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MarkJarvis

When will we see new models and firmware for helix??

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Nahhh. That wouldnt be a new effect now would it?

Semantics.

 

I'm 100% content with what's in the box already. But some Strymon level stuff would be welcomed!

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or did you mean fx from older units that aren't currently in the helix.?

I meant updating some of the HD models in the Helix to HX level models. I'd imagine that it's going to happen sooner or later.

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Semantics.

 

That doesnt make a lot of sense.  Of course there is going to be room for mis interpretation if your message is unclear.

 

Helix is getting 7 new FX.  Are they going to tweak models from the HD and try to slip them past us under new names? Will they simply tell everyone that they are an updated effect from an older modeler? Are they brand new fx from the ground up? Nobody knows for sure other than the powers that be, but what IS 100% clear to me is that Helix will have the ability to load 7 new fx that were not available before.

 

If they ARE updated fx from an older line 6 modeler, and i find that unlikely,  as long as it sounds good it really shouldnt make a difference where the effect comes from. 

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...

If they ARE updated fx from an older line 6 modeler, and i find that unlikely,  as long as it sounds good it really shouldnt make a difference where the effect comes from. 

 

I feel exactly the same way. As long as the currently existing models and any new effect, amp model or whatever is updated to take full advantage of the new architecture, codeline, and hardware of the Helix I don't care if it is pulled from an old Pod or built from the ground up. Not looking to throw out the baby with the bathwater. If there is a great effect to be had from Line6's older devices or for that matter anywhere else it has the potential to make an excellent addition to the Helix. It seems though as if the gold standard would be to update it so it takes full advantage of the Helix's capabilities.

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I feel exactly the same way. As long as the currently existing models and any new effect, amp model or whatever is updated to take full advantage of the new architecture, codeline, and hardware of the Helix I don't care if it is pulled from an old Pod or built from the ground up. Not looking to throw out the baby with the bathwater. If there is a great effect to be had from Helix's older devices or for that matter anywhere else it has the potential to make an excellent addition to the Helix. It seems though as if the gold standard would be to update it so it takes full advantage of the Helix's capabilities.

lol@ baby with bathwater.....Ya know, i wanted to start a topic a while back asking what fx or models people really missed from their old line 6 modeler, because at the time i was missing the compression from my old POD 2.0. Id also hear of certain amps and things that people missed.  I figured L6 would never listen to one guy, and having an idea scale idea come to fruition is about as likely as hitting the lottery.

 

In my case, i think i just learned how to get a comparable sound from Helix, though i still miss that one.

 

Back to my other comment: Ive only ever owned a POD 2.0 so an effect from the HD is still a brand new effect to me.

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I'm 100% content with the Helix as is. I usually run pretty basic patches. Minimal effects.

 

But it has been confirmed that all of the reverb effects and 2 wahs at launch were ports of the HD/M series effects.

 

A lot of folks have been clamouring for HX optimized reverb effects. That's why I would not be shocked if we got some of them replaced entirely.

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Speaking purely selfishly, I'd love a Diezel Einstein model.

You mean VH4, of course.  And yes...Diezel...PLEASE.  

 

I recently bought the VH4 pedal, and it's pretty damn awesome, but it's only channel 3

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Semantics.

 

I'm 100% content with what's in the box already. But some Strymon level stuff would be welcomed!

 

I've said this before, I don't think Helix can sound as good or have as much variation in the effect as Strymon pedals can and do. I'm not saying that Helix's FX sounds bad by any stretch. It just that Big Sky, TimeLine and Mobius sound just gorgeous. In fact, I'll go so far as to say you have not really heard reverb until you have used a BigSky. It's that good IMO. I own both products so it's not me talking out my butt so much   :P  without some use of both products. While Helix is using the SHARC processor separately for all its FX, Strymon uses the same processor for "each" one of its pedals. So with thoses who own the 3 Strymons, it's like having 4 SHARC processors in using them with the awesome sounding amps in Helix!

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I'll go so far as to say you have not really heard reverb until you have used a BigSky. It's that good IMO.

 

Meris' Mercury 7 is the one to beat these days. The thing is sick. Also made by ex-Line 6ers.

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Have not heard that one yet DI- thanks for the heads up.

