Line 6, can we please have your perspective concerning Helix tuner issues.

[robbieb61]

Lately? Don't be ridiculous...they don't act at all these days. ;)

Line 6 or Congress? LOL!

 

I heard that DI is appointing a special counsel to investigate possible Russian collusion with the tuner... 

[BINGEWOOD]

C'mon guys, you know they're all great actors...

[mileskb]

Here's my vid. Just made it. 

Brand new Ernie Ball Paradigm strings on my Floyd Rose Model K Redmond Series guitar (these new Paradigm strings are GREAT by the way)

 

I'm using the Helix tuner and my Korg rackmount DTR 2000 tuner (which has the same exact specs as I have seen posted here about the Helix tuners specs)

 

Started with the guitar in tune. 

 

Observe how the Korg "grabs" the note very quickly. The Helix meanwhile tends to jump all around, and on the D string it was just reading wrong. 

My complaint has been since I first got my Helix back in Oct. of 2015 that the tuner was too jumpy. And that was when it only had the one bar.  Now with two bars...it's double-jumpy! LOL!

 

As I said before...most of us who play in professional bands only have a couple of seconds to check our tuning between songs. Not a lot of dead air in a pro band that is putting on a show. The drummer is counting off the next song before the last song has finished ringing out. 

The jumpiness is unacceptable for me. 

Here's the vid:

 

 

This is definitely a perception thing.  First off...  At not point was your guitar actually "out of tune" but the two tuners displayed different things...  I prefer the Helix or my Peterson Strobe.  Neither will ever come to rest a note, or very briefly...  as that is the nature of the guitar string.  I have an older Sabine, and while it's not as granular as the Helix or the Strobe, I don't think it ever locks on a note like that Korg does, and I prefer it that way... because I know the guitar is fluctuating as well.

 

Maybe Line 6 could put a "response" control on the tuner so it's response can act like other tuners.

[marmatkat]

http://line6.com/support/topic/20276-inconsistent-and-inaccurate-tuner/page-4?do=findComment&comment=222650

 

 

Have you submitted a ticket to Line 6 regarding your concerns?

Do you have a video showing your issue?

Do you have a similar video showing use of a tuner which you consider to react better?

In your ticket, did you state the model of guitar and pickups and other relevant information

 

I read through the other thread, and only saw one video posted, and that is from a satisfied user showing response similar to what I'd expect.

 

I don't see how Line 6 can give any response without direct evidence of an actual problem.  I've seen lots of people talk about it from both sides, but nobody has posted a video showing a problem besides fenderod, and there was no problem there.

 

(Full disclosure: I personally have no problem with the tuner, and when I tune my guitar I get a response similar to fenderod.)

[brue58ski]

Re: Line 6's perspective. Read this.

 

http://line6.com/support/topic/20276-inconsistent-and-inaccurate-tuner/

 

Post #35. So they are working on it in some way. Just maybe not the way some people want.

 

THIS IS WRONG. THE POST QUOTED WAS MADE BEFORE THE LAST UPDATE. MY MISTAKE, SORRY.

[MusicLaw]

@marmatkat you may also post your comment here: https://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?threads/helixs-tuner-how-do-you-feel-about-its-stability.1825918/#post-24100035 As you may know, several Line 6 reps participate on TGP.

 

The above notwithstanding, I remain optimistic that after the current priorities of releasing Helix Native and subsequently firmware 2.3 w/ the overhauled Helix Editor, that improved stability of Helix Tuner's display (perhaps w/ some Display Options) may be on Line 6's To Do List for Helix's generation 3 series of Helix Core firmware.

[johnfrancis]

I am relatively new to Helix and definitely late to the tuner party, but I do find the Helix tuner to be more difficult to use than anything else I have ever tried. Having said that, I always seem to be in tune with the rest of the band, so it is certainly not inaccurate. Mine has difficulty picking up the lower strings quickly - especially the low E - so it can be frustrating trying to quickly check tuning between songs.

[gunpointmetal]

It won't register the low A on my 9-string guitars, either...

[PeterHamm]

Submitted for your consideration. I didn't even prepare for this by practicing. I just made the video as quick and dirty as I could.

 

StroboStomp 2 vs. Helix tuner.

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cSRbffNC5wI

[robbieb61]

I am relatively new to Helix and definitely late to the tuner party, but I do find the Helix tuner to be more difficult to use than anything else I have ever tried. Having said that, I always seem to be in tune with the rest of the band, so it is certainly not inaccurate. Mine has difficulty picking up the lower strings quickly - especially the low E - so it can be frustrating trying to quickly check tuning between songs.

Yeah, I'm used to being able to quickly check all 6 strings to make sure they are in tune between songs...and a lot of times we go from one song to the next, so you literally only have a 4 count from the drummer to do a quick check.

Every other tuner I have owned since 1977 has been able to do that...except the Helix.  :(

[mileskb]

Submitted for your consideration. I didn't even prepare for this by practicing. I just made the video as quick and dirty as I could.

 

StroboStomp 2 vs. Helix tuner.

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cSRbffNC5wI

 

 

I am curious to see what people get out of this.   My opinion is that, Wow, the Helix is super accurate and easy to tune.  As soon as you see the >  and < light up together... move on.

