shane775 Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Ok, SO, has anybody had one of these pedals start to smoke and give up ? And how would you feel if you was doing an arena full of people on a pro tour and it did ? Well this has happened to my son whilst on tour in Ireland.. Used the unit all night after the show it started to smoke and went off. So, how dangerous is this if it was at home left switched on sitting on the carpet ? I have a helix with no issues since they first got to England and convinced my son to have the helix rather than kemper. So now he's in Ireland on a tour for 2 weeks with no pedal ! i will be interested to see how this is delt with .. i've heard there may be a video of it smoking taken by the crew so hello youtube ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunedinDragon Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 I'm assuming the Helix was set up to use the proper current/voltage in Ireland, or there was a transformer that changed the current/voltage to what the Helix expects??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 I'm assuming the Helix was set up to use the proper current/voltage in Ireland, or there was a transformer that changed the current/voltage to what the Helix expects??? The electrical supply in Ireland is 230v 50hz. The plugs and sockets are different from the USA involving a three-pronged formation, the same as those used in the United Kingdom, so it should have been O.K. Maybe due to an accidental Guinness spillage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Doesn't the Helix automatically adapt to the incoming voltage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Doesn't the Helix automatically adapt to the incoming voltage? THIS! True. Helix is supposed to be 100-240v self sensing, so you can run it anywhere with that supply range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 I'd think it was the Guinness, if it did get splashed. Either that or there was an iffy part in the power supply and it decided to fail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtFarmer Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 If someone spilled a Guinness on your sons board someone should be held responsible for spilling the beer!! How dare they spill a Guinness!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 17, 2017 Author Share Posted April 17, 2017 It's Ireland they would never spill guiness !!!! He was playing at the SSE ARENA BELFAST its an english unit so ireland is the same voltage so cant understand why it went like this !!!. He got the helix on my say so rather than the kemper.. but how can you have faith to go out on stage wondering if your pedal is going to go up in smoke ? i do theatre shows / session stuff and to be honest i'm worried after this.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 If someone spilled a Guinness on your sons board someone should be held responsible for spilling the beer!! How dare they spill a Guinness!!!!! That's a capital crime in Ireland, isn't it? ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Every single mass-produced anything will have some failures. This doesn't appear to be a consistent issue throughout the production of the device. It's a either a fluke or there was some sort of outside issue with the power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunedinDragon Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 It's Ireland they would never spill guiness !!!! He was playing at the SSE ARENA BELFAST its an english unit so ireland is the same voltage so cant understand why it went like this !!!. He got the helix on my say so rather than the kemper.. but how can you have faith to go out on stage wondering if your pedal is going to go up in smoke ? i do theatre shows / session stuff and to be honest i'm worried after this.. If this were a common occurrence with a Helix there'd be quite a number of discussions going on about it. It's possible it's a manufacturing flaw in that particular unit which will happen whether it's a Helix or a Kemper. Until Line 6 is able to examine it, it's hard to say. But it doesn't appear to be a commonplace occurrence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 These things happen on tour... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Oh, please God, Nooooooooooo! Don't say they were playing "Smoke on the Water" at the time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbuhajla Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Always have an identical backup unit that can be switched out in a few seconds when your paycheck depends on it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 17, 2017 Author Share Posted April 17, 2017 OOOOHHHHHH GOD! i could spontaneously combust ! and if i was halfway through a solo people would think it was part of the act and wouldn't bother putting me out !! I get what your saying about a dodgy unit i sent a m20d back because the euro plug didn't fit into the power socket correctly , it was't deep enough. I really like the helix but it is a worry , my son had to advertise on facebook and some kind people sorted him out some pedals and took them to his gig. You can't beat the Irish for hospitality and just being generally nice people !! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 17, 2017 Author Share Posted April 17, 2017 Yeh after this they should give him a spare unit for the grief he has had ! its not like he's doing pub gigs ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunedinDragon Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Always have an identical backup unit that can be switched out in a few seconds when your paycheck depends on it. ^^^^^ This ^^^^^^^ You can bet if I was going to be doing a big arena tour I'd make sure I had a Helix LT sitting there with all the presets loaded, ready to fill in at a moment's notice. But if I was doing a big arena tour, I woudn't think have to think twice about the money that might cost me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 Used the unit all night after the show it started to smoke and went off. Too early to know anything other than it started to destruct. So someone could have spilled beer on it, or peed on it, or who knows what happen but it didn't go when it was pulling the most amps it pulls during the show. To me, that's a bit strange because if some part in Helix was flaky that's when it should have fried, not while sitting at idle after it's on for four hours after the