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Snapshots - Comand Center and Controller questions


FarleyUK
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So, snapshots.... brilliant idea, but I've encountered a couple of issues. If anyone can help me on these, I'd really appreciate it!

 

1. My snapshot 1 has a delay block that has the time param controlled by EXP2. However, in snapshot 2, I want the delay time to be locked to a specific time; doesn't look like this is possible.

 

2. I use MIDI to connect to my JVM410HJS and change channels etc. Previously I used Program Changes but was advised to use the CC messages in Command Center (as the PC messages are not stored uniquely across setlists - so any PC messages on 01A of setlist 3 will be the same for 01A of setlist 4 etc.). However, the CC messages in Command Center on Snapshots will not let me change the CC# between snapshots - only the value.

 

Does anyone know how to sort these issues?

Thanks all.

 

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What exactly are you trying to do with the JVM410HJS? Are you trying to recall presets on it or simply change channels? Looking at the manual for it, it looks like the head can store 128 presets, and those are recalled via PC messages. You can have the Helix send out a different PC message as an Instant Command for each snapshot in a preset in the Command Center - that seems like it might be the easiest thing to do. It also looks like you have the option of selecting a different channel on the amp head by sending a specific CC with a certain value. You can also set that up that in the Command Center, although, that might be a little messier.

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What exactly are you trying to do with the JVM410HJS? Are you trying to recall presets on it or simply change channels? Looking at the manual for it, it looks like the head can store 128 presets, and those are recalled via PC messages. You can have the Helix send out a different PC message as an Instant Command for each snapshot in a preset in the Command Center - that seems like it might be the easiest thing to do. It also looks like you have the option of selecting a different channel on the amp head by sending a specific CC with a certain value. You can also set that up that in the Command Center, although, that might be a little messier.

 

Hi mate,

 

OK, so as an example, I have a full patch on the Helix that contains everything I would need. I have 4 'situations' that I would like to create as snapshots:

 

1. Main rhythm (includes the use of EXP2 to change the TIME on the delay block, every other effect block is bypassed)

2. Main solo (kicks in distortion block, delay set at 380ms)

3. Octaver solo (kicks in distortion block, delay set at 380ms, engages octave block)

4. Phaser solo ((kicks in distortion block, delay set at 380ms, engages phaser block)

 

For 1, I use the OD1 channel on the ORANGE gain stage, FX Loop engaged, Master Volume 1, Gate Engaged. For 2, 3 and 4 I use the OD2 channel on the GREEN gain stage, FX Loop engaged, Master Volume 2, Gate engaged. These were all going to be 4 snapshots within 1 patch.

 

I have seen the CC command values in the manual for the amp - but when I set these in the instant settings on Command Center within the Helix, nothing happens. Using Program Changes DOES work, but I need to use multiple setlists so - due to the MIDI PC settings not being setlist-dependant - I need to use CC messages instead ideally.

 

Does that make sense?

 

To go into more detail, within Command Center, for snapshot 1 I set the MIDI CC to the correct channel, the CC Number to 18 and the value to 1 - which, according to the manual of the amp, should be OD1, ORANGE gain stage. But nothing happens!

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Hi mate,

 

OK, so as an example, I have a full patch on the Helix that contains everything I would need. I have 4 'situations' that I would like to create as snapshots:

 

1. Main rhythm (includes the use of EXP2 to change the TIME on the delay block, every other effect block is bypassed)

2. Main solo (kicks in distortion block, delay set at 380ms)

3. Octaver solo (kicks in distortion block, delay set at 380ms, engages octave block)

4. Phaser solo ((kicks in distortion block, delay set at 380ms, engages phaser block)

 

For 1, I use the OD1 channel on the ORANGE gain stage, FX Loop engaged, Master Volume 1, Gate Engaged. For 2, 3 and 4 I use the OD2 channel on the GREEN gain stage, FX Loop engaged, Master Volume 2, Gate engaged. These were all going to be 4 snapshots within 1 patch.

 

I have seen the CC command values in the manual for the amp - but when I set these in the instant settings on Command Center within the Helix, nothing happens. Using Program Changes DOES work, but I need to use multiple setlists so - due to the MIDI PC settings not being setlist-dependant - I need to use CC messages instead ideally.

 

Does that make sense?

 

To go into more detail, within Command Center, for snapshot 1 I set the MIDI CC to the correct channel, the CC Number to 18 and the value to 1 - which, according to the manual of the amp, should be OD1, ORANGE gain stage. But nothing happens!

 

Was the amp responding to CC messages before? Doing a quick Google search in regards to MIDI CC and these amps, it seems there was an issue with early ones not responding the MIDI CC when there were multiple messages being sent.. A quick test you could do is assigning the MIDI CC to a footswitch on the Helix in Stomp Mode and just sending that message to see if the amp responds.

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Was the amp responding to CC messages before? Doing a quick Google search in regards to MIDI CC and these amps, it seems there was an issue with early ones not responding the MIDI CC when there were multiple messages being sent.. A quick test you could do is assigning the MIDI CC to a footswitch on the Helix in Stomp Mode and just sending that message to see if the amp responds.

