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Helix Global Cab Sim


roscoe5
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The Point
http://line6.ideascale.com/a/dtd/Helix-Output-Assignable-Global-Cab-Sim-Block-s/831111-23508?submitted=1

Create an output-assignable Helix Global Cab Sim block, similar to Global Eq, so that a single (or two parallel) IR or HX Cab blocks could be used on all patches as an option to assigning cabs on each preset.

 

Optionally, having the ability to define, adjust, and maintain say 8 Global HX Cabs and / or IR's, then be able to select Global 1-8 in the cab or IR blocks in the presets could address the need as well.

Users without an FRFR setup could easily select an HX Cab or IR similar to their traditional rig, or IR their own rig, and have the same sounds to FOH as they do on stage Globally.

Instead of users modifying their rig for Helix, they could modify Helix globally for their rig. My Range, My Response (MRMR) instead of FRFR.

You can currently accomplish this at a preset level, but I and other users may have hundreds of presets.

I use a traditional guitar tube amp (power amp in) and guitar cab with Helix, and also a bass amp (effects return) and traditional cab with Helix. I have IR'd both of them with their respective poweramps and cabs to allow me to split the signal XLR with cab IR to FOH and 1/4" no cab to guitar or bass power amp. Using the IR's created from my stage rigs allows me to have the same sound to FOH as I do on stage. I currently have to manage this at the preset level, and I am getting close to 100 personal presets.



Additional Reasoning and Babble

I know there have been requests for Global Cab on/off, but with multiple Cab / IR settings on multiple patches (levels, cuts, etc.) I'm not sure that the results would be as good or as desirable as we might think.

I think the expansive variety or HX Cabs and IR's are great for recording and experimenting. But for practical live use with a traditional guitar or bass rig and not an FRFR rig, Helix into the power section of my L6 SV HD100 amp and Recto 212 V30 cab, or effects return of my Mesa M9 bass amp & PH 2x12 cab, with no cab / IR models.  Then place IR's I made of those rigs into a split path to XLR / FOH. It really helps with consistency across patches in the live mix as well.

However, I do get in situations where I cannot use an amp and would like to just turn on a Global Cab Sim (GCS) without maintaining 2 sets of patches. To me this would be a single Global IR or HX Cab block, or maybe two blocks in parallel since great sounds are achieved this way. The GCS could be assigned to XLR, 1/4", Multi, etc. I would probably need 2-4 presets for this as I play guitar, bass, and acoustic guitar / double bass on different gigs.

Out of all of the IR and HX Cab trials, frustrations, and time/effort consumption, I took a step back and asked myself what was I really trying to achieve for live Helix use. I think I am starting to become a bit jaded on the whole HX Cab vs IR implementation, and potential FRFR path.

Different Helix amps through the same cab gives me plenty of tonal options without introducing the HX cab / IR variable for every single patch. I am perfectly happy with all Helix amps and effects running through the same physical guitar or bass cab for live use, and really am no longer feeling compelled to incorporate different HX Cabs and IR's for all of my live patches.

Settling on a singe physical cab and corresponding IR and/ or HX Cab would remove that variable and save me a lot of time and tweaking. It would also make the setup and management of patches a little easier too.

For me, I would set the Global Cab Sim up to sound most like my stage rigs for gigs that I cannot use amps (casinos, restaurants, etc.), or just to get my amp sound to FOH without mics, DI, etc. I have IR's I made of my stage rigs that would work really well for me, but others may just want to pick the HX Cabs or 3rd party IRs that are closest to theirs.

For instance, my L6SV_R212_oa2D57.wav IR of my Line 6 Spider Valve MKII HD100 head and Mesa Recto 212 rig that I use live sounds just like the live amp mic'd and recorded. It sounds great with all Helix amps, and is a great FOH cab sim signal of my stage rig. I can actually create patches with it in headphones at night while I'm in the creative zone and know that they will sound great on my live rig. I would like to be able to globally adjust it and turn it on and off, like the Global EQ.

Now what I might do to make the cab even more versatile is take the Mesa Road King route and put one Black Shadow C90 in it. IR both the V30 & C90, maybe with a couple of different mics, mix them into a single IR, and get even closer to amp in room or stage sound. But I digress...

