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Why in the world would someone NOT want independent preamp and power amp blocks? Someone just downvoted it. Seriously?! Some people have no imagination.

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I'm guessing it's because pre-amp and power-amp sections interact and affect one-another.

If separated (and you mix pre/power amps), the modeled response couldn't be accurate... 

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Why in the world would someone NOT want independent preamp and power amp blocks? Someone just downvoted it. Seriously?! Some people have no imagination.

ha!  Actually if I could be stuffed with the effort I would downvote 99% of the ideas... :lol:

 

not because I dont have imagination, but because Id rather put my imagination into the notes and phrasing (which the audiences will notice) and not minuscule micro-tonal differences which they will not.

just saying! :)

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I think I downvoted that idea as well some time ago. Not that it wouldn't be nice but 

 

1) It's all about priority - there are other ideas that I would like/need much more and Line 6 are really not keeping up with the incoming stream of ideas. So my approach is to pick what I like the best, not to vote for anything I'd like.

2) I think the decision to not have preamp/poweramp separated has been made for good in Helix (v1) design and I see it as extremely time-consuming to rework this. So I don't see this idea as practically realistic.

 

I'd say the first point is more about not voting it up, the second is actually what made me downvote it (I think). I guess - let's agree to disagree on this one :)

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It would be pretty simple for them to include the poweramps separately, so i have no idea why anyone would downvote such a thing. They already stripped all the preamps from the whole amps, why can't they package the other half of that amp? Makes zero sense.

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It would be pretty simple for them to include the poweramps separately, so i have no idea why anyone would downvote such a thing. They already stripped all the preamps from the whole amps, why can't they package the other half of that amp? Makes zero sense.

 

Because there are things that make MORE sense to spend the time and resources on.... i.e. Scenes, tempo bugs, bugs that turn the Helix into a brick until you re-boot, additional amps and effects.....should I go on???

 

Personally given all of the interdependencies between preamps and amps, I think this idea would literally result in a bug-fest when trying to match pre-amps to amps they've never encountered in the real world.

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Dude, it literally would take them ZERO resources. They ALREADY have the models, they just haven't released them to the public. And to think one preamp into one poweramp could create issues because "they've never seen each other in the wild" is laughable. Amp manufactures release special editions with different power sections all the time. They are two separate circuits.

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Actually it wouldn't take ZERO resources as man-hours are a resource.  Supposedly it takes up to 1 man-month to create a new amp model so I can imagine it would be very labor intensive to go back and independently model all the preamps and poweramps.

 

It is on IdeaScale though so I'd recommend going and voting for it.  I voted for it but I know there are other things that are considerably higher on the wish list.

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Actually it wouldn't take ZERO resources as man-hours are a resource. Supposedly it takes up to 1 man-month to create a new amp model so I can imagine it would be very labor intensive to go back and independently model all the preamps and poweramps.

 

It is on IdeaScale though so I'd recommend going and voting for it. I voted for it but I know there are other things that are considerably higher on the wish list.

They were initially modeled separately... That's what I'm getting at. They are completely different circuits that have zero interplay other than the pre driving the power. They HAVE to be modeled separately. That is also why we have all of the preamps.

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You might be right.  I know they modeled the preamps and the combination.  I'm not sure if they independently modeled the power amps or not.  

 

Hopefully it gets enough votes that they go after it.

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Dude, it literally would take them ZERO resources. They ALREADY have the models, they just haven't released them to the public. And to think one preamp into one poweramp could create issues because "they've never seen each other in the wild" is laughable. Amp manufactures release special editions with different power sections all the time. They are two separate circuits.

 

Two separate circuits isn't the issue, the interface between the objects is the issue.

 

Look at it this way, we know the stand alone preamps have a standard input and output interface because they can take input from and push output to the signal chain in the Helix.  We know the preamp/amp combos have an output interface to the signal chain, but they depend upon the preamp input from the signal chain which is then linked direclty into to the amp through some proprietary mechanism when used in this manner.

 

So clearly the power amp portion of the amp has no direct input interface to the signal chain on it's own...one has to be built.  And if it's going to be outfitted with it's own input interface, that interface has to be prepared to take the output from any object placed directly in front of it in the signal chain whether it's a preamp or not. And all of those amp only objects are different from the preamp/amp objects and those all have to be tested with all variations of possible inputs through the signal chain to ensure it's bug-free.

 

You still think it's ZERO resources?  Just because L6 can make it LOOK simple, doesn't mean it IS simple.

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DunedinDragon could well be right about this being no minor change. One thing that might be a bit simpler is to allow a virtual send/return in between the preamp and amp such that although you would not be able to mix & match different preamps and amps, you would at least be able to insert effects in between the preamp and amp like the send/return loop on a guitar amplifier. I suppose even that change might involve quite a bit of coding though.

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You might be right.  I know they modeled the preamps and the combination.  I'm not sure if they independently modeled the power amps or not. 

 

this is probably more the case than not....

 

I would like to see them one day get a similar thing as bias and be able to hot rod the amps by tube changes and stuff... but I love the tone I get now so that would just be a little more icing on the cake.

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I think it's a pretty good idea, and I certainly wouldn't down vote it. However, I'd rather see them invest their time in more amps, right now.

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I'd personally settle for some models of classic and new rack tube power amps. Those have definite inputs, outputs, control knobs, and voicing switches.

 

I put an idea up on Ideascale a while back for rack preamp and power amp models.

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