show. My guess (speculation) is something wet helped that process along... So if I'm right, how would you feel OP, if you owned a company that produced a product that got blamed for blowing up for no reason, and found out later someone tipped over a beverage on it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 Too early to know anything other than it started to destruct. So someone could have spilled beer on it, or peed on it, or who knows what happen but it didn't go when it was pulling the most amps it pulls during the show. To me, that's a bit strange because if some part in Helix was flaky that's when it should have fried, not while sitting at idle after it's on for four hours after the show. My guess (speculation) is something wet helped that process along... So if I'm right, how would you feel OP, if you owned a company that produced a product that got blamed for blowing up for no reason, and found out later someone tipped over a beverage on it? No beverages anywhere near it the photo i attached is the pedal before the show ..and the way the helix is built it would take a lot of water spilt on it .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 Too early to know anything other than it started to destruct. So someone could have spilled beer on it, or peed on it, or who knows what happen but it didn't go when it was pulling the most amps it pulls during the show. To me, that's a bit strange because if some part in Helix was flaky that's when it should have fried, not while sitting at idle after it's on for four hours after the show. My guess (speculation) is something wet helped that process along... So if I'm right, how would you feel OP, if you owned a company that produced a product that got blamed for blowing up for no reason, and found out later someone tipped over a beverage on it? No beverages anywhere near it the photo i attached is the pedal before the show ..and the way the helix is built it would take a lot of water spilt on it .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 before it went up in smoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 just looked at my title on the main page ... helix gone up in smoke ! and at the right hand side it says. hot ! .... oh har har har Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 So the photo you attached is before the show... But Helix blew up after the show? So what yer saying is, this happened after the show, so here are pictures before the show for proof? Nothing got moved around "during" the show? Didn't people drink anything during the show? And you would be surprised how moisture can get into places you wouldn't think possible. An overly humid day can cause an arc in the right places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 So the photo you attached is before the show... But Helix blew up after the show? So what yer saying is, this happened after the show, so here are pictures before the show for proof? Nothing got moved around "during" the show? Didn't people drink anything during the show? And you would be surprised how moisture can get into places you wouldn't think possible. An overly humid day can cause an arc in the right places. Yeh i see where your coming from... but no on a gig like that, bottles of water with lids on for each memeber of the band but nobody near the space my son was in with any fluids whatsoever.. Humidity in that place and size temp was roughly the same maybe got a bit hotter but not much.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingsCool Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 As others have said, gotta have a back up ready to go, especially in a situation like that. Garbage owns 18 helices, backups for each system on stage, and then some units for the studio. Even if it's not another Helix, gotta have a backup of some sort that's ready to go. It's electronic. It could have been anything. If no liquids, it could have been a surge, somebody unplugged something on the circuit or did something on the same circuit with another piece of equipment and it shot through the Helix, or, it could be a bad Helix. Of the 10's of thousands of posts I've read about the Helix, this is the first instance I've seen of one spontaneously combusting. But that's not to say it's not possible it had a bad power supply in it. How long has he owned and used it? If he just bought it and only has a few hours on it, it's possible. But if he has several hundred hours on it, seems hard to believe it would pick that moment to bite the dust without some impetus from some electrical surge... In any case, I'm sure Line 6 will help you out with the unit. Sorry it happened though, that sucks. Glad he at least got some gear to keep going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsd512 Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 Like FlyingsCool said, it sucks that happened. That said, this is the first I've seen of anything like this reported on this forum - not sure about others. No matter how well made a unit like the Helix (or Fractal or Kemper or even much cheaper) is, they are mechanical devices with a lot of individual components that are made by manufacturers all over the world - capacitors, inductors, ASICs, resistors, printed circuit boards, relays, switches, connectors, cables, etc, etc. Not to mention the cables that connect the Helix to other out-board devices - a cable failure there due to a short circuit within the external cable and shorts out one of the output jacks could ultimately be the culprit. One thing for sure - it is 100% guaranteed that a mechanical device WILL fail at some point. It's unfortunate that it happened to your unit - or external cables that lead to the failure through cascade - not sure how long you've owned it or the service hours on it, but it sounds like it had an early demise. That's not necessarily an indictment of the build quality or Line 6. The parts list in the Helix likely numbers in the 1000's. With each component the probability of failure goes up, even if the the probability of any one part is extraordinarily low. And then considering what the Helix is connected to and that cabling - narrowing down the exact cause is not necessarily easy. As many others have said, having a backup is essential for a live - real-time application where loss of the unit has large economic impact. There's a reason why life-support systems, the stock-market, aircraft, and other systems have not just one but multiple redundant systems. Even under the super-strict