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New 89F Won't Stay in Tune


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Just got a new cherry 89F and having a hard time getting it to stay in tune.  So it's hard to even see if the alt-tunings or even the models sound good.

 

IT takes time, but I can get the strings in tune, but after a little playing or any real string bends, it goes far out of tune. By a lot.  I was tuning using the Helix via the VDI cable, but that was too wobbly.  Switched to a normal 1/4" tuner and it was more stable.  

 

Is there something I can do to keep it in tune?  

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Strings on a new guitar, invariably have not been adequately stretched when it's shipped...never fails.

 

Tune each string to pitch, then yank the daylights out of it and re-tune. Repeat until no matter how much you pull on it, it no longer goes out of tune. It's either 5 minutes of that, or playing on it for a week, constantly tuning until they stretch on their own.

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cruisinon2 is likely correct with the string stretching being the source of the problem. Other things to consider. Make sure the locks on the nut are working and tightened (don't over-tighten them, you can over do it). If you referring to the string not holding tune WHILE you bend it, that is side effect of floyd rose floating bridges, a tremolo stabilizer can fix that.  Make sure it's setup correctly with the bridge floating almost even to the body once it is tuned correctly. If it's sunk in or lifted up too much it will cause issues.  Floyds can be b**ch to get setup properly but once setup correctly are actually hard to throw out of tune even with the wildest dives. Since you are not even getting to the variax side of the guitar yet, I would recommend looking up some videos etc... on getting the floyd setup first. Might check with graph tech(bridge manufacturer) to see if they have any information, I've contacted them before and they have awesome support.

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 Here are two websites on how to put the strings on.

 

https://www.floydrose.com/support/tech-support/string-changing-instructions

 

http://www.wikihow.com/Restring-a-Floating-Bridge-(Floyd-Rose)

 

These methods have you change the strings one at a time. You can block the trem at the back with something so you can take all of the strings off at the same time.

Here's a picture showing how to block the trem with popsicle sticks I actually use a wine cork I shaved down instead of popsicle sticks.

 

 

 

Here's two pics showing how the trem plate should look relative to the guitar's body.

 Good

 

Bad

 

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Finally returned from holiday.

 

Thx for the input. 

 

Indeed the cold from shipping messed it up alot.  After letting it warm, it was considerable better.  

 

However it's still difficult to even get in tune.  I've changed strings before and always pulled them like crazy and they would stay in tune.  Here not so much. (and the Helix tuner bouncing around hasn't been helpful).   The effect from tuning one string to the others is quite significant.  I've never had to take 10 minutes to tune a guitar.  

 

Is this always going to be the case? Will it "hold" the tuning until I change strings?

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Finally returned from holiday.

 

Thx for the input.

 

Indeed the cold from shipping messed it up alot. After letting it warm, it was considerable better.

 

However it's still difficult to even get in tune. I've changed strings before and always pulled them like crazy and they would stay in tune. Here not so much. (and the Helix tuner bouncing around hasn't been helpful). The effect from tuning one string to the others is quite significant. I've never had to take 10 minutes to tune a guitar.

 

Is this always going to be the case? Will it "hold" the tuning until I change strings?

Well if the strings are properly stretched, then something else is wrong...bridge may not be returning to neutral position after bends or tremelo bar gymnastics, for some reason. Lousy/worn tremelo springs maybe? Hard to say. I hate Floyds...always more trouble than they're worth.

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Tuning off like that will complicate things for you.

Tune to standard, then use the Alt Tune or Workbench HD to make alterations.

 

Physically tuning differently, then using the Alt Tune (specially with Baritone)

you run the risk of going beyond the pitch tracking ability of the JTV or Variax

Standard. It doesn't sound like you have reached that point yet, but maybe

skirting that in-between region

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My JTV-89F was almost in tune out of the box... still have the strings on that it came with (little heavier than I like but they're nice) stays in tune great... I tune with the Helix and the VDI cable too, Note: when tuning with the Helix don't look at the small bar to much just the big ones and here is what I found to be pretty good advice on tunning....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38XqgSL72UE

 

The LONG version...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tfxy_zs0Mo

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  • 2 weeks later...

My JTV-89F was almost in tune out of the box... still have the strings on that it came with (little heavier than I like but they're nice) stays in tune great... I tune with the Helix and the VDI cable too, Note: when tuning with the Helix don't look at the small bar to much just the big ones and here is what I found to be pretty good advice on tunning....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38XqgSL72UE

 

The LONG version...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tfxy_zs0Mo

Wow, what a fundamentalist......

Everybody is tuning their instrument wrong! FFS....

If everybody else is tuning their guitar by plucking a string and letting it ring out, and he's the only one who's constantly plucking it to tune up, then who's going to sound out of tune to everbody else?