As has been stated before, the majority of the audience likely does not really notice the difference in cabs from patch to patch in a mix, nor do they likely care. They didn't complain when I was playing a whole show through the same amp and cab before Helix...at least now they and I can have different amps with Helix ;)

I do currently split the path on all of my patches and send one to 1/4" no cab and one to XLR with cab with the same IR on all of them to simulate a global cab sim. I am starting to get in the neighborhood of 100+ patches, so an update or replacement to that block is a pain. It also makes auditioning different global cabs / IR's difficult too.

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Interesting idea, voted, but unlike the global EQ, a cab IR doesn't typically come last in the chain, to I'm not sure exactly how that'd work. To put it differently, suppose you had 128 global IRs, and could choose which one to use, anywhere in the chain you want, more than one if DSP usage works out.

 

And that's what we have today :)

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Good point. I could reserve a group of IR's in the Helix IR list (last 4-8 or so) for Global IR's of my gear for my live patches XLR / FOH. I could swap those out if I change rigs or develop better IRs or IR mixes of my rig. The patches would update since Helix only respects the IR number, not the filename (maybe the first benefit I've seen to this feature). A global enable / disable could be just moving the IR's and leaving an IR empty slot.

 

Could be a good workaround. Let me ponder that...

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The only way i could see this working and being user friendly is if Helix had a lock function like the Kemper has. For example on the kemper you can lock any fx so when you change preset/profile whatever you have locked will stay in place regardless of the preset chosen until you push unlock

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The only way i could see this working and being user friendly is if Helix had a lock function like the Kemper has. For example on the kemper you can lock any fx so when you change preset/profile whatever you have locked will stay in place regardless of the preset chosen until you push unlock

 

This is probably one of the only things I miss from when I sold my Kemper. Being able to have your favorite cab locked and then see how all your presets sound with it was cool. 

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What I had in mind was the option to just have a single or dual parallel cabs and / or IR blocks assigned globally to the XLR outs rather than configuring and managing cabs on each patch.

 

Placing a cab or IR on a patch could be a local override to the global cab.

 

Maybe the Kemper Locked Block idea could handle it.

 

Id be happy to reword the idea to something more beneficial...or we can let it die on the vine if no one else wants it.

 

The idea of reserving a few IR slots for global cabs and configuring live patches to use them is growing on me.

 

IR Slot 1: Global guitar live patches

IR Slot 2: Global bass live patches

 

I could clear out the IR slots for a Global "off" and copy the IR'S back (say from adjacent slots 3 & 4) for Global "on".

 

I could handle high and low cut and other adjustments with Global Eq.

 

Doesn't really help those wanting to use Helix Cabs globally, but it may work for me. I will try it soon.

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The only way i could see this working and being user friendly is if Helix had a lock function like the Kemper has. For example on the kemper you can lock any fx so when you change preset/profile whatever you have locked will stay in place regardless of the preset chosen until you push unlock

 

I think this is the most plausible implementation as it covers a LOT of ground and options.   

 

The only other option I could see but no idea if possible is a few "global" blocks.   In this scenario you could put a cab into "Global Block 1" with all the parameters you want to use.   Then you would have the ability to place this global block anywhere in each preset.   While similar to just adding a Cab Block to a preset, the difference is it's already set up with the mic, level, eq etc.. you want to use.    This would have the advantage of being at a gig and maybe you need to make an overall adjustment, maybe even changing the cab...   you would just have to do it once and all of the presets that point to it would be covered.

 

Just spit-ball'n here.

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Roscoe your work around for using IRs as a Global Cab is very good!
 

Yeah . basically you could have 100 Helix presets all set up with an IR block set to IR1.

All you have to do is just reload a new IR into Helix and you have a new global cab

 

To do this with Helix Cabs Line 6 would need to have an option in the HX cab block that was "Global Cab 1".. there would then be another page (perhaps in the system settings) where you selected and set up your Global Cab.  Any preset that had a Helix cab set to Global Cab1 would use those settings.

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