" Pop " / " Noise " when Snapshot switching from Crunch Marhsall to Clean DC 30 ??

[benifin]

Hi all

 

Enjoying some time messing around with a friends Helix for a few days ... all good but have this issue:-

 

Running 2.11 as follows

 

-> Snapshot 1 - Clean DC 30

-> Snapshot 2 - Crunch 2204

-> Snapshot 3 - Dirty 2204

-> Snapshot 4 - Solo 2204

 

Helix is  -not-  connected to my PC.

 

The Problem ?

 

=> when I FSW up from 1 to 2 to 3 to 4 ... all good .. no issues

 

=> when I FSW down from 4 to 3 to 2  ... all good .. no issues

 

=> when I FSW down from  2 to 1 ... there is a noticable pop / glitch moving from the Crunch 2204  to the Clean DC 30 (?)

 

It happens with other amps  too.

 

Is this a known issue  ?

 

Thanks,

Ben

 

 

 

[phil_m]

You can get pops or noises when you have drastic changes from one snapshot to the other, especially when turning blocks on and off that have big impacts on the gain structure. I think the issue is that you're actually temporarily disrupting the signal, so it causes a pop. How do you have the two amp models set up? Are they in different paths, or is everything in one serial path? There are ways you could set this up to probably minimize or get rid of the noise altogether. I'm thinking if you had the amps in separate paths, and just controlled the "route to" parameter at the split (along with any of the amp settings), you would probably not experience any switching noise.

[MusicLaw]

Ben, if you have not already done so, submit your findings directly to Line 6 Tech Support as a Bug Report to formally bring this to their attention.

 

This symptom significantly detracts from the chief benefits of using Snapshots.

 

Have you compared the significance of the pop/noise of decrementing frm Snap 2 to Snap 1, to what it would if you were actually switching between entirely different Presets (configured as Snap 2 and Snap 1)?

[silverhead]

...This symptom significantly detracts from the chief benefits of using Snapshots.

 

Have you compared the significance of the pop/noise of decrementing frm Snap 2 to Snap 1, to what it would if you were actually switching between entirely different Presets (configured as Snap 2 and Snap 1)?.........

 

I tested this on one of my presets that displays this pop/noise symptom when switching snapshots. The associated snapshots do indeed involve a substantial change in the gain structure, involving the amp Drive and Channel volume levels, a Minotaur distortion that is off and on, and also two different IRs with significantly different Mix and Level settings in the different snapshots. The pop/noise is evident when switching from snapshot 1 to snapshot 2.

 

I copied the preset to another location and Saved them both - one with snapshot 1 active (let's call it preset A) and the other with snapshot 2 active (Preset B ). As expected switching from Preset A to B does NOT display the pop/noise symptom. Why? Because the DSP is reloaded when switching presets, interrupting the signal momentarily. It is this interruption that hides the pop/noise that can be heard when you switch snapshots within a preset where there is no DSP/signal interruption. It's the dramatic change in the active FX blocks and parameters from one snapshot to another that causes the pop/noise.

 

As for it being a detraction from the chief benefits of using snapshots, I guess that's debatable. But I can imagine a similar thing happening if one were to make analogous instantaneous changes with 'real' analog amps and pedals, with no interruption in the signal flow.

[jbuhajla]

 

As for it being a detraction from the chief benefits of using snapshots, I guess that's debatable. But I can imagine a similar thing happening if one were to make analogous instantaneous changes with 'real' analog amps and pedals, with no interruption in the signal flow.

I agree totally. Helix is a digital modeler of amps, cabinets, and effects. Some of the byproducts that we are encountering from snapshots comes from instantaneous changes in certain parameters on the models. If you were able to recreate instantaneous changes on the "analog" versions, you venture to guess that you would hear the same byproducts. The amp example above would be similar to having your clean fender amp on "standby" then taking it off of standby while there is a hot input signal going into the front end of the amp. 

 

Snapshots is a fantastic function, but you do have to understand what it is doing and what some of the "negative" byproducts that may occur when making drastic changes between snapshots. These are not bugs or glitches. They are just what happens when making instantaneous parameter changes or turning something off/on in the middle of a hot signal. 

[stefanbaumann]

Hi, I have the same problem with switching from one Snapshot to the other with a 'Simple Delay' with Mix of 50%.

But it´s more than pop/noise. There is some kind of a weird disharmonic chord slide up from aprx. a whole tone. 

Really not feasible to me!

 

I understood that it´s the 'main point' of snapshot feature to play without disruption live by switching from "Verse" to "chorus" as it´s explained in official video tutorials. :-(

[silverhead]

This sounds like the same symptom described here:

http://line6.com/support/topic/29514-delay-glitch-when-choosing-another-snapshot-with-different-delay-time/

 

See my explanation and remedy in post #2.

[BlueViolince]

Hi, I have the same problem with switching from one Snapshot to the other with a 'Simple Delay' with Mix of 50%.

But it´s more than pop/noise. There is some kind of a weird disharmonic chord slide up from aprx. a whole tone. 

Really not feasible to me!

 

I understood that it´s the 'main point' of snapshot feature to play without disruption live by switching from "Verse" to "chorus" as it´s explained in official video tutorials. :-(

Is there a delay time or subdivision change between snapshots?  If the time on a delay is changed, it's just like turn the time knob on an analog delay while you play.  

[jwoertz]

What's the best way to go from clean to crunch without the pop? One amp with bringing the gain up and the master volume down in one click?

[jbuhajla]

16 hours ago, jwoertz said:

What's the best way to go from clean to crunch without the pop? One amp with bringing the gain up and the master volume down in one click?

Expression pedal. I use an external expression to adjust going from toe up to toe down:

 

Drive up

Bass down

Channel Volume down

 

My main preset is the Jumped Plexi that I do with with. You can sweep from clean to crunch/stank. It's like hiring a one of the kids in your neighborhood to move the knobs on your real amp for you while you are playing. 

[jwoertz]

1 minute ago, jbuhajla said:

Expression pedal. I use an external expression to adjust going from toe up to toe down:

 

Drive up

Bass down

Channel Volume down

 

My main preset is the Jumped Plexi that I do with with. You can sweep from clean to crunch/stank. It's like hiring a one of the kids in your neighborhood to move the knobs on your real amp for you while you are playing. 

Thanks, will give it a shot with the internal pedal and other switch first. This is kind-of what I was doing today. Will keep messing with it. Now if I could just dial out the fizz/squirrels. :-)