Personally, I don't play staccato ad infinitum, and I don't know any one who does. It'd be pretty boring after a while. I play with lots of dynamics, and therefore there goes the concept of tuning how you play - just relax about the fact that the guitar, and it's player is imperfect tuning wise, and enjoy the show. Otherwise, you may as well stay at home, and listen to a CD of midi music on your own.

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Wow, what a fundamentalist......

Everybody is tuning their instrument wrong! FFS....

If everybody else is tuning their guitar by plucking a string and letting it ring out, and he's the only one who's constantly plucking it to tune up, then who's going to sound out of tune to everbody else?

Personally, I don't play staccato ad infinitum, and I don't know any one who does. It'd be pretty boring after a while. I play with lots of dynamics, and therefore there goes the concept of tuning how you play - just relax about the fact that the guitar, and it's player is imperfect tuning wise, and enjoy the show. Otherwise, you may as well stay at home, and listen to a CD of midi music on your own.

yeah that guy is, wile some of the points he makes seem valid and dose explain how a chord might not sound totally in tune at least on my cheap guitar...

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yeah that guy is, wile some of the points he makes seem valid and dose explain how a chord might not sound totally in tune at least on my cheap guitar...

The thing is, it's as much to do with intonation, and playing style, and the fact that the guitar is fundamentally an imperfect instrument (tuning wise).

If I couldn't fix something, I'd simply stress less about it...

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However it's still difficult to even get in tune.  I've changed strings before and always pulled them like crazy and they would stay in tune.  Here not so much. (and the Helix tuner bouncing around hasn't been helpful).   The effect from tuning one string to the others is quite significant.  I've never had to take 10 minutes to tune a guitar.  

 

 

 

Have you ever tuned a Floyd Rose or other floating tremolo?

Try tuning your low E, then high E, A, then B, D then G, it should cut down the amount of "passes".

 

My JTV89F stays in tune for a long time, and I'm definitely less than gently with it (especially when I forget it's not an actual acoustic!!). 

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Have you ever tuned a Floyd Rose or other floating tremolo?

Try tuning your low E, then high E, A, then B, D then G, it should cut down the amount of "passes".

 

My JTV89F stays in tune for a long time, and I'm definitely less than gently with it (especially when I forget it's not an actual acoustic!!). 

Thanks for the tip.  I had been tuning them in this order, which is similar: lowE-e-b-a-g-d 

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Thanks for the tip. I had been tuning them in this order, which is similar: lowE-e-b-a-g-d

Six of one, half-dozen of the other...

 

The point is to work your way in, alternating from one side of the bridge to the other, (which you're already doing) so as not to put a ton of extra tension all on one side of the bridge at once. Following the two E strings, whether you go A then B, or B then A, or D/G vs Ģ/D won't make any appreciable difference, as long as you alternate.

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I just meant that was the order of the strings that I tune them, not the actual tuning ;)

 

 

Six of one, half-dozen of the other...

 

The point is to work your way in, alternating from one side of the bridge to the other, (which you're already doing) so as not to put a ton of extra tension all on one side of the bridge at once. Following the two E strings, whether you go A then B, or B then A, or D/G vs Ģ/D won't make any appreciable difference, as long as you alternate.

 

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:

At first glance I thought it was an alternate tuning!!

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Has anyone a tipp for fixing the G-string on a unmodified JTV-59. Everytime I bend, it noticeable loses some cent.

Maybe there are some kind of seashells to use or a hack on the tuners?

 

Of course I had bent the string after putting on new strings, two weeks ago.

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Has anyone a tipp for fixing the G-string on a unmodified JTV-59. Everytime I bend, it noticeable loses some cent.

Maybe there are some kind of seashells to use or a hack on the tuners?

 

Of course I had bent the string after putting on new strings, two weeks ago.

It's odd for a fixed-bridge guitar to have trouble returning to pitch after a bend...you're basically left with an issue with the nut, the saddle, or the tuning machine. I'd see about the nut first. Sometimes there can be small burrs in the slot that the string can get hung up on. If the string moves within the nut slot, and doesn't return to the same spot, you'll have issues. Do you hear any high pitched "pings" when tuning that string? If so, that usually indicates that the string can't move freely in the slot.
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The nut could be a good place to start investigations because there is also some ringing sound on or near the nut on the g-string.

I will take a closer look using my ears and a magnifying glass.

Many guitars suffer from strings ringing behind the nut, which is probably what you're hearing. It wouldn't explain the problems returning to pitch after bending strings, though. Of course you may just have more than one issue going on. Ringing behind the nut is an easy fix, though:

 

http://www.gruvgear.com/fretwraps

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Many guitars suffer from strings ringing behind the nut. Fortunately there is a relatively cheap and effective solution:

 

http://www.gruvgear.com/fretwraps

Oh no, I can exclude that because it was the first thing I tested, after being aware of the ringing ;) I will get back to you after some major investigations…

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