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Inerzia

This keeps happening, everytime I update

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I've been having this problem since I bought the Helix, and blaming myself for it ("oh, maybe I skipped that step..." kind of thinking) but last night I followed every single step and yes, 2.10 is now running 

--- Intermission --- 
Let me just take a few seconds to thank and congratulate the team. I'm loving the new models, and I'll surely put the new expression pedal functionality to good use
--- Back to program ---

 

2.10 is now running, smoothly. 
The thing is, what's failing is the update process. There are certain patches (six of them) that fail to rebuild or import (or export, I'm not sure).
Helix doesn't rebuild them properly. One half of the DSP is missing, in some cases it's the first half (what would correspond to paths 1 and 2), and sometimes it's the second half (3 and 4).
The first time I was annoyed, but I was still getting acquainted with the machine, so I didn't care too much. I went for my backed up patches (both as a bundle and separate playlists) and tried to restore them, but they were as corrupt as what Helix itself had turned the originals to.
"Not a big deal, my patches are still in diapers" I thought.

Next update. Same problem. Then 2.0, same problem. By then, it was the third time I had to rebuild those patches.
I skipped 2.01 because I didn't want to go through it again, and I didn't really feel the need to update.

So last night I went and made screenshots of everything in those patches, to be able to restore them later.

Different USB cables, different computers (3 or 4 so far, I'm not sure) and different versions of the editor, drivers, firmware... everything.

Any idea before I submit a ticket?

Attached are screenshots of before
post-13228-0-81520700-1479937579_thumb.jpg
and after
post-13228-0-08248600-1479937774_thumb.jpg

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How are you rebuilding the failed patches? Are you adding the missing pieces to the pieces that seem to have been imported successfully or are you rebuilding the entire patch from scratch in a new preset? If you are doing the former, try the latter.

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I think I see your problem.

It's the IRs.

You need to independently reinstall all the IRs - in the same slots. 

So - what you should have done is either rename you IRs (add 01, 02 etc to the start of the name - yes, you might have to shorten the name as a result - so they are stored in the correct order in a computer,   -or-   Take a screen grab of them from the editor so you know where to replace them after the update.  Then you back them up!!

This is because they are removed after the update - don't ask me to justify any of that - it's something Line 6 don't seem to be willing to address.

So anyhow, after the update you then put the correct IR's back in the correct slots, and hopefully that fixes your issues - let us know if that works for you.

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I'm not sure it's the IRs. In my experience, presets with IRs that are imported after a firmware update work just fine. The preset shows the IRs in the signal path and indicates which IR slot is identified in the preset. The fact that the specified IR slot is empty (if you haven't reloaded the IRs) certainly affects the sound of the preset but it does not make the preset corrupt nor prevent it from importing properly.

 

Also, the pics show that the entire Path 2 has not been imported. It's not just the IRs.

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I think I see your problem.

It's the IRs.

You need to independently reinstall all the IRs - in the same slots. 

So - what you should have done is either rename you IRs (add 01, 02 etc to the start of the name - yes, you might have to shorten the name as a result - so they are stored in the correct order in a computer,   -or-   Take a screen grab of them from the editor so you know where to replace them after the update.  Then you back them up!!

This is because they are removed after the update - don't ask me to justify any of that - it's something Line 6 don't seem to be willing to address.

So anyhow, after the update you then put the correct IR's back in the correct slots, and hopefully that fixes your issues - let us know if that works for you.

No, actually, the IRs came through the rabbit hole, everytime.

 

This time, having decided to go by the book, I let Helix clear them (as recommended), so I had to rebuild the list (using screenshots).

 

I don't think this issue is related to IRs, but thanks anyway.

 

How are you rebuilding the failed patches? Are you adding the missing pieces to the pieces that seem to have been imported successfully or are you rebuilding the entire patch from scratch in a new preset? If you are doing the former, try the latter.

I've tried to (internally) save the working patch to different memory locations, and it does work, but even from those new slots, I seem to be unable to succesfully export those patches with the editor.

