounding.

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