Changing mixers

[guitarman001]

I have the stagescape l3t speakers which I love, and want to keep , what I would like to know is if I sell my stagescape m20d and buy the behringer x32 will I still be able to set up the 32 channel eq in speaker. I like my mixer but now that line six has sold out to Yamaha . I think any updates for m20d are dead Yamaha will not answer emails on the m20d . Now I'm thinking of moving on . Can anyone answer this. Tks

[silverhead]

I highly doubt it but I'm not 100% certain. The reason I doubt it is that the 32 band EQ in the M20d operates only over L6 Link; it does not operate over the standard analog outputs. Since the Behringer does not have an L6 Link connection it almost certainly won't work.

[Robert_M]

Your question isn't as straightforward as it appears on the surface. For one thing, I suspect what you love about the Line 6 gear is the sonic quality of the speaker output.

 

When it comes to electronic equipment of all stripes there are issues with compatibility. One of the rules/laws that applies is that if you put a crappy piece of equipment in-line with a bunch of expensive gear, the expensive gear is going to behave more like that crappy item than the expensive components contained within the rest of your signal chain.

 

I haven't kept pace with the changing reputations of manufacturers for a long time. Neither do I have experience with the Behringer mixer your thinking of getting. I do know that 20+ years ago Behringer did not have a great reputation for producing gear that produced the best results. I have a vintage Mackie analog mixer that I have no problem hooking up to modern gear. That's because back when Mackie manufactured my mixer they were at the top of the heap and their stuff could hold their own to a reasonable degree against the much more expensive custom built gear used in high end recording studios. Behringer, at the time, wasn't in that league.

 

Move forward to today. My guess is that if you insert a Behringer mixer into your audio feed you will be effectively downgrading the performance of Line 6 PA system.

 

As for the issue of updates for the Line 6 mixer, what is it that you find lacking in your Line 6 mixer as it operates today that you feel needs to be updated?

 

That's one of the fallacies I see running rampant in our society today. They used to say, "If it ain't broke, don't 'fix' it." That was true then and it's still true today. If your present gear works for you today, why are you anticipating that it won't work for you tomorrow? Sure, someone's going to invent fancy bells and whistles tomorrow; you might want to be able to use those bells and whistles when they come along.

 

My old mixer is a good example. Some might say it's obsolete because it's old and plenty of more modern options have come along since it left the assembly line. Trouble is, the modern gear based on digital technology has a hard time duplicating the performance of the old analog equipment. That's the same principle behind the current fad of wanting to listen to vinyl records as opposed to CD's "because the vinyl sounds better."

 

Those are my thoughts.

[SiWatts69]

To be fair to Behringer Robert, the X32 is a *very* good mixer. Very competent.

 

BUT, I wouldn't trade my M20 for one! Not because I have a downer on the X32, simply because mine still performs flawlessly and I see the whole M20 with L3/2 speakers as a complete ecosystem! It all works best as a whole. The M20 enables the L speakers to perform exactly as they were designed.

 

The only way you'd know for certain would be to try them with the X32, but do so before you let go of your M20!

 

My final BUT though would be that I'd buy an A&H QU series before buying an X32!

[Robert_M]

I hear you, SiWatts. I'm sure you saw my disclaimers about not being familiar with the quality of Behringer's current gear.

 

I wholeheartedly agree with you on two points. First, using the Line 6 mixer with the Line 6 speakers can be a valuable asset even when other mixers are available that look like they have better specs on the manufacturer's cut sheets. Having an integrated system that includes control options designed to match the operating equipment is worth a lot.

 

There's a similar dynamic that comes into play with all types of Consumer-based technology. It's especially rampant when it comes to photographic equipment. People who like taking pictures with real cameras get real personal when it comes to their cameras. On the one hand if you tell a photographer your brand/model out performs theirs they will defend their selection tooth and nail. Then, when the manufacturer introduces a newer model that has two or three bells and whistles added, they'll sell their beloved camera for a 50% loss and rush out to buy the new toy. In the end they enjoy no improvement in picture quality with the new gear.

 

Me, when I spend the time and the cash to figure out what works for me I tend to stick with that for quite a long while.

 

With the possible exception of British made automobiles, most manufacturers go through cycles where they claw their way to the top by offering quality and innovation. Then, they enter into a cycle where they rest upon their laurels and look to improve the profit margin by cutting corners. Profits do improve, but quality begins to fall off. The reputation gets them by for a time but eventually someone else steps in to take their place.

 

That's what happened to Mackie, as I recently found out. When they started manufacturing their stuff in China the quality dropped. From what I've recently gathered, that's when A&H became an important force in the U.S. market. Years ago I had a larger Mackie in my production studio. When I dismantled the studio that mixer was sold off along with a bunch of the other gear. That's when I picked up my current and smaller 1402-VLZ for performance gigs and home use.

 

With more time on my hands now I'm looking at doing more recording. I picked up an A&H Zed R-16 for a decent price and it's a great piece of equipment. The design's been around for some time, but was one of those innovations I mentioned when introduced. There still doesn't seem to be anything comparable today at it's price point that will accomplish what it does. For me, I get the benefits of an analog mixer with a nicely designed digital recording interface. Depending on how my new pedal board turns out, I may pick up one of the small Zed's. My Mackie's good, but large and heavy in comparison to the small Zed's for a solo gig.

 

That's our second point of agreement. The A&H analog mixers work for me because of what I'm doing with them. If I were looking for a digital mixer I'd much prefer the Allen & Heath to the Behringer, and that is apart from any lingering doubts I still have concerning the quality of Behringer's current gear.

[Robert_M]

Just wondering, but is the EQ located in the speaker, or is it located in the mixer? I'm just starting to acquaint myself with the features of the PA system so I don't know how Line 6 designed this. The speakers have a 3-band tone control EQ and a notch filter for the anti-feedback stuff. From an old school perspective an actual multi-band EQ belongs outside of the speaker.

[silverhead]

If you're speaking about the M20d multi-band Global EQ I believe it resides in the mixer. It doesn't really matter where it resides, I guess, since it only works with the L6 Link connections. But for efficiency I think it must be implemented in the mixer rather than in each connected speaker.

[SiWatts69]

Just wondering, but is the EQ located in the speaker, or is it located in the mixer? I'm just starting to acquaint myself with the features of the PA system so I don't know how Line 6 designed this. The speakers have a 3-band tone control EQ and a notch filter for the anti-feedback stuff. From an old school perspective an actual multi-band EQ belongs outside of the speaker.

The 3 band EQ with sweep mids is only present for the side panel inputs. A way of shaping the tone of a direct input source. It has NO impact on either L6Link input or the LINE/RAC inputs on the back panel.

 

The multiband global EQ is only present in the M20 and is controlled by the mixer, not the speakers.

[Rewolf48]

I thought that the 31 band graphic was located in the speakers and set individually and is only accessible via L6Link?

[groovedggr]

I have the stagescape l3t speakers which I love, and want to keep , what I would like to know is if I sell my stagescape m20d and buy the behringer x32 will I still be able to set up the 32 channel eq in speaker. I like my mixer but now that line six has sold out to Yamaha . I think any updates for m20d are dead Yamaha will not answer emails on the m20d . Now I'm thinking of moving on . Can anyone answer this. Tks

they won't work on x32 like they do on m20d--they need the L6link. You could think about adding a sub -mixer for the drums / back line if the 12 inputs has become an issue- a cheap behringer for the drums or another stagescape-. I picked up a demo from GC at good price, - I have 2 iPads and assign one to each. but most gigs - i don't need 2 . I love the dreamstage but if you sell it - include the speakers -probably go quickly.