DustyF92 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 I'm a country picker, so clean tones are vital to me (I cover a lot of 90s country and such). I've had some trouble getting FAT, BALLSY clean tones from even the simplest of setups. It seems like I don't have enough....sustain?? I play a Nashville B-Bender Tele into the Helix and then usually go direct to FOH, or when creating presets at home, through my studio monitors (IK Multimedia iLoud Micro Monitors). The tones sound thicker and better to me at home, but on the road sound kinda thin and uninspiring. I've tried a few different amp setups (Deluxe, WhoWatt, AC30, etc) and am fiddling with the Litigator as well. I am using various IRs that I got from 3Sigma and usually run 2 IRs in one patch (lately a 4x12 and a 2x12) and am liking what I hear so far with the litigator. I use compression sparingly and turn the mix down to around 60-70% and currently have an eq block that boosts the mids (helps it cut through live). As soon as I kick in a drive pedal, the live tone sounds great to me...but I'm still chasing that Holy Grail clean tone sound when the drive is not engaged. Any help on proper EQ or other suggestions is welcome. I have a few different presets on the go with clean/crunch snapshots that I sometimes dig for a while, but lately have just started creating new presets and fiddling with the amp first and foremost and adding in other effects very sparingly. Input gate seems to be a must with my damn single coils, but threshold is around -50db with the litigator... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 I'm a country picker, so clean tones are vital to me (I cover a lot of 90s country and such). I've had some trouble getting FAT, BALLSY clean tones from even the simplest of setups. It seems like I don't have enough....sustain?? I play a Nashville B-Bender Tele into the Helix and then usually go direct to FOH, or when creating presets at home, through my studio monitors (IK Multimedia iLoud Micro Monitors). The tones sound thicker and better to me at home, but on the road sound kinda thin and uninspiring. I've tried a few different amp setups (Deluxe, WhoWatt, AC30, etc) and am fiddling with the Litigator as well. I am using various IRs that I got from 3Sigma and usually run 2 IRs in one patch (lately a 4x12 and a 2x12) and am liking what I hear so far with the litigator. I use compression sparingly and turn the mix down to around 60-70% and currently have an eq block that boosts the mids (helps it cut through live). As soon as I kick in a drive pedal, the live tone sounds great to me...but I'm still chasing that Holy Grail clean tone sound when the drive is not engaged. Any help on proper EQ or other suggestions is welcome. I have a few different presets on the go with clean/crunch snapshots that I sometimes dig for a while, but lately have just started creating new presets and fiddling with the amp first and foremost and adding in other effects very sparingly. Input gate seems to be a must with my damn single coils, but threshold is around -50db with the litigator... For country picking a lot of players use quite a bit of compression for sustain. It's getting the settings on the compressor right that can be a challenge. I don't think the Litigator is quite the right amp for that sound... unless you like a little grit in your clean sound as I do. I would recommend the Deluxe Vibrato or the Twin Vibrato channel. I almost always use one of the ribbon mics as they have more bottom and can be easily trimmed to taste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talwilkins Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Also take a look at the new Archetype Clean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DustyF92 Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 Yea I came from the Wampler Ego Compressor (fantastic pedal) and there was definitely an abundance of sustain... I will check out the Archetype as well... I think I may have made a patch a while ago with that amp in there. Should I try it with the AMP+CAB block or choose an IR? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DustyF92 Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 For country picking a lot of players use quite a bit of compression for sustain. It's getting the settings on the compressor right. I don't think the Litigator is quite the right amp for that sound... unless you like a little grit in your clean sound as I do. I would recommend the Deluxe Vibrato or the Twin Vibrato channel. I almost always use one of the ribbon mics as they have more bottom and can be easily trimmed to taste. I do happen to like a little grit in my clean, but that's historically been because I can't find the holy grail clean tone I'm looking for YET.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbuhajla Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 I'm not a country picker, but I play a lot of clean (Strat/Tele). You really need to play around with the compressors. The Red Squeeze is the model for the MXR Dyna Comp, start with the default settings and squeeze/sustain from there. That one amplifies single coil noise though, so watch out for that. I've been putting the LA Studio Compressor at the front end of the signal chain on almost all my presets lately, but I turn the gain down to about 3.5 to that the volume isn't kicked up too much. It adds some pretty nice "transparent" sustain. Next try the Interstate Zed amp model (Dr Z Route 66) for some Brad Paisley type punch. It has a little grit to it. I've been using the Mesa MkiV Rhythm Channel 2 model a lot for clean to crunch. Gain about 2-3 for clean, up to 6-8 for crunch. I really like how it cleans up with the gain low. Just sit down with a basic preset with amp and separate cab model with a little room reverb in between. Then just go through the amp models and cab models until something sounds pretty close to what you are looking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DustyF92 Posted January 17, 2017 Author Share Posted January 17, 2017 I'm not a country picker, but I play a lot of clean (Strat/Tele). You really need to play around with the compressors. The Red Squeeze is the model for the MXR Dyna Comp, start with the default settings and squeeze/sustain from there. That one amplifies single coil noise though, so watch