benifin Posted September 11, 2016 Share Posted September 11, 2016 Hi all With the current FW 2.0.1 :- => is there an option when using 3rd party IR's to have " no mic " selected ? or => can you only change from one Mic type to another Mic type ? Thanks, Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kensington Posted September 11, 2016 Share Posted September 11, 2016 Not sure what you mean.An IR is a capture of a certain mic or combi of several mikes.So in order to choose "no mic", you just bypass the block. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdmayfield Posted September 11, 2016 Share Posted September 11, 2016 Time for my favorite analogy... Can you create an IR of a cab without a microphone = Can you take a photograph without using a camera? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocco_Crocco Posted September 11, 2016 Share Posted September 11, 2016 Hi all With the current FW 2.0.1 :- => is there an option when using 3rd party IR's to have " no mic " selected ? or => can you only change from one Mic type to another Mic type ? Thanks, Ben no to both questions. But many IR companies have separate IR's featuring the same speakers/cab but with different mics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted September 11, 2016 Share Posted September 11, 2016 Time for my favorite analogy... Can you create an IR of a cab without a microphone = Can you take a photograph without using a camera? Brilliant. Simply brilliant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roscoe5 Posted September 11, 2016 Share Posted September 11, 2016 Personally, I think IRs with really flat response condenser mics are the closest thing to "no mic" and experiment with distances. A Neumann U87 comes to mind first. But there may be better ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talonmm Posted September 12, 2016 Share Posted September 12, 2016 Time for my favorite analogy... Can you create an IR of a cab without a microphone = Can you take a photograph without using a camera? No. But perhaps the op meant they wanted the sound of a cab, not the sound of a cab being mic'd up So while you can't take a photograph without using a camera, the better question is can you listen to a cab without it having a microphone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted September 12, 2016 Share Posted September 12, 2016 So while you can't take a photograph without using a camera, the better question is can you listen to a cab without it having a microphone? As long as you are physically in its presence you can. If not, a microphone is necessary. Like seeing something with your own eyes as opposed to in a photograph. If you want to see what The Pyramids look like without a camera lens, you have to goto Egypt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBenson Posted September 12, 2016 Share Posted September 12, 2016 Fractal figured out how to do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted September 12, 2016 Share Posted September 12, 2016 Fractal figured out how to do this. Well, not really... The "none" mic option on the Axe-FX is simply a reference mic (I believe Cliff said it's one of the Earthworks reference mics). The reminds me of the Acoustics classes I took in college. I believe one of the first thing the professor wrote on the board was that acoustics was all about sound sources, signals and receivers... Take away any of them and you would have no sound. So the answer to the question of whether or not a tree falling in the woods with no one there made a sound was unequivocally "no"... :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDaveDaveDave Posted September 12, 2016 Share Posted September 12, 2016 +1 on reference mics, with distances up to at least 6'. Although, I'd believe you'd need an anholic chamber to deconvolve it properly....jus'sayin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDaveDaveDave Posted September 12, 2016 Share Posted September 12, 2016 Oh, btw, the sound would probably be complete poop.... but IMHO the idea is that you could use other IRs of mics in spaces without a double-coloration.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amsdenj Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 It might be theoretically possible to "subtract" the impulse response of a mic from the impulse response of a guitar cabinet captured with that mic in order to remove the effect of the mic on the tone. That may or may not sound good to us. Almost any recording or live sound we are familiar with was created with a mic in front of a guitar cabinet. Its become part of the tone of the overall source-to-destination system. I like to use the mic choice as part of the tone sculpting. It can have a nice way of presenting the speaker tone in a way that meets your needs instead of being stuck with only one choice. The physical transformation of a vibrating guitar string to moving air through pickups, cables, non-linear preamps and power amps, physical speakers, cabinets and microphones is magic to our ears. But a lot of that is what we've learned to love vs. something necessarily something intrinsic to the particular transformation. However, I think we would all agree that there is nothing that compares to the magic of a real physical Leslie speaker as the speed changes between fast and slow. Sometimes simple physical things, like us, are the real deal. We shouldn't forget that in this progressively automated AI world. People should still matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguel_lopez Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 Actually PODxt has something like this "no mic"; when you wanna play thru your power amp(return) you set this up this way: pre-amp model-speaker model-no mic(and even room if you may need so). I still use this feature A LOT in my room for practicing and trust me, it sounds really nice. It depends if you want to colorate a bit extra your real speakers. Having tons of options in my studio I found extremely nice those experiments like V30(real) modeling a 75(with PODxt no mic), it results in some 75 with more presence since a real V30 has a lot of mids, so imagine it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benifin Posted September 13, 2016 Author Share Posted September 13, 2016 Well, not really... The "none" mic option on the Axe-FX is simply a reference mic (I believe Cliff said it's one of the Earthworks reference mics). The reminds me of the Acoustics classes I took in college. I believe one of the first thing the professor wrote on the board was that acoustics was all about sound sources, signals and receivers... Take away any of them and you would have no sound. So the answer to the question of whether or not a tree falling in the woods with no one there made a sound was unequivocally "no"... :) Thanks for this - it is exactly why / what I was asking ..... :) Much appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billlorentzen Posted September 13, 2016 Share Posted September 13, 2016 The 414 or the 84 are probably the least colored mics. That said, they don't sound particularly alike. I would use them at least 4" away, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steevo1977 Posted September 14, 2016 Share Posted September 14, 2016 Thanks for this thread. What a hoot. And for what it's worth a reference mic is STILL A MIC!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted September 14, 2016 Share Posted September 14, 2016 ... And for what it's worth a reference mic is STILL A MIC!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol: Exactly, I think what the OP might be looking for is as neutral a mic as possible. Full frequency range and a flat frequency response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristianBoddum Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 I've finally got a stereo setup with 2 Celestion F12-X200 in two Katana 100 mk.1 and using them to drive my Helix and it's a sweet setup. It solves the problem of having two different signals 1 for FOH and 1 for amp making differences in volume a mess. The only downside is mic colouring of the IRs going to the amps, I'd much rather have a "neutral" reproduction of the speaker profile. That would bring in the challenge of matching level in again, but I'd like to hear it though... The Line6 powercabs have such IR's so they must be able to get at some point. FWIW P.s. I use the Katanas poweramp input only, no preamp colouration ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brue58ski Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 On 9/12/2016 at 1:01 PM, phil_m said: I believe one of the first thing the professor wrote on the board was that acoustics was all about sound sources, signals and receivers... Take away any of them and you would have no sound. So the answer to the question of whether or not a tree falling in the woods with no one there made a sound was unequivocally "no"... :) A more accurate statement is you won't HEAR the sound without all three of those things. It actually does make a sound, i.e. pushes air; there's just no one there to hear it. The sound itself is still there. It's like saying "since no one is there to see many of the water waves in the ocean, they don't exist." Yes they do. And the air waves of that tree exists, there's just no one there to "see" them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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