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I've said this before, I don't think Helix can sound as good or have as much variation in the effect as Strymon pedals can and do. I'm not saying that Helix's FX sounds bad by any stretch. It just that Big Sky, TimeLine and Mobius sound just gorgeous. In fact, I'll go so far as to say you have not really heard reverb until you have used a BigSky. It's that good IMO. I own both products so it's not me talking out my butt so much :P without some use of both products. While Helix is using the SHARC processor separately for all its FX, Strymon uses the same processor for "each" one of its pedals. So with thoses who own the 3 Strymons, it's like having 4 SHARC processors in using them with the awesome sounding amps in Helix!

I've used a Big Sky, and I can't disagree!

I just can't justify spending that much more right now!

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Meris' Mercury 7 is the one to beat these days. The thing is sick. Also made by ex-Line 6ers.

 

Have both the BigSky and the Mercury7... They're both amazing. I like the Mercury7 because everything is right there as far as editing parameters.

 

Have you seen this madness? https://www.meris.us/product/polymoon-pedal/

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I've said this before, I don't think Helix can sound as good or have as much variation in the effect as Strymon pedals can and do. I'm not saying that Helix's FX sounds bad by any stretch. It just that Big Sky, TimeLine and Mobius sound just gorgeous. In fact, I'll go so far as to say you have not really heard reverb until you have used a BigSky. It's that good IMO. I own both products so it's not me talking out my butt so much   :P  without some use of both products. While Helix is using the SHARC processor separately for all its FX, Strymon uses the same processor for "each" one of its pedals. So with thoses who own the 3 Strymons, it's like having 4 SHARC processors in using them with the awesome sounding amps in Helix!

 

Well I think the SHARC chip Strymon uses in their pedals is a generation or two behind what's used in the Helix... Also, the big Strymon pedals offer spillover between presets, so their algorithms aren't eating up all the available DSP. So, there's no technical reason why the Helix could run those algorithms. They probably would be pretty DSP-intensive, but I would suspect they wouldn't be use as much as say, an amp model.

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Well I think the SHARC chip Strymon uses in their pedals is a generation or two behind what's used in the Helix... 

 

 

 

Link please?

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Link please?

 

Here you go: http://www.strymon.net/dsp-anyway/

 

For most Strymon digital pedals, the SHARC DSP’s clock frequency is 266 MHz (BigSky’s is 366 MHz)

 

I'm not sure what SHARC model numbers those correspond to, but, the Helix is using two of the 450MHz ADSP-21469 SHARCs. The TimeLine was released in 2011, and the BigSky in the beginning of 2014 (the Mobius was in between those two). So it just makes sense that the Helix would using a more powerful chip, since it was released later.

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Ahh I see yer point as Helix does indeed have the faster (and probably newer) processor. But once again, it also has to share that processing power for ALL of its FX, whereas Strymon uses one SHARC processor per FX box. Like I said earlier, I think Helix sounds wonderful. I just prefer the sounds of the Strymon FX (and as you know from what you have, variety is the spice of life).  ;)  

 

Off topic but, I wonder why Line6 didn't use the more powerful "TigerSHARCs" in Helix, like Fractal does in the AxeFX?

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Yep, Meris is king and Angelo is an absolute mad scientist. And a super cool guy—loved working with him back in the day.

Off topic but, I wonder why Line6 didn't use the more powerful "TigerSHARCs" in Helix, like Fractal does in the AxeFX?

It was a big enough deal asking people to jump from $500 to $1500 for Line 6's flagship processor. Jumping from $500 to $2000-2500 would've been a bridge too far—yes, the TigerSHARCs are that expensive (no, we wouldn't have gotten a measurably better deal on them than Fractal). Besides, we were able to accomplish everything we set out to with the two 450MHz SHARCs, and the HX platform still has tons of room for more stuff. Things may appear to have slowed down a bit, but we're working on overdrive—not only on new models and features (some of which won't make the 2.30 cutoff), but new toys as well.

It's an exciting time to be at Line 6.

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I was under the impression that the TigerSHARCs that Fractal uses in the Axe FX II have been discontinued without a direct replacement. Perhaps AD believes the performance gap between the SHARC and TigerSHARC has narrowed enough that having two separate lines no longer makes sense?