 

Just assigned the same MIDI message - MIDI CC 18, value 1 - to a footswitch, and that worked. The amp changed to the OD1 ORANGE channel. But nothing happens when using the same setting for the INSTANT part in Command Center.

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Just assigned the same MIDI message - MIDI CC 18, value 1 - to a footswitch, and that worked. The amp changed to the OD1 ORANGE channel. But nothing happens when using the same setting for the INSTANT part in Command Center.

 

Well, like I said before, it sounds like you may be running into what's described here about the amp not responding when receiving multiple MIDI messages at once... You could run a MIDI sniffer on the Helix to make sure it's actually sending the correct MIDI CC messages when changing snapshots, I suppose.

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Well, like I said before, it sounds like you may be running into what's described here about the amp not responding when receiving multiple MIDI messages at once... You could run a MIDI sniffer on the Helix to make sure it's actually sending the correct MIDI CC messages when changing snapshots, I suppose.

 

Just checked, and I can see the Helix is sending MIDI messages even when only the INSTANT switches are enabled. Have emailed Marshall.

 

Annoying I can't use the snapshots as I'd like to....! Or can i use PC messages against snapshots?

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So, snapshots.... brilliant idea, but I've encountered a couple of issues. If anyone can help me on these, I'd really appreciate it!

 

1. My snapshot 1 has a delay block that has the time param controlled by EXP2. However, in snapshot 2, I want the delay time to be locked to a specific time; doesn't look like this is possible.

 

2. I use MIDI to connect to my JVM410HJS and change channels etc. Previously I used Program Changes but was advised to use the CC messages in Command Center (as the PC messages are not stored uniquely across setlists - so any PC messages on 01A of setlist 3 will be the same for 01A of setlist 4 etc.). However, the CC messages in Command Center on Snapshots will not let me change the CC# between snapshots - only the value.

 

Does anyone know how to sort these issues?

Thanks all.

 

 

1. It is possible. Normally, any parameter assigned to a controller (including the snapshots controller) will update per snapshot. The exception is any parameter assigned to EXP 1/2/3, where people typically wouldn't want snapshots updating their wahs and volumes. However, if you set Global Settings > EXP Pedals > EXP 1 (or 2 or 3) Pedal Position to "Per Snapshot," Helix will do what you want. By default, this is set to "Per Preset," which is why snapshots aren't currently updating your values.

 

2. Messages assigned to footswitches are for realtime control, not per-snapshot transmission. Snapshots only transmit the following data from the Command Center:

  • The value of any Instant MIDI CC, Bank/Prog, MMC, and CV Out messages
  • The state (dim value or lit value) of any CC Toggle or CV Toggle messages as-
    signed to footswitches
  • The state (dim or lit ) of any Ext Amp messages assigned to footswitches
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Cheers DI - so am I right in thinking I could use a footswitch in stomp mode to transmit a PC message via Command Center? Does it work by setting the amp for each 'footswitch', then adjusting the instant Program/Bank details in Command Center?

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Cheers DI - so am I right in thinking I could use a footswitch in stomp mode to transmit a PC message via Command Center? Does it work by setting the amp for each 'footswitch', then adjusting the instant Program/Bank details in Command Center?

 

If you want to press the footswitch each time, yes, Helix has always been able to do this. If you want a snapshot, however, to transmit a specific PC or CC value, it must be an Instant command.

 

You can also create a CC toggle message on a footswitch, assign the min and max values as desired, and the snapshot will send either one, depending on whether the switch is lit or not. So the STATE of the switch determines if and what value is sent.

 

Note that the Command Center will only transmit a CC value if it's different. Helix won't spit out a new value if it's the same. Likewise, if snapshot 1 and snapshot 2 both have the same CC toggle footswitch dim, and you switch from snapshot 1 to snapshot 2, no message is sent because the value is the same. However, if snapshot 1's CC toggle footswitch is dim and snapshot 2's is lit, switching from snapshot 1 to snapshot 2 will send the lit value.

 

Never mind, just use the instant commands with snapshots. They're way easier to grok.

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If you want to press the footswitch each time, yes, Helix has always been able to do this. If you want a snapshot, however, to transmit a specific PC or CC value, it must be an Instant command.

 

You can also create a CC toggle message on a footswitch, assign the min and max values as desired, and the snapshot will send either one, depending on whether the switch is lit or not. So the STATE of the switch determines if and what value is sent.

 

Note that the Command Center will only transmit a CC value if it's different. Helix won't spit out a new value if it's the same. Likewise, if snapshot 1 and snapshot 2 both have the same CC toggle footswitch dim, and you switch from snapshot 1 to snapshot 2, no message is sent because the value is the same. However, if snapshot 1's CC toggle footswitch is dim and snapshot 2's is lit, switching from snapshot 1 to snapshot 2 will send the lit value.

 

Never mind, just use the instant commands with snapshots. They're way easier to grok.

 

Just an update - I *think* I managed to get it working last night by using the Bank / Program change MIDI command in Command Center!

 

I have no idea how I managed to select the correct combo of things in the amp, but it seems to work.... fingers crossed.

 

Thanks for your help :)

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