Line 6 Proffessional Tone Room

[mikegibbo52]

Ok I have had my Helix for a month now, bought some patches, some good some not quite there. I play covers so I am spending hours trying to duplicate original sounds. I am getting there slowly, but some sounds are thin and tinny on the high strings and flabby and basy on the low, but OK in the middle 3rd and 4th strings and it's driving me nuts.

My previous peddle is a GT 100 from Boss and the learning curve was quick, go to the Tone Room from Boss who had Proffessional musicians create patches for songs which could be down loaded. Easy campezee.

Unfortunately I still have to gig with my Boss pedal cause every time I use the Helix the band members look at me strange like " What the"

Now I really want to use the Helix but I am loosing my enthusiasm cause I just can't seem to get the voicing of the sounds close enough.

We play mainly 70's Bryan Adams, Eagles, Doobies, Dragon, Santana, Stones, Led Zep, AC/DC etc.

Have the Glenn DeLaune patches but looking for individual songs like Run to You with 3 snapshots for Intro, verse and Lead 1 and Lead 2 with 5th harmony. I can create the mechanics of it but not nail the sound.

Searched custom tones and no luck.

[shanecgriffo]

have you followed advice here on hi/lo cuts?- that can make a big difference up at volume.. added a compressor? tried the transistor tape delay before the amp with delay and fb set to minimum.? (it evens out the strings balance a bit , thickens the sound) .. also you need to set up your sounds/tweak at something approaching gig/rehearsal volume to allow for the fletcher munson effect. If you are just used to the convenience of using someone elses presets and not doing it yourself you probably have some more work to do.

[rvroberts]

OK - I'm basically giving a more detailed version of the above - firstly you don't tell us how you are using the Helix - through an amp or FRFR.

The Helix is like an amp in a studio with a mic on it - and you are in the control room - well if you run FRFR that is.  If you are running into an amp, how are you set up? 4 cable method?

And what amp and speakers?.  You can't nail any sound if you are running into the front of an amp - the amp will rule the overall sound and you should mostly avoid amp and cab sims.  Use the Helix as an effects rack/pedal board - don't use amps and cabs (I've seen people use preamps like a valve overdrive effectively though)

If you are running FRFR, there are 2 equally valid approaches - but they both boil down to the fact that you need to tailor your EQ to a realistic guitar speaker sound - the Helix can put out way more bottom and top than a guitar speaker - so you need to deal with that.  You either use high and low cuts within each patch, or you do it in global EQ.  Basically anything below say 100Hz and above 5000-6000Hz is probably going to give you an unpleasant result.  So cut outside those frequencies drastically. Compounding this is using IRs.  As these simulate speakers, depending how they were made they might or might not have some degree if this effect built in already!  From what you describe, this is where your problem starts.

Downloading patches is all fine, but depending on your rig and the rig the patch was created for, the chances are you will still not get the result you are after without tweaking.  Do you have a past of using amps and pedals?  If so, the Helix does a really good job of duplicating that.  If you don't, you are at a bit of a disadvantage creating guitar tone - as everyone is trying to produce sounds created originally the analog way.  If that kind of tweaking is not for you, then you probably won't get along with the Helix - "Easy campezee" sounds Aussie to me?

If you decide to sell in in a few months - let me know!

[laxtlo]

Aussie Aussie Aussie OI OI OI ! D I´ve been in down under several times and i love Australia !! Map of tassie :)

[shanecgriffo]

as an australian, that aussie oi oi oi thing is so cringeworthy i gotta say..

 

but glad you like the country, i just hope not for the 2 listed reasons alone haha

😊

[the_bees_knees22]

Mics make huge difference.  Research what each one is like "real world", and it'll give you a pretty good idea of which ones are good for what.  There's no telling what a band actually used in the studio.  It's probably a combination of a lot of things.

I personally really like the 121 ribbon for something modern and chunky sounding for guitar.  For bass the 4038, or 112  etc..  or a combination.

Anyway it'll be really tough to duplicate a sound exactly.  You're dealing with multiple tracks of a part on an album.  Your best bet is to do some kind of dual amp chain, pan one left one right.  You might use the same head and cab, but use different mics.  etc.  There are tons of different ways to thicken up a sound if you're trying to match something on an album.

If I were you I'd just try and get a really good sound you like, and not worry about matching an album.  I mean bands don't even match their sound totally on their albums either. 