and super-tested procedures those systems must adhere to, they are still prone to failure and require backup systems. Playing for an audience won't cost lives, but definitely can cost economically and affect your reputation. Given that, I'd think the money spent on a backup system would be money well-spent. There's just no getting around that a failure WILL occur, eventually. It's not a matter of IF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 Update on the issue >>> Line 6 authorised a shop in Dublin to give my son another helix getting him out of the lollipop really quickly ... Thinking back its the reason why ive been using their products since 2006 becuse if i ever had a problem i could talk to them and they would sort it .. So i was a bit worried to see yamaha had took over but they seem commited to being there for their users.. After looking all over the net what has happened to the unit has only happened once before that i can find, and in however many units that have been sold that is a fantastic percentage to be fair! At the end of the day the problem was delt with by line 6 very swiftly and couldn't fault their effort in their aftersales department in going the extra mile to sort out this problem.. I still love my helix and to be honest if it went bang i'd buy another one !!! Can't wait for the native plugin .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 As others have said, gotta have a back up ready to go, especially in a situation like that. Garbage owns 18 helices, backups for each system on stage, and then some units for the studio. Even if it's not another Helix, gotta have a backup of some sort that's ready to go. It's electronic. It could have been anything. If no liquids, it could have been a surge, somebody unplugged something on the circuit or did something on the same circuit with another piece of equipment and it shot through the Helix, or, it could be a bad Helix. Of the 10's of thousands of posts I've read about the Helix, this is the first instance I've seen of one spontaneously combusting. But that's not to say it's not possible it had a bad power supply in it. How long has he owned and used it? If he just bought it and only has a few hours on it, it's possible. But if he has several hundred hours on it, seems hard to believe it would pick that moment to bite the dust without some impetus from some electrical surge... In any case, I'm sure Line 6 will help you out with the unit. Sorry it happened though, that sucks. Glad he at least got some gear to keep going. He has had it about 2 months i think ..line 6 came through and sorted it quickly so he's back up and running now : ) god only knows what it was but all is gooooood : ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane775 Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 Like FlyingsCool said, it sucks that happened. That said, this is the first I've seen of anything like this reported on this forum - not sure about others. No matter how well made a unit like the Helix (or Fractal or Kemper or even much cheaper) is, they are mechanical devices with a lot of individual components that are made by manufacturers all over the world - capacitors, inductors, ASICs, resistors, printed circuit boards, relays, switches, connectors, cables, etc, etc. Not to mention the cables that connect the Helix to other out-board devices - a cable failure there due to a short circuit within the external cable and shorts out one of the output jacks could ultimately be the culprit. One thing for sure - it is 100% guaranteed that a mechanical device WILL fail at some point. It's unfortunate that it happened to your unit - or external cables that lead to the failure through cascade - not sure how long you've owned it or the service hours on it, but it sounds like it had an early demise. That's not necessarily an indictment of the build quality or Line 6. The parts list in the Helix likely numbers in the 1000's. With each component the probability of failure goes up, even if the the probability of any one part is extraordinarily low. And then considering what the Helix is connected to and that cabling - narrowing down the exact cause is not necessarily easy. As many others have said, having a backup is essential for a live - real-time application where loss of the unit has large economic impact. There's a reason why life-support systems, the stock-market, aircraft, and other systems have not just one but multiple redundant systems. Even under the super-strict and super-tested procedures those systems must adhere to, they are still prone to failure and require backup systems. Playing for an audience won't cost lives, but definitely can cost economically and affect your reputation. Given that, I'd think the money spent on a backup system would be money well-spent. There's just no getting around that a failure WILL occur, eventually. It's not a matter of IF. Yeh i know what your saying i'd want a backup of a backup etc.. but line 6 sorted it quickly can't fault them and i've always found their gear very reliable to be honest .. first thing i got him to check was phantom power but that was off and the helix has protection even if it wasn't so i'm at a loss as nothing had changed from in the gig to the end and it was the end of the gig that it happened so i'm at a loss ... but as i said line 6 sorted out another pedal so he's happy and carring on with his tour.. so hats off to them : ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeltheyoung Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 Same thing happened to me at an event this past weekend, in the USA. Helix was plugged into a power conditioner, which itself was on a circuit powering nothing other than a monitor and someone's iPhone. Absolutely no reason to believe it wasn't getting proper power. Suddenly turned off, then turned back on and "strobed" for a while before shutting down for good, at which point, we could all smell smoke clearly coming from the unit. I have a support ticket open and plan to have it repaired; suspect a blown capacitor, but will report back when I know. And yes, of course you should always have a backup rig (the band bought a spare HX Stomp since all 3 guitarists are using Helix). Love to hear if anyone else had this issue or has had it diagnosed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 Those "after warranty diodes" are everywhere man!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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