 

This does take a little practice, because your eyes want to look at the big bars across the bottom, but as an experiment, other than the low E string thing which is weird..  watch this video again, but take an envelope or piece of cardboard and hold it over the bars so you only see the NOTE and the >  <  marks.   You will get a whole different perspective.   The fact that the little bars are drifting is meaningless.   If the two >< are lit... you are in tune.  

 

I know it sounds silly...  but go ahead and try it.  Watch the video with something covering the bars... and you'll see it's spot on with the Petersen as it should be.

[PeterHamm]

Yeah, I'm used to being able to quickly check all 6 strings to make sure they are in tune between songs...and a lot of times we go from one song to the next, so you literally only have a 4 count from the drummer to do a quick check.

Every other tuner I have owned since 1977 has been able to do that...except the Helix.   :(

 

 

Yup, and I contend that this is because the Helix tuner is too accurate for such use. And for what you describe, there is NOTHING like a PolyTune. Every guitarist who plays live in such situations should have one.

[DBCrocky]

Firstly, it is my understanding that originally, the Helix tuner did not have the sensitive strip on top.  People complained, and they put this there.  Ok.  Solution 1, it could be made into an option.

 

But what it sounds like is that some of these other tuners have a "lock" feature.  So your getting a stream of readings that are all slightly varying due to the physical imperfections of string and pickup properties.  To turn that into a tuning lock, you could have an algorithm that looks at an average of the last N readings, and if it is within a certain range (range A) of perfect tune, the lock is engaged and the tuner display shows (using some graphic) that you are in tune, until such time as the average of the last N readings goes outside of a certain range (range B ).  The lock can be a little more solid if range B is set higher than range A.  Playing with different values of A, B and N, you could add this lock ability to the tuner.

 

I think this is what some of the users are asking for, even though they may not be very good at articulating it. 

[robbieb61]

But what it sounds like is that some of these other tuners have a "lock" feature.  

That's what I've been saying.

 

Back "in the day" (for me the late 1970's and the '80's forward)... when you would read Guitar Player or Guitar World, etc.  the ads for different guitar tuners would literally BRAG about their tuners ability to "lock on" to the note for fast efficient tuning.

 

THAT is what the Helix is not doing.  And that ability is uber-important to a musician playing in a live band that puts on a pro-show without a lot of "dead-air" between songs. 

That's what's frustrating for me. 

 

For instance...I get to a gig. First thing I do is get my guitars out to get acclimated to the room temperature. Then I set up my rig. 

I let the guitars sit for as long as I can before we play.  So a few minutes before we start...then I tune. 

Helix takes a lot longer to tune with (which is frustrating to begin with). 

Granted my guitars rarely go out of tune very much. I only use top quality guitars and have set them up nicely.

 

But having said that, I still try to check the tuning between songs...especially if I played an aggressive solo on the previous song. 

It's just not possible with the Helix tuner because of all the jumpiness. 

 

That's my complaint. Every other tuner I have ever owned since the 1970's was able to be used quickly between songs. Every one of them. The Helix just doesn't seem to be able to lock in and stabilize itself. 

I've seen people on here talking about physics and guitar strings vibrating as if they are talking about something that everyone didn't already know. 

That was the point of all those company's bragging about their respective tuners being able to lock down the note for tuning ease. :)

[MusicLaw]

Boiled down to the essence:

<Snip> ...with the Helix tuner because of all the jumpiness. <Snip> The Helix just doesn't seem to be able to lock in and stabilize itself. <Snip>

[robbieb61]

I've been snipped! Ouch! Lol

[MusicLaw]

I've been snipped! Ouch! Lol

Good one! ;)

[marmatkat]

This is a good description of the problem.

 

Re using the "> <" without looking at the bars, this is one of the first things I tried. Results were like those with a Snark - every strung slightly off depending on how consistent you tune each string - nearly impossible to get a good tuneup.

 

That's what I've been saying.

 

Back "in the day" (for me the late 1970's and the '80's forward)... when you would read Guitar Player or Guitar World, etc. the ads for different guitar tuners would literally BRAG about their tuners ability to "lock on" to the note for fast efficient tuning.

 

THAT is what the Helix is not doing. And that ability is uber-important to a musician playing in a live band that puts on a pro-show without a lot of "dead-air" between songs.

That's what's frustrating for me.

 

For instance...I get to a gig. First thing I do is get my guitars out to get acclimated to the room temperature. Then I set up my rig.

I let the guitars sit for as long as I can before we play. So a few minutes before we start...then I tune.

Helix takes a lot longer to tune with (which is frustrating to begin with).

Granted my guitars rarely go out of tune very much. I only use top quality guitars and have set them up nicely.

 

But having said that, I still try to check the tuning between songs...especially if I played an aggressive solo on the previous song.

It's just not possible with the Helix tuner because of all the jumpiness.

 

That's my complaint. Every other tuner I have ever owned since the 1970's was able to be used quickly between songs. Every one of them. The Helix just doesn't seem to be able to lock in and stabilize itself.

I've seen people on here talking about physics and guitar strings vibrating as if they are talking about something that everyone didn't already know.

That was the point of all those company's bragging about their respective tuners being able to lock down the note for tuning ease. :)

[klangmaler]

Again my hint concerning the tuner settings:

'Determines which input the tuner will listen to. Normally, you should choose "Multi," which listens to the Guitar, Aux, and Variax inputs simultaneously.' (manual, p. 33)

Double check what you really want to tune - "Multi" is not the proper option in many cases -

and what / how many cable(s) you put in ;).