out for that. I've been putting the LA Studio Compressor at the front end of the signal chain on almost all my presets lately, but I turn the gain down to about 3.5 to that the volume isn't kicked up too much. It adds some pretty nice "transparent" sustain. Next try the Interstate Zed amp model (Dr Z Route 66) for some Brad Paisley type punch. It has a little grit to it. I've been using the Mesa MkiV Rhythm Channel 2 model a lot for clean to crunch. Gain about 2-3 for clean, up to 6-8 for crunch. I really like how it cleans up with the gain low. Just sit down with a basic preset with amp and separate cab model with a little room reverb in between. Then just go through the amp models and cab models until something sounds pretty close to what you are looking for. Yes, my favorite compressor is the red squeeze. I have run the Interstate Zed and an AC30 together for a good paisley tone, but I tend to put a bit of dirt on these as well (ever so slightly). I have also developed a habit of cranking bias and bias X up to 6-7 for some better natural compression as well (not sure how that would affect my sustain?) I am going to fiddle around with all the amps suggested here and see what I can come up with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunedinDragon Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 I do a bit of country but tend to use a Gretsch Silver Falcon for a more old school sound. I have done some more contemporary country as well using a Strat and I've found the Archetype Clean to be one of the better amps for that ballsy/fat sound. It's got a great full tone and responds well to compressors, especially if you're wanting to get that chicken pickin' kinda tone. The best combination for my has been to use a red squeeze with a relatively quick attack but a generous sustain before the amp. I've also occasionally used the LA Compressor after the amp and cab to give it a bit more meaty tone. The absolute key for me has been to use the OwnHammer 410 Super Reverb cabinet in the OH2F-07 configuration which they classify as a "fat" sounding mix using a Telefunken dynamic mic and a Royer ribbon mic in position 7 (slightly more than halfway between the cone/cap and the rim on the speaker. That's going through a Yamaha DXR12 powered speaker, so your mileage may vary based on what you're using for output and you may want to play a bit with the positioning of the mic's. Hope that's helpful to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talwilkins Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Yea I came from the Wampler Ego Compressor (fantastic pedal) and there was definitely an abundance of sustain... I will check out the Archetype as well... I think I may have made a patch a while ago with that amp in there. Should I try it with the AMP+CAB block or choose an IR? I'm using the Archetype with stock cabs (WhoWatt 100 with 121 ribbon + Cali V30 with 160 ribbon). Sounds great to me. I've tried a few Ownhammer ir's but wasn't that impressed. Sounded good but didn't seem worth the trouble. Could very well be my 'wrong, I don;t know. The ir sounded much better at first but I found out it was quite a bit louder than the stock cabs. After compensating for that the magic went away imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanecgriffo Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 yes i think the archetype may get you there, it has a nice bit of clean heft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidb7170 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I use the tweed blues with the gain at 1.9 or 2.0, channel volume at 7.0, and the stock 4x10 cab with either the 414, or 121 mic at 2.0 inches. I've tried other amp models and keep coming back to this one for my clean country sound... Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbuhajla Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 You may also find that using an IR instead of the on board cab model will get you a better "feel" for clean picking. To me, they feel a bit more responsive in picking articulation and natural feeling when digging in for more meat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewolf48 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I've had some trouble getting FAT, BALLSY clean tones from even the simplest of setups. It seems like I don't have enough....sustain?? I usually go direct to FOH, or when creating presets at home, through my studio monitors (IK Multimedia iLoud Micro Monitors). The tones sound thicker and better to me at home, but on the road sound kinda thin and uninspiring. Without considering the amps or compressors I would start with three questions relating to it sounding better at home than on the stage: 1) What volume are you setting up the sounds with at home? This HAS to be the same volume as you play on stage. This is because of various effects including Fletcher-Munson curves which can effect the perceived sound. 2) What is your home room like? Is is a "lively" room where the sound from the speakers is being reverberated around and therefore you are hearing the sound thickened by reverb at home, but not on stage. You might trying adding a short reverb to your patch. 3) On stage you go through the PA - even though you are going direct and expect that the desk will be flat... is it? The soundman may well be applying low cut and cutting in the lower mids to reduce an overall muddy sound for the band as a whole - if you are getting this eq'd signal back in the monitors then what you hear in stage is not what you are feeding to the desk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyXT Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Try creating a preset starting with the WhoWatt as the amp, running clean; you might be amazed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfsup1955 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Also take a look at the new Archetype Clean +1 ensure the bright switch is on.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojotele65 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 I really dig the Mail-order Twin, I have the Freeman Patches, and his Mail-order twin has a killer clean, as does the Soldano. Sounds great with a tele or a strat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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