 

Ok I have had my Helix for a month now, bought some patches, some good some not quite there. I play covers so I am spending hours trying to duplicate original sounds. I am getting there slowly, but some sounds are thin and tinny on the high strings and flabby and basy on the low, but OK in the middle 3rd and 4th strings and it's driving me nuts.
My previous peddle is a GT 100 from Boss and the learning curve was quick, go to the Tone Room from Boss who had Proffessional musicians create patches for songs which could be down loaded. Easy campezee.
Unfortunately I still have to gig with my Boss pedal cause every time I use the Helix the band members look at me strange like " What the"
Now I really want to use the Helix but I am loosing my enthusiasm cause I just can't seem to get the voicing of the sounds close enough.
We play mainly 70's Bryan Adams, Eagles, Doobies, Dragon, Santana, Stones, Led Zep, AC/DC etc.
Have the Glenn DeLaune patches but looking for individual songs like Run to You with 3 snapshots for Intro, verse and Lead 1 and Lead 2 with 5th harmony. I can create the mechanics of it but not nail the sound.
Searched custom tones and no luck.

[mikegibbo52]

Thanks everyone, it so cool to get immediate responses that direct me to resolve my issues. I guess what I struggle with is the correct settings like compression and noise gates. Yes I do run direct into a P A. At home I use a Turbosound IP 2000 and the sounds I have done correctly do sound fantastic. I guess the frustration of not using it yet after over a month is a pain cause I'm so keen to use it. Spending days and days playing with it week after week and moving forward so slowly is the reason I would like to search out song patches. This week we have an outdoor gig with over a thousand people coming and I can't see me being ready with the Helix. So glad I did not sell my GT 100 yet. Yep I'm an Aussie, have a bonsa day from the land down under. Cheer thanks for the help.

[shanecgriffo]

i'd be inclined to go with what you know for this gig.. stick to the boss, to save any stress ..but keep chipping away at that helix for the future- you'll appreciate the extra detail and response when you get there .. maybe your band mates were'nt looking at you about the sound, dont be too O.C about the sound, if you're fumbling and tweaking around trying to get the exact sound at rehearsal or playing in a distracted way, that is really going to annoy your bandmates.. just find an approximate sound and put your whole self into your playing, you might be surprised.

[specracer986]

By your description, I'm inclined to think the hi/lo cuts on your cabs, as shane suggested above, will tighten up your tone.

[mikegibbo52]

Had a chance today to try all the suggestions and using the values recommended for Hi/Low Cut. Tried in the global settings, which work well. Went through 30 of my 45 song patches, added a few minor tweaks and very happy with the progress so far. Can see the light at the end of the tunnel now.

Thanks everyone for your input.

Very much appreciated.

Mike

[zooey]

Glad you're making progress :)

 

Please excuse if what I'm about to say has been covered, don't have time to read everything right now, but ideally you build your patches to sound good to you without ​any global EQ, so you can use it to compensate for unusual room sound. Typically you'd apply the gobal EQ only to the 1/4" outs, which you'd use to drive your stage monitoring, and not to the XLRs, which you'd send to FOH. That way you can use it to make yourself happy without affecting the PA, which presumably gets adjusted by your sound person to work well in the room.

[jbuhajla]

Thanks everyone, it so cool to get immediate responses that direct me to resolve my issues. I guess what I struggle with is the correct settings like compression and noise gates. Yes I do run direct into a P A. At home I use a Turbosound IP 2000 and the sounds I have done correctly do sound fantastic. I guess the frustration of not using it yet after over a month is a pain cause I'm so keen to use it. Spending days and days playing with it week after week and moving forward so slowly is the reason I would like to search out song patches. This week we have an outdoor gig with over a thousand people coming and I can't see me being ready with the Helix. So glad I did not sell my GT 100 yet. Yep I'm an Aussie, have a bonsa day from the land down under. Cheer thanks for the help.

Keep in mind that the tones you set up at home on the Turbosound system may not sound quite the same playing through whatever PA you do at gigs. Try to set up your tones at home as close to gig volumes as reasonably possible. Also, your tones that sound good at home may not sound quite right in the mix with the entire band playing. 

 

Not trying to burst your bubble, but those are all things to consider. 

 

Most of the time if you pick the same type of guitar pickup, amplifier, appropriate cab model, and a few of the similar effects of a track you are trying to duplicate, it is good enough. Once you start playing the guitar part on Run to You, everyone knows what song that is. They are not noticing that you are not using the exact same overdrive pedal as the original recording. It is REALLY easy to get caught in the "nail that tone" whirlpool that will just suck you under. 

[mikegibbo52]

Thanks everyone for your help again. It is so fantastic to get so many helpful hints.

Cheers