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4cm Volume Issue


rublalup
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hello,

 

I´m using the 4cm on the series loop of a marshall JCM600 but when i bypass the pre-amp section (using some of the amp models on the hd500) i only get playable volume with the crunch channel selected... on the clean channel volume is super low and thin. This obviusly doesnt occur when I´m using the pre-amp of my amp... both channels are usable with the effects i need.

 

is this normal? what has to do the channel selected if i´m in the fx loop?

 

I´m missing something here...

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Yeah a global level compensation auto leveler is needed.

But in the meantime, as there are different amps modelled in the POD at the levels they were modelled at there are wild

volume variations.

My work around was to use the mixer levels to balance my patches which I do with no FX and only the AMp models active.

 

On your amp you still have to balance the independent  channels. On mine you do as they are seperate volumes and or gain depending upon channel selected.

 

But adjusting using the modelled amps gain and volume effects your tone too much.

Luckily we have the mixer block.

 

Similar to the Amps in the HD from one to another. By using the mixer block you can balance by using an spl meter or app for your phone but often by ear gets a more realistic volume balance between clean and dirty amps..

 

Do it with FX turned off and balance them then add FX one at a time and switch between the patches each time untill all your FX are on on each and then go backwards turning one off on one patch and switching patches.

 

It is alot of work but you do end up with a bank of patches that are adequately balanced between FX off and on.

The global volume leveler would handle this chore.

You can also do this to level match your amps pre amp and the HD's. toggling it on and off to match the level set in your amp's pre.

The output volume on the HD can be used to lower the output to the power amp but best to do this at stage volumes first, then later you can roll back the HD output to home studio level and it naturally looses some bottom end and immersion in the room tone. 

If you gig it is better to duplicate your patches to anther bank and make smaller room adjustments in it than your giging bank. 

If you are short of banks you could adjust the right out on the mixer for stage volume and the left for studio volume but you have to insert a dummy load on the side not used otherwise it is summed mono thru only one output. I don't recommend it but it could be done if you know what value load to put on the  jack plug your not using. Duplicate patches seems safer on the electronics and there are more than plenty of banks in the HD.

 

Hope this helps. There are other ways to do it as the HD have plenty of variables for volume.This is just what I found. I also found it easier to crank the modelled amps volume rather than go into the mixer block but from my ear there is a interaction between gain, tone controls and out volume on the amp block.

 

The Amps volume doesn't change the tone by itself. It is not supposed to but there is an interaction to my ears and I prefer to leave the volume where it works with the amp gain and tone control and use the mixer block level.

When I first got the HD500 I used the volume on the amp as it is quick.

But if your wanting balanced patch volumes similar to your amps then give it a try, go directly to the amp block.

I turn off the touch amp controls to show up the amp block.

It would be good to assign this feature to open the mixer block as an option.

If you use different guitars some with hotter pickups this effects any patch you dial up.

As does rolling the volume off on a guitar. 

I find that I name a patch to include the guitar used and when I tweak an amp model  I do it with with guitar volume up and volume down to as that is how you use a real amp to get differing tones and feel, so too with the modelled amps. Pulling back it's gain so it works and I prefer to adjust sag bias etc with volume down on the guitar as these other amp menus can really be used to give a more realistic feel to the modelling.

Even some of the high gain models can be cleaned up this way.

 

Lastly, Internal clipping. I found to get the right balance between a high gain and a clean amp model you don't want to crank the mixer full on on a clean amp model. I have some high gain model actually attenuated on a few.

By all means crank the mixer and get the threshold of distortion but as you add FX it could internally clip. Here a clip led type function would be good on every slot or on every thing. 

In the meantime use your ears and bear in mind you can cut volume in the mixer block too.

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thanks for that complete response! I´ll try what you suggested.

 

My main doubt is why the hell do I need to be in the crunch channel to use the HD as main pre amp... i mean, i´m not even using the fx loop block. What have to do the channel of the amp with the series fx loop?

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