How to use 1/4" and XLR outs at the same time

[ChristThePhone]

Hey folks,

I'm new to the Helix world and need some help getting the signal routing setup. What I want is a stereo signal incl. cab simulation coming out at the XLR outs and at the same time get the same signal without cab simulation coming out of the 1/4" jacks to go to my stage power amp + 4x12 cabinet. I want to be able to control the stage signal volume with the Helix' expression pedal. So far the only thing I found is to use the FX sends. Is there no way to use the 1/4" outputs this way ? If yes, how ?

[PeterHamm]

easier to use an FX send (right before the cabinet - and no, you won't have any post cab FX in this scenario) if you've got it.

But this kind of setup is SUPER problematic.

If you tweak for the stage, it could sound harsh in the house and vice versa.

[Digital_Igloo]

Hey folks,

I'm new to the Helix world and need some help getting the signal routing setup. What I want is a stereo signal incl. cab simulation coming out at the XLR outs and at the same time get the same signal without cab simulation coming out of the 1/4" jacks to go to my stage power amp + 4x12 cabinet. I want to be able to control the stage signal volume with the Helix' expression pedal. So far the only thing I found is to use the FX sends. Is there no way to use the 1/4" outputs this way ? If yes, how ?

You could also do this:

1. Add a gain block between your amp and cab. Press ACTION and move it down to path 1B.
2. Select the Merge block, press ACTION and move it down to create a duplicate Output 1B block.
3. Set Output 1A to XLR and Output 1B to 1/4".

Lots of flexibility here, but Peter may be right. You're now tweaking two discrete tones instead of one. If you trust the FOH guy with your house tone, I say go for it.

[ChristThePhone]

Ok, thanks for the help.

[musiclover7]

I wish that we could have a secondary output on with a separate volume control nob on a single output path. I have both my mic and my guitar heading into my helix. I send my guitar out the quarter inch to my amp. I send my mic out the XLR to the PA... but I would love to send my guitar out that XLR as well, at maybe 10-20% strength. My patch is too complex for me to create another path for this purpose. I am out of paths, and out of stomps. I know, wishful thinking.

[vmoncebaiz]

If you add a small patch cable from Send 1 to Return 1 on the Helix you can then do the following.

 

Place the Send 1 Block just before your cab.  Set the input of Path 2 on the bottom to be Return 1. Set Path 1 Output to be XLR, and set Path 2's output to be 1/4 inch. Now anything on the top path will go through the cabinet model to XLRs.  You can add post reverb and delay after the Send 1 Block

 

Anything before the Send 1 block and anything you place on the bottom path will go to 1/4 out (separate delay and verb for stage volume FX is you want them), presumably to your power amp on stage. Add a volume pedal on the lower path to control only the stage volume with the expression pedal.

 

If your patch gets more complicated like musiclover7 mentioned you can still use the send and return blocks to patch around things instead of assigning path 2's input to be a return. They can also be used as separate output blocks themselves that can be placed anywhere in your chain.

 

Most of the time people will agree its easier to run either full FR/FR to the front of house, or do the Helix plus power amp (or full amp).  But if mixing it together works best for you do it.  Most people might also reccomend using pre-amp only models to the power amp. I however like the full amp models to a physical power amp better. Try both and stick with what you like (although using a pre model to power amp and a full model to cab to front of house does add more things to tweak and balance) Whatever floats boats ya know.

[shatters]

I had this same question a couple months ago when I purchased this, and this is what I figured out by myself, from just jumping in and editing with the PC editor.

Here is how I have been working on this, as I don't have a nice FRFR for my stage yet.

 

So I have a Fender 65 deluxe reissue (No Effects loop) So I go into guitar input from Helix 1/4 out, and have been using the FDR for years and have my pedals set for distinct sound of our recorded songs, so my 1st goal was to match my old pedalboard presets I actually used a Screamer so it was a good test, to the Helix, I was able to match my old sound!!! Well very close! Hard to match the Suhr riot. I opted to make the Helix work without external pedals.

I was very surprised to see and hear that I could use a Deluxe Preamp into my AMP!@#@@$! it worked and I have had a lot of compliments on the sound. It added something I just can't explain, it was good! I tried it preamp on and off, and when I had the volume levels correct I just liked the preamp on. 

 

Here you see the 2 outputs 1/4 out to guitar amp (In Global settings I have this set to Instrument) Notice preamp before 1/4 split and IR and Cab going out to XLR, I also have a EQ before XLR to help get it close to what I want from My studio/Live Sound system 12" speakers (What we use live when we bring our own sound system).

I also have the Main Volume knob on Helix pedal in control of 1/4 out only, that way I can change volume level quickly without going back to my amp. The XLR out Global is set to Mic.

FYI. The IR is on because I found a IR that I like that sounds very close to my amp sound, where the Cab was a little to dark, but I haven't removed cab yet, as I keep testing.

 

How I test is I play my Amp turn it down and then play through House system, and I work on matching the sound, Keeping in mind that of course the AMP has it own Cabinet characteristics and if it was mic'ed the House would sound like my AMP mic'ed, I have mic'ed and recorded my amp so I personally know the sound I'm looking for.

 

My goal also on this setup was when I do get a FRFR I don't have that much to change.

 

The other option is using the sends, but it didn't let me have the volume control on the top of Helix (That I know of), that I can use my toe to turn it up or down (Global Volume controls 1/4 out only), and also when I changed that volume the house does not get a change, driving a sound man crazy! (I am a sound man too)

 

A thing I have also noticed on some presets I have downloaded was that people didn't turn down the Merge Mixer on A Level, Some times that is cool sometimes not... So pay attention to that.

 

I have also found some Pre Amps do not work good with this setup

The Plexi did!!!  Probably more will just haven't got there yet.

The thing I did here was have the House/XLR out has a IR of a full 4x12 cab, so when Live they hear what I want them to hear, yet I know I don't have that on stage with my AMP, but I made my AMP sound great with the preamp so I was happy. And look forward to having a FRFR later. I even have used this on stage where they miked my amp and it was good! so I'm happy!

 

Loving the Helix!