Anyway, I'll try the approach you're suggesting, just to see if that works. If it did... what kind of problem would we be talking about? memory corruption? damaged physical memory addresses?  :huh:

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It would probably just be a preset corruption - software, not hardware. Perhaps at some point in time you had incompatible firmware/editor versions installed and operating together. I think there was a period of time when they weren't necessarily in lock-step as they are now, and no checks were in place to detect and prevent potentially incompatible versions. There have been other reports of corrupt presets in earlier times.

 

Either that or just a glitch at the time of saving the affected presets. But I'm just guessing.

 

In any case, if rebuilding from scratch works the problem should be resolved for the next update.

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In any case, if rebuilding from scratch works the problem should be resolved for the next update.

But sadly, it doesn't  :( 

 

I just tried to rebuild the preset from scratch in a different memory location (using the screenshots), then exporting it and then importing it back to its original place (and to another setlist too), but it still wipes the first dsp clean

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Yes, I'll wait for some more people to chime in and then "we're off to see the Wizard"

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...

This time, having decided to go by the book, I let Helix clear them (as recommended), so I had to rebuild the list (using screenshots).

 

...

 

Not sure if you just meant this humorously or if this comment implies that you have updated previous versions of the firmware/software without doing the global reset. If so then Silverhead may unfortunately be correct that it may be possible that you have corrupt presets. Did the rest of your presets load alright, except for the problem six you described?  

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As another test, reinstall/update the firmware again and complete the installation with the global reset as documented. Then try rebuilding the problem presets from scratch again BEFORE you import anything. If that works OK then do not import the problem presets.

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Not sure if you just meant this humorously or if this comment implies that you have updated previous versions of the firmware/software without doing the global reset. If so then Silverhead may unfortunately be correct that it may be possible that you have corrupt presets. Did the rest of your presets load alright, except for the problem six you described?  

Yes, the rest of the presets are alright.

I'm not sure which steps I may or may not have skipped in the past. What I do remember though, is that, at least on one past update I did the reset, but those presets got damaged anyway, so I decided to not do the global resets anymore, until now, when I thought best to strictly adhere to the rules.

I'm more inclined towards the hypothesis of having (at some point) had incompatible/mismatched versions of firmware and editor, as Silverhead hinted above.

That would be unusual though, as I tend to be up to date, on all flashable gear, the only exception being the previous (2.01) version of Helix, which I didn't install to avoid or delay this problem until a worthy update arrived.

 

As another test, reinstall/update the firmware again and complete the installation with the global reset as documented. Then try rebuilding the problem presets from scratch again BEFORE you import anything. If that works OK then do not import the problem presets.

That will have to wait until the next update. I just finished rebuilding them like 20m ago... you know... not really in the mood  :D 

 

I'll open a ticket, maybe tomorrow, and see what they tell me. I'd much rather it was solved here, though, my (2 closed, 1 pending) interactions with tech service have been both slow and unsatisfactory, so far.

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Yes, the rest of the presets are alright.

I'm not sure which steps I may or may not have skipped in the past. What I do remember though, is that, at least on one past update I did the reset, but those presets got damaged anyway, so I decided to not do the global resets anymore, until now, when I thought best to strictly adhere to the rules.

I'm more inclined towards the hypothesis of having (at some point) had incompatible/mismatched versions of firmware and editor, as Silverhead hinted above.

That would be unusual though, as I tend to be up to date, on all flashable gear, the only exception being the previous (2.01) version of Helix, which I didn't install to avoid or delay this problem until a worthy update arrived.

 

That will have to wait until the next update. I just finished rebuilding them like 20m ago... you know... not really in the mood  :D 

 

I'll open a ticket, maybe tomorrow, and see what they tell me. I'd much rather it was solved here, though, my (2 closed, 1 pending) interactions with tech service have been both slow and unsatisfactory, so far.

 

I'm also inclined towards Silverhead's hypothesis but I think proceeding forward with any firmware update without doing a global reset after as recommended by Line6 until they stop saying to do it is a recipe for headaches down the road, particularly when it comes to using prior presets in subsequent firmware updates. Good luck recovering these going forward.  :)

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