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Thanks for the info guys- Next time DI, please forgo the "bean-counters" and naysayers, and use the best and fastest screamin @ssed thing available (think Vetta in the now) for Helix-2. If you make it, we will come  ;)

 

 

 

Things may appear to have slowed down a bit, but we're working on overdrive—not only on new models and features (some of which won't make the 2.30 cutoff), but new toys as well.

It's an exciting time to be at Line 6.

 

 

 
 
MOST EXCELLENT NEWS! Thanks DI for that tidbit.

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I guess that DI is eager to tell us what the new firmware update will deliver to us... but he`s gonna respect the NDA he signed no matter what...  ;)

Hope the Diezel and the Randalls make it through...

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I'm more excited to see the new Toys, new Features, Enhancements, and Improvements than the new Amp models.

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I'm more excited to see the new Toys, new Features, Enhancements, and Improvements than the new Amp models.

Me too!!! I like the tones I get overall, it’s the little things I want to be able to do to the signal that I’m missing. What are they? Well, you’ll have to look at the things I’ve posted on Ideascale.

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As much as I love new goodies, I've arrived at a point where there are really no amp or effect cravings I have that aren't already satisfied by Helix's current offerings (plus a couple of physical pedals in the loops). I've drifted into the camp that would like to see more focus on functionality improvements like more IR slots, the ability to split/merge more than once in a path, and the ability to assign snapshots to footswitches in 10-Stomp mode. 

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Improved stock cabs and new reverbs,

two things that have huge impact in guitar sound?

If Meris Mercury 7 is that "one to beat" it will be very good news if you

try to reach for that at L6.

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two things that have huge impact in guitar sound?

  

Reverb wouldnt be very high on the list if even at all. The two that would have the most influence would be 1) ability to dial the modeler and then 2) the cab.Probably amp modeling quality after that and then guitar quality. Dont forget about the player. He probably slots in around #3. In the hardware world we might have a different arrangement of importance.I can still think of a few things on my checklist before reverb.  Though sure, some nice verbs would be lovely.

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As much as I love new goodies, I've arrived at a point where there are really no amp or effect cravings I have that aren't already satisfied by Helix's current offerings (plus a couple of physical pedals in the loops). I've drifted into the camp that would like to see more focus on functionality improvements like more IR slots, the ability to split/merge more than once in a path, and the ability to assign snapshots to footswitches in 10-Stomp mode.

Yup.

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Reverb wouldnt be very high on the list if even at all. The two that would have the most influence would be 1) ability to dial the modeler and then 2) the cab.Probably amp modeling quality after that and then guitar quality. Dont forget about the player. He probably slots in around #3. In the hardware world we might have a different arrangement of importance.I can still think of a few things on my checklist before reverb.  Though sure, some nice verbs would be lovely.

If we are talking about the MOST important thing in guitarsound i agree, but disagree about the verbs.

A very good reverb vs a ok one will have a huge impact imo, not only in sound but your creativity as a guitarist,

we all know what good reverb can do to a guitarsound!! ex. the Mercury 7, and those other big ones!

Even a "cheap" Boss RV5/6 have some better verbs than the ones in Helix, at least for me!

Don't get me wrong the verbs in Helix are fine,but would love to see some new ones and belive they are coming and think

they will be awesome!

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Sure reverb can have a great impact on the sound, but no more than delay chorus or any other effect. A very good delay or a wha wha, can have the same effect on ones sound and creativity.  Its just an effect. Its not as if reverb does a better job with this than all the other fx. Its all in what floats a persons boat. Its subjective. 

 

Can you still consistently build a great guitar sound without reverb? Yes. Can you without the others ive mentioned? No. Will reverb make a great sound better? Not always.

 

Todays guitar sounds are more dry/up front than ever. Reverb is less of a factor today than it ever was. Thats not to say that its not important, but i think you are placing too much value on reverb and what it does to a guitar sound, because YOU have fun playing it.

 

Just to reiterate, I am very much looking forward to improved reverbs.

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Yea, besides the Diezel models, there really isn't much else in the high gain area to want or need.  I am def on board with some better reverbs.  I think legit reverbs will be the big game changer in the next update if we get them

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As far as better stock cabs, the majority of legit players, and producers use impulses.  The new Ownhammer Zilla cabs are utterly devastating.  For me, I don't think I would ever use stock cabs.  Unless its some kind of ground breaking update, I just don't see the need.  

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Although I have some preferences (Metal Zone pedal, better reverbs, maybe a more intuituve compressor) I was totally fine with whatever was going to come along in the next update...

 

...then I had a dream the other night where the update was announced, and it was "7 new effects pedals: 5 new overdrives, including a reworked tube screamer, and 2 fuzzes", which made me wake up with a cold sweat.

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I was under the impression that the TigerSHARCs that Fractal uses in the Axe FX II have been discontinued without a direct replacement. Perhaps AD believes the performance gap between the SHARC and TigerSHARC has narrowed enough that having two separate lines no longer makes sense?

Probably just a sales thing—TigerSHARCs weren't utilized as often. The new dual-core Griffins are in practice about 1.9x the power of the fastest non-TigerSHARC SHARC, but spanning the cores incurs additional latency, so throughput delay would be twice that of Helix or AX8. Maybe Fractal will switch to TI DSPs (or a combination of TI DSPs and FPGAs) for the AxeFX III? I have no idea.

Thanks for the info guys- Next time DI, please forgo the "bean-counters" and naysayers, and use the best and fastest screamin @ssed thing available (think Vetta in the now) for Helix-2. If you make it, we will come.

As with everything, it follows the law of diminishing returns. There's no point in charging another $1000 for chips that might be—in practice—another 20% faster, and then only for those users who push their presets to the DSP limit anyway. As of this writing, I can't think of a single instance where someone maintained Helix was underpowered after understanding how the two paths/DSPs and dynamic DSP allocation work.

I guess that DI is eager to tell us what the new firmware update will deliver to us... but he's gonna respect the NDA he signed no matter what...

I'll admit we were more transparent when there wasn't another company paying close attention to everything we do and say (not Fractal or Kemper).

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I'll admit we were more transparent when there wasn't another company paying close attention to everything we do and say (not Fractal or Kemper).

I assume it starts, and ends with the letter "H" lol.

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Meris' Mercury 7 is the one to beat these days. The thing is sick. Also made by ex-Line 6ers.

 

Big Sky, TimeLine and Mobius sound just gorgeous. In fact, I'll go so far as to say you have not really heard reverb until you have used a BigSky. It's that good IMO. 

 

I think Source Audio Ventris Reverb is going to blow all of those away, and will be killller in a stereo fx loop with my Helix... Dual DSP for preset spillover. I'll just stop right there :) 

(I've already got their Nemesis delay, and it's quite good, but not dual DSP and no preset spillover..)

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I'm more excited to see the new Toys, new Features, Enhancements, and Improvements than the new Amp models.

 

Yep, I'm guessing that's what is actually taking the time.  Tidying up what's there to be optimal while likely providing new things too.  File management is my constant stumbling block.  The only affect I'd like to see is a whammy wah.   The Rockman modules would be nice, but I'm not holding my breath.  Pitch to MIDI would be nice, but hard to beat the TriplePlay.  

 

 

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I think Source Audio Ventris Reverb is going to blow all of those away, and will be killller in a stereo fx loop with my Helix... Dual DSP for preset spillover. I'll just stop right there :) 

(I've already got their Nemesis delay, and it's quite good, but not dual DSP and no preset spillover..)

 

If it's ever actually released... It was announced like a year ago... I'm sure it will be out soon (although they've been saying that since April or something like that).

 

The BigSky does spillover between presets as well. The main thing with the Ventris is that it will allow you to run two reverb engines at the same time, which is cool, I suppose...

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I just can't wait for the updated tuner!! I mean it...OW...SLAP, SLAP...OOOOF...Hey stop hitting me!!! POW...SMASH...Whats wrong with you guys?!?!?! :P :D

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I just can't wait for the updated tuner!! I mean it...OW...SLAP, SLAP...OOOOF...Hey stop hitting me!!! POW...SMASH...Whats wrong with you guys?!?!?! :P :